the answer to "WTF is wrong with my boots?"

[Self Jupiter]

^same

[gregL]

Question for Mtn Lion, Greg, or anyone else in the know. Presently in 2015 salomon xmax 120. Was looking at the salomon s/max 1947 with a 120 flex. I have a low volume foot and have been happy with my current boots. How does the flex and volume compare? Was looking at the sizing chart and it says 25.5 is a mens 7. My xmax are 25.5 and I am a size 9 shoe. Is this worth checking out?

Essentially the same fit but 1mm taller in the instep, don't pay attention to anyone's conversion chart, just get the 25.5 if you are happy with it.
Killer deal, actually the 1947 (year Salomon was founded) is an SMU (special order) with unique colorway and buckles, very cool boot.

[gregL]

Which conversion chart are you using?

As you probably know, all such charts are "approximate" as ski boots are only made in Mondopoint sizes and there are no "even" sizes, only 25.5, 26.5, etc. evo's chart actually says a "comfort fit" 25.5 is a 7.5 US Men's but they list a "Performance" fit as well which is one Mondopoint size smaller.

FWIW, lots of people wear their street shoes rather loose - my daily shoes are 10.5 and I wear a 26.5 but have in the past worn 25.5. If you want a more accurate assessment of your size, check out the scanner app in the thread further on in Tech Talk, and post your images there.

[Lostintime]

Everybody, thanks for the quick responses. Just wanted to make sure nothing had changed in their sizing.

[AZskibum]

1) arch pain: does it happen without any footbed? or with other footbeds?

2) Toe height: can you thin out the footbed, or the boot board in that area? Also you can cut a footbed and make it 3/4 length. Same support under arch, but more toe wiggle room

Great info, thank you. I'll mention these things when I see the fitter again Thursday.

[93xs2003]

I've got a pair of Tecnica R9.8's. I'd like to soften the flex by lowering the V-notches on either side behind the cuffs.

If I drill out the cuff pivot rivets, can someone 'in the know' recommend a suitable replacement pivot screw? The cant adjusters are 24 mm diameter.

[mntlion]

I've got a pair of Tecnica R9.8's. I'd like to soften the flex by lowering the V-notches on either side behind the cuffs.

If I drill out the cuff pivot rivets, can someone 'in the know' recommend a suitable replacement pivot screw? The cant adjusters are 24 mm diameter.

dont the side cuffs just unscrew?

go see your local technica/nordica dealer (or anyone that sells more racy stuff) should have something in a bin

[jorion]

Any tips for addressing hot spots/neuroma with metatarsal pads? I read through Riff's experience elsewhere in this thread and that's what gave me the idea. I'm just not sure what exact zone I'm trying to support to relieve the nerve pressure, or if there is a certain brand of pad that works better than others.

Basically, I never have hot spots/neuroma in street, running, cycling or hiking shoes, but it's been a thing on my right foot in pretty much every touring boot I've had. I got new boots and custom orthotics (from Buck at Olympic Bootworks) this fall and have around 25 days in them. The fit is really fantastic otherwise (and Zero G Tour Pros are not a natural match for my feet) and I'm loathe to have them punched anymore since they don't feel overly tight, hence experimenting with padding. I'm bugging Buck as well, but I live far away and going in there is inconvenient, even without the pandemic.

The orthotics are completely flat in front of the arch zone. If I'm sidehilling in the direction that puts most of my weight on my big toe I get relief. Change directions and it's the worst. (Last June on Shasta I tried to only sidehill with my left leg uphill so that my right big toe was weighted, and that doesn't really work!)

At the end of six- to eight-hour days the burning pain under the third and fourth toe area of my right foot is pretty severe. Mainly an issue walking; I don't notice it skiing. But I only tour, so I walk a lot. I've almost only been in powder this year, but in past springs side-hilling firm conditions has been very painful. If I'm sidehilling in the direction that puts pressure on my big toe I get relief. Change directions and it's the worst. (Last June on Shasta I tried to only sidehill with my left leg uphill, which doesn't really work long-term!)

