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  1. #1
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    Vaccinations and autism?

    The more they stick my kids, the more nervous I become.

    I understand that the fear is a bit irrational, but I guess that's parenthood.

    The playground is filled with a lot of earthy types who have me a bit rattled.

    Thoughts?
    Charlie, here comes the deuce. And when you speak of me, speak well.

  2. #2
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    Not terribly well versed myself, but my dad is a paediatrician and he's skeptical of that association.

    edit for spacing
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  3. #3
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    Worried about that too. We opted out of many of the immunizations. I've met a few people who have NEVER had an immunization their whole life and are just fine.

  4. #4
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    statistical association with autism, if present at all, is very low. association with developing other diseases from not vaccinating is somewhat higher.

  5. #5
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    My mom is an early intervention speech pathologist who specializes in autism. VACCINATIONS DO NOT CAUSE AUTISM!!! VACCINATE YOUR MOTHERFUCKING KIDS!!!!

    Unvaccinated people running around in society = incubation containers for new forms of diseases that we thought we had eradicated. If you do not vaccinate your fucking kids, not only do you deserve a swift kick in the balls for the disservice that you are doing them, but you deserve one from everyone else in society for running a walking epidemiology experiment to see if you can create some sort of awful super-measles.

  6. #6
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    It comes down to the insane amount of mercury in those vaccines. The levels of mercury far exceed limits set by the FDA and the EPA. Their little bodies shouldn't be exposed to such high levels. The levels of mercury that they are exposed to are higher than what the FDA says a full grown adult male should injest.

    Vaccinations also help promote new strains of germs that become resilient to current immunizations. YOU CAN RECEIVE immunizations later in life when your body is a little more developed and better capable of handling them. Shit, when I get a shot I can feel it effect me the rest of the day and I'm 6'2" 190lbs. Imagine what my little guy has to go through at 28" and only 20lbs.
    Last edited by AsheanMT; 06-20-2008 at 09:58 AM.

  7. #7
    Hugh Conway Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Sirshredalot View Post
    Unvaccinated people running around in society = incubation containers for new forms of diseases that we thought we had eradicated. If you do not vaccinate