the answer to "WTF is wrong with my boots?"

[turnfarmer]

TLDR, Is it ok to have room just after the instep and into the toe box, if the ankle, heel and early instep are held in place well?

I buy a lot of boots. At least one per year from local boot fitters, and then some online to save money in the quest. They always need a lot of work to try and make them fit, and it seems that I'm in between sizes. I like the performance of going down two sizes, but my feet go numb even when I make room until it's loose. I figure my foot doesn't like being squeezed down 2 sizes in a plastic vice grip of narrow last boots. I like the comfort of going down only one size from measured, but then I can't ski, because my ankles and heels are too loose, even in 96mm last Raptors or Firebird 140, or 97mm Lange and 98mm Salomon or Nordica. I have to add new liners and foam to my ankle, shims and whatnot, and the bigger boots never ski well after that.

I measure 30 mondo, but around my ankle and instep is 28cm. My foot is very thin, up until my toe box where it gets average width. However my instep rises a bit after my ankle, closer to my forefoot, where its almost medium in heigh and I have a medium arch. I have issues, to say the least, and I'm a boot fitters worst nightmare, I have been for 15 years.

I have been trying 28 mondo (2 sizes down) boots with 100mm last (wider than my measured width), and it seems my ankle, heel and instep are held very well, while my forefoot is extremely comfortable. I haven't skied in such a boot, but it feels pretty nice for performance and comfort. The only problem is that the boot fitters don't recommend I do this. Is this OK or should I avoid?

If you have limited ankle dorsiflexion and are not properly balance with the right size heel lift, your heel will always move in the boot. The achilles always wi. Has anyone checked this for you?

[RickySixx]

If you have limited ankle dorsiflexion and are not properly balance with the right size heel lift, your heel will always move in the boot. The achilles always wi. Has anyone checked this for you?

I have above average dorsiflexion, I have had it checked by a few boot fitters.

I can get my heel to stay in place with lots of add ons, but then I feel all those things and don't like how my tendons and bones feel with all that foam or plastic pressing in different spots, it doesn't feel natural. Haven't had a shim in over 5 years.

Is there a highly custom liner, much more custom than Intuition and a bit more even than ZipFit (warmer too)? Foam? I shell fit fine in the boots, it's the liners not fitting me and making everything feel shitty. I have never had a custom spacefoam liner.

[EWG]

I buy a lot of boots. At least one per year from local boot fitters, and then some online to save money in the quest.

I'm reading this to mean you buy at least 2-3 pairs of boot per year. I'm intrigued. May I ask why?

[Caucasian Asian]

Are you looking at only overlap boots? Have you tried a Full Tilt/Dalbello three piece boot?


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[revolutionrock]

My last 3 pairs of ski boots have given me numb/cold toes.
Don’t know if its blood flow related or a nerve issue.

My feets are warm when i remove the boots, but my toes are cold.
It’s like the toes are ”shut off”

I have acording to bootfiters a ”non problem” feets. No need for shell work etc. Skinny feets...

Currently in tecnica cochise 130 with custom footbeds. No difference with standard footbed. When i was younger I never had this issue... (maybe too big ski boots or I am getting old)

[mntlion]

My last 3 pairs of ski boots have given me numb/cold toes.
Don’t know if its blood flow related or a nerve issue.

My feets are warm when i remove the boots, but my toes are cold.
It’s like the toes are ”shut off”

I have acording to bootfiters a ”non problem” feets. No need for shell work etc. Skinny feets...

Currently in tecnica cochise 130 with custom footbeds. No difference with standard footbed. When i was younger I never had this issue... (maybe too big ski boots or I am getting old)

1) do cold toes happen inside as well? wear the boot inside for 30 min? if the toes are cold, its a circulation thing, need more vertical volume near where the warm/cold line is. Maybe less buckle pressure, maybe lower boot board, maybe thinner foot bed?

[gregL]

My last 3 pairs of ski boots have given me numb/cold toes.
Don’t know if its blood flow related or a nerve issue.

My feets are warm when i remove the boots, but my toes are cold.
It’s like the toes are ”shut off”

I have acording to bootfiters a ”non problem” feets. No need for shell work etc. Skinny feets...