The other day post-skiing, my foot still hurt badly for 30 minutes or so after taking my boots off. It even was a little sore the next day when I was not skiing. It's not ruining my days or anything, but I will have some long-ass days come spring (12-18 hours) and I don't know if that will work without fixing this issue.

So any advice or do I just need to futz around a bunch with padding?

[mntlion]

Any tips for addressing hot spots/neuroma with metatarsal pads? I read through Riff's experience elsewhere in this thread and that's what gave me the idea. I'm just not sure what exact zone I'm trying to support to relieve the nerve pressure, or if there is a certain brand of pad that works better than others.

Basically, I never have hot spots/neuroma in street, running, cycling or hiking shoes, but it's been a thing on my right foot in pretty much every touring boot I've had. I got new boots and custom orthotics (from Buck at Olympic Bootworks) this fall and have around 25 days in them. The fit is really fantastic otherwise (and Zero G Tour Pros are not a natural match for my feet) and I'm loathe to have them punched anymore since they don't feel overly tight, hence experimenting with padding. I'm bugging Buck as well, but I live far away and going in there is inconvenient, even without the pandemic.

The orthotics are completely flat in front of the arch zone. If I'm sidehilling in the direction that puts most of my weight on my big toe I get relief. Change directions and it's the worst. (Last June on Shasta I tried to only sidehill with my left leg uphill so that my right big toe was weighted, and that doesn't really work!)

At the end of six- to eight-hour days the burning pain under the third and fourth toe area of my right foot is pretty severe. Mainly an issue walking; I don't notice it skiing. But I only tour, so I walk a lot. I've almost only been in powder this year, but in past springs side-hilling firm conditions has been very painful. If I'm sidehilling in the direction that puts pressure on my big toe I get relief. Change directions and it's the worst. (Last June on Shasta I tried to only sidehill with my left leg uphill, which doesn't really work long-term!)

The other day post-skiing, my foot still hurt badly for 30 minutes or so after taking my boots off. It even was a little sore the next day when I was not skiing. It's not ruining my days or anything, but I will have some long-ass days come spring (12-18 hours) and I don't know if that will work without fixing this issue.

So any advice or do I just need to futz around a bunch with padding?

Do you think its more a width issue. or a footbed issue?

softening/lowering the lateral arch might help? or grinding a small pocket for that last toe bone to rest in?

try it with a flat generic footbed and see if its BOW? and without any footbed (will increase the vertical volume)

[bonewrenched]

Anyone here put pro tour liners in backlands? Just stuffed some in, and when I flex the boot in walk mode the hinged Achilles plate snags on the liner cuff when rotating back. Seems like it will tear that seam up quick.

Was thinking of trimming the plate. Thoughts?

[ntblanks]

Anyone here put pro tour liners in backlands? Just stuffed some in, and when I flex the boot in walk mode the hinged Achilles plate snags on the liner cuff when rotating back. Seems like it will tear that seam up quick.

Was thinking of trimming the plate. Thoughts?

maybe try a combo of gaffers tape and food-grade silicone or teflon spray (on the back of the liner). less invasive than making cuts and no damage done if it doesn't work.

[mn_teleswede]

maybe try a combo of gaffers tape and food-grade silicone or teflon spray (on the back of the liner). less invasive than making cuts and no damage done if it doesn't work.

This^ I have used Duct Tape with great success over the years.

[eggsbenedict]

Hi thread, long time reader, first time poster.

Spent the first 30 years of my ski career being fitted by disinterested local fitters, until the last two years where I've been fed up with the pain from being consistently put in boots that result in a ton of pain (just generic aching, no pressure points or anything), and started trying to figure things out for myself. Grabbed some XTD Ultra 130s early last season and they've been a dream both comfort and performance wise, to the point where I'm for the first time reaching the limitations of the boot itself, not constrained by the poor fit. I'm assuming there has been a ton of luck involved in me actually finding a magical fit, and hoping someone can give me some pointers on why this boot fits my feet so well, and what I could look for in subsequent boot purchases.

I measure 275mm or so in length, 98-100mm width, and 290-300mm instep (depending on what I consider "back of heel"). With the stock (pre-mimic) liners from the size 27/27.5 XTD, My foot is super snug and comfy with just the right amount of toe room in the bottom, heel hold is fine/good but there's quite a lot of room in the calf. I end up needing to buckle the top 2 buckles on tightest or second tightest (seemingly dependant on temperature) latch to feel secure when skiing in chop, but it doesn't really feel like it's cradling my leg in quite the correct way. I plan on experimenting with some foam on the tongue at some point. The bottom two buckles remain loose, I completely destroy blood flow without any added feeling of increased snugness/control. They tend to come undone since there is no tension and I don't notice at all when that happens, foot still feels secure down there.

Any thoughts on how I should approach hunting for some burlier alpine boots? Or just boots in general. Lots of mentions of Atomic Ultras being a "low volume" boot, while my instep measurement seems to indicate I have a fairly high volume foot. So I have no idea what is going on and how I should move forward, any tips would be appreciated. Asking anyone local for help results in a "so your feet don't hurt? what's the issue then?" attitude.

Feels good to finally be hunting around for better performance rather than trying to fit a way to not be unable to carry a conversation in a lift line because my feet ache so bad.

[mntlion]

1) so you are happy with the fit of your touring boots, and just looking for alpine? I would start with atomic alpine and see how that goes?

2) if you need to fill up volume on the calf, eliminator tongue should help

[eggsbenedict]

Yup, that will be my first move barring any other info coming to light. "I have an Atomic foot" seems to be a frowned upon way of thinking in several sources though, so having some idea as to why my foot likes the XTD would be useful/interesting when it "shouldn't" be compatible.

Thanks, I'll grab an eliminator tongue and try it out.

[turnfarmer]

Of the 98mm boots the Atomic Ultra has the most instep room ime. Lange and tecnica are close. Atomic has more volume on the lateral side of the foot compared to Tecnica and Lange. So if you have an abducted forefoot the Atomic will be more comfortable.

[bonewrenched]

maybe try a combo of gaffers tape and food-grade silicone or teflon spray (on the back of the liner). less invasive than making cuts and no damage done if it doesn't work.

Thanks, I can see that working well - I'll have to pick up some gaffers tape.

I slept on it and wanted to try one thing before I potentially gunk up the liner (I've had poor experiences with tape), so I found a bit of low friction plastic sheet and stuck it on with some vhb. It solves the problem but I'll find out next tour if it holds up.

[fleaches]

At the end of six- to eight-hour days the burning pain under the third and fourth toe area of my right foot is pretty severe. Mainly an issue walking; I don't notice it skiing. But I only tour, so I walk a lot. I've almost only been in powder this year, but in past springs side-hilling firm conditions has been very painful. If I'm sidehilling in the direction that puts pressure on my big toe I get relief. Change directions and it's the worst. (Last June on Shasta I tried to only sidehill with my left leg uphill, which doesn't really work long-term!)

I have been having really similar issues this year. Only walking in ski boots, not so much skiing and never in normal shoes. I was told they can shape the front of the foot bed a little bit to try to support the met heads better, but haven't gotten this done yet. Curious what ends up working (and I'll report back if I find anything).



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[turnfarmer]

Thanks, I can see that working well - I'll have to pick up some gaffers tape.

I slept on it and wanted to try one thing before I potentially gunk up the liner (I've had poor experiences with tape), so I found a bit of low friction plastic sheet and stuck it on with some vhb. It solves the problem but I'll find out next tour if it holds up.

That low friction plastics hard to bond. If it fails you might want to by some slick strips that comes with a double side tape bonded to it.

[bonewrenched]

That low friction plastics hard to bond. If it fails you might want to by some slick strips that comes with a double side tape bonded to it.

Awesome I'll take a look for those, thanks

[Mustonen]

The volume in the S/Pro is huge by comparison, I would be inclined not to go there. The bootboard on the S/Max is quite thick, try grinding a millimeter off at a time to increase volume, and/or doing another heat mold at the high end of the time range (10 minutes with cold oven).