Currently in tecnica cochise 130 with custom footbeds. No difference with standard footbed. When i was younger I never had this issue... (maybe too big ski boots or I am getting old)

How skinny are your feet? First guess is you're overbuckling the instep buckle to reduce volume (Cochise is not low volume, especially in the instep), putting pressure on the deep plantar artery which carries most of the blood to your toes. Fix is to find a lower volume shell that you don't have to buckle as tightly for control, not easy if you want a tourable boot with 130-ish stiffness (only real candidate is the Hawx Ultra XTD). Pressure on the metatarsal ridge might also be a contributing factor, which might be solved by creating a deeper depression under the ball of your foot in the footbed and possibly doing some creative posting under the toes.

[turnfarmer]

I have above average dorsiflexion, I have had it checked by a few boot fitters.

I can get my heel to stay in place with lots of add ons, but then I feel all those things and don't like how my tendons and bones feel with all that foam or plastic pressing in different spots, it doesn't feel natural. Haven't had a shim in over 5 years.
Is there a highly custom liner, much more custom than Intuition and a bit more even than ZipFit (warmer too)? Foam? I shell fit fine in the boots, it's the liners not fitting me and making everything feel shitty. I have never had a custom spacefoam liner.

Can't help you with custom foam liners. If you have excessive dorsiflexion do you have a forefoot lift in your boots to keep you from overflexing them?
If you don't, go in small steps a little makes a lot of difference, like 1mm at a time.

[revolutionrock]

1) do cold toes happen inside as well? wear the boot inside for 30 min? if the toes are cold, its a circulation thing, need more vertical volume near where the warm/cold line is. Maybe less buckle pressure, maybe lower boot board, maybe thinner foot bed?

If inside with the boots I can get a tingling sensation in the small toe after awhile, not always (this is just by sitting down on the sofa inside and the feets/toes are very warm when removing the boots)

I do get a slight redness on top of the feets, it does not hurt or feel strage when the boots are on. Looks worse in the picture than it is.

think I will try to grid down the footbed 1 or 2 millimeters. The custom footbeds are as thick as the standard ones.

[mntlion]

yup,

next test:
do you get the same effects with looser toe buckles?
how about toe buckles off?
so why not ski with the toe buckles off/looser?

[GoldenBC]

Best method for increasing rearward support on a Salomon QST pro 130, this one?



Currently running stock liners.

Ideas- I put in a beefy racing spoiler from a plug liner, put it as high up on the liner as I could and that helped a little. Considering trying my intuition luxury liner with them, but they’re packed out as hell. Already planning to add Pulse Proflex, but that shouldn’t help with rearward stiffness.

Can provide more pics. Love the way the boot fits, fine with how it walks, fine with the way it skis besides the rearward support which is useful to have on occasion.

In all honesty , those boots are just mushy garbage. The entire rear of the boot flexes so much. A spoiler or anything just attached to the upper cuff won't do much. A stiff wrap liner would potentially help.

[Supermoon]

Skimmed through a bunch of this thread, but didn't find an answer.

Have Cochise 120's in 27.5. Normally I'm a 28.5, but sized down and then had the big toes punched a bit in order to make it work. When I'm just skiing they work ok, and I don't have any major issues, but when I'm in walk mode it feels like the liners are just a bit too short on my right foot. I feel the end of the liner, but I think there is still room in the shell.

There are 20-25 days on these boots so I don't think a reheat would help. Any good ways to add length to the liner like this?

[californiagrown]

Skimmed through a bunch of this thread, but didn't find an answer.

Have Cochise 120's in 27.5. Normally I'm a 28.5, but sized down and then had the big toes punched a bit in order to make it work. When I'm just skiing they work ok, and I don't have any major issues, but when I'm in walk mode it feels like the liners are just a bit too short on my right foot. I feel the end of the liner, but I think there is still room in the shell.

There are 20-25 days on these boots so I don't think a reheat would help. Any good ways to add length to the liner like this?

I had to reheat the toe of my liner and remold it half way through a season. when i originally baked the powerwrap my toes had been kind of curled up in the toe cap you are supposed to wear. The second time around i stuffed the toecap with a couple extra socks so even if my toes curled, there would be enough room once the liner molded and cooled down.

[mntlion]

Skimmed through a bunch of this thread, but didn't find an answer.

Have Cochise 120's in 27.5. Normally I'm a 28.5, but sized down and then had the big toes punched a bit in order to make it work. When I'm just skiing they work ok, and I don't have any major issues, but when I'm in walk mode it feels like the liners are just a bit too short on my right foot. I feel the end of the liner, but I think there is still room in the shell.

There are 20-25 days on these boots so I don't think a reheat would help. Any good ways to add length to the liner like this?

1) thin, but supportive footbed? (foot collapses when you take a stride/walk)
2) thinner sock
3) did the liner get stretched? heat with hair dryer, push out with end of broom stick where you want more volume made
4) cut open the seem of the liner, between the toe cap and the liner above the toe, and then #3 again

[ak_powder_monkey]

Ski boots are made for skiing, not walking, driving, tap dancing, etc.

I say the atomic backland was made for dancing

[Supermoon]

1) thin, but supportive footbed? (foot collapses when you take a stride/walk)
2) thinner sock
3) did the liner get stretched? heat with hair dryer, push out with end of broom stick where you want more volume made
4) cut open the seem of the liner, between the toe cap and the liner above the toe, and then #3 again

Thanks will try that. Never heated the liners, just skied them in, so broomstick sounds like a good plan.

Already have drop in footbeds that seem to work well and wear thin socks.

[gregL]

I say the atomic backland was made for dancing

Atomic Backland Carbon is pretty good for driving as well, even with a 6-speed manual.

[XavierD]

Skimmed through a bunch of this thread, but didn't find an answer.

Have Cochise 120's in 27.5. Normally I'm a 28.5, but sized down and then had the big toes punched a bit in order to make it work. When I'm just skiing they work ok, and I don't have any major issues, but when I'm in walk mode it feels like the liners are just a bit too short on my right foot. I feel the end of the liner, but I think there is still room in the shell.

There are 20-25 days on these boots so I don't think a reheat would help. Any good ways to add length to the liner like this?

Get the liner stretched/lengthened. Stretch out the material in the toe with a rounded 3/4in - 1in dowel. If this isn’t enough heat up the sole of the liner until you can peel the vinyl covering back. Peel this back a few inches (past the ball of your foot area. Slice open the card sole perpendicular to the length of the boot and then use a hydraulic press to lengthen the liner. Let it sit for a while and then spray adhesive the vinyl cover back on and remove the press.

[swissiphic]

Skimmed through a bunch of this thread, but didn't find an answer.

Have Cochise 120's in 27.5. Normally I'm a 28.5, but sized down and then had the big toes punched a bit in order to make it work. When I'm just skiing they work ok, and I don't have any major issues, but when I'm in walk mode it feels like the liners are just a bit too short on my right foot. I feel the end of the liner, but I think there is still room in the shell.

There are 20-25 days on these boots so I don't think a reheat would help. Any good ways to add length to the liner like this?

Don't do this. Failed experiment...well, not experiment, rather; absolutely necessary emergency liner toebox amputation in the middle of a long ski tour day. Length is improved but toes get cold. Too lazy to do the proper fix via trimmed strips of extra intuition foam to fill the gap and glue gun it all together again, so the toes are just gonna have to deal with it for now.

[Supermoon]

^^ seems legit....

[revolutionrock]

yup,

next test:
do you get the same effects with looser toe buckles?
how about toe buckles off?
so why not ski with the toe buckles off/looser?

Usually I don't buckle the two lower buckles, but I still get the numb cold/feeling.

I dont feel any pressure on top of the foot, just get some redness.
Dont know if by grinding off the footbeds by 2-3mm is going to do any difference, but will give it a chance.

[mntlion]

numb/cold = lack of blood flow.

red points = pressure

pressure = lack of blood flow.


maybe just try without any footbed for a few runs, yes the lack of support will suck, but see how the other problems are?

[jhyatt]

The scarpa intuition liner on my f1 meet in front with the laces all the way tight and I want it tighter. Yes I have skinny calves. Is there some sort of foam I could stick in the inside of the liner behind my calf to make up space? I should get a wrap liner, but these are comfy except for the slop inside on the up. Maybe tuck my long underwear into my boot?

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[mntlion]

The scarpa intuition liner on my f1 meet in front with the laces all the way tight and I want it tighter. Yes I have skinny calves. Is there some sort of foam I could stick in the inside of the liner behind my calf to make up space? I should get a wrap liner, but these are comfy except for the slop inside on the up. Maybe tuck my long underwear into my boot?

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1). Eliminator tongues are your new best friend

2). Or remove tongue from old/dead liner

3). Cheese burgers and calf raises

4). Try to catch the rustlers


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[jhyatt]

Thanks. . Eliminator tongues go on the sock side, right? Do they affect forward flex during uphill?
Is there anything like that for behind the calf that would stick on inside the liner? So I could get a bit more forward lean, rather than less?
I am going to order a pair anyway just to try them. cheap experiment

1). Eliminator tongues are your new best friend

2). Or remove tongue from old/dead liner

3). Cheese burgers and calf raises

4). Try to catch the rustlers


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