You might be surprised.

Reducing pressure over the cuneiforms (deep plantar artery is just underneath and carries all the blood to your toes) can seriously increase warmth. Also, a proper Hotronics install doesn't require more volume anywhere except in back of your boot cuff (I would suggest Therm-ic which seem to work just as well and have a much smaller battery pack).

Besides, don't you already own the S/Max?

I used to ski the Ghosts and loved them. I’ve tried the Smax, but like the Hawx Ultra better. If you want the ultimate fit, wait for the Hawx 130 Professional next year.

So, I ended up buying a pair of Hawx Ultra 130 S. After a home molding the fit was pretty dialed, but after skiing them a few times I miss the performance of the s/max. Not as precise, not as powerful... felt slightly vague when flexed, especially in choppy/heavy snow. Maybe the changes next year would address this....

So, I ground the boot board and I cooked them again. Taped foam to my instep and between my toes. Full bake. Wore them for a while after I was finished forming and cooling and my feet hurt, but the forming process is pretty stressful to my feet, I imagine, so not drawing conclusions yet.

Optimistic...

[gregL]

So, I ground the boot board and I cooked them again. Taped foam to my instep and between my toes. Full bake.

Hopefully you did the bake and cool first, then the bootboard grind?

[Mustonen]

Hopefully you did the bake and cool first, then the bootboard grind?

Did the grind first. Took off approx a mm. Skied them. Still hurt. Put them on the shelf and gave the Hawx a go. Missed the control of the S/Max. Baked and cooled. And here we are.

I’ll plan to ski them, and pending results I might take off another mm or two. If I still haven’t gotten to where I want I’ll probably suck it up and plan a boot fitter visit around my next ski trip next season.

[gregL]

I measure 275mm or so in length, 98-100mm width, and 290-300mm instep (depending on what I consider "back of heel"). With the stock (pre-mimic) liners from the size 27/27.5 XTD, My foot is super snug and comfy with just the right amount of toe room in the bottom, heel hold is fine/good but there's quite a lot of room in the calf. I end up needing to buckle the top 2 buckles on tightest or second tightest (seemingly dependant on temperature) latch to feel secure when skiing in chop, but it doesn't really feel like it's cradling my leg in quite the correct way. I plan on experimenting with some foam on the tongue at some point. The bottom two buckles remain loose, I completely destroy blood flow without any added feeling of increased snugness/control. They tend to come undone since there is no tension and I don't notice at all when that happens, foot still feels secure down there.

Any thoughts on how I should approach hunting for some burlier alpine boots? Or just boots in general. Lots of mentions of Atomic Ultras being a "low volume" boot, while my instep measurement seems to indicate I have a fairly high volume foot. So I have no idea what is going on and how I should move forward, any tips would be appreciated. Asking anyone local for help results in a "so your feet don't hurt? what's the issue then?" attitude.

You might try the Verifyt scanner app (thread somewhere in Tech Talk) so we can get a more accurate measure and 3D views of your feet. If you do it, it helps me if you post front, left side and right side screenshots of your feet.

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...ot-Scanner-App

The Hawx Ultra isn't really that low volume, it's just the lowest volume Hawx - no one else's "low volume" boot is really all that low volume either these days, if they were I couldn't get my 117mm wide feet into them (and I have tried/own most of them).

[gregL]

. . . I might take off another mm or two. If I still haven’t gotten to where I want I’ll probably suck it up and plan a boot fitter visit around my next ski trip next season.

You can grind off way more than that, the S/Max bootboard is a thick mofo. If necessary I've cut the heel and toe apart and double stick-taped them back in place (or hot glue) so they don't slide. In severe cases I've been known to remove the front part of the bootboard completely, though it messes with the ramp (if you need this, you're happy just to not have your instep crushed and can deal with the ramp issue).

You can also cut out the elastic and vinyl on the top of the liner, grind footbed thinner, etc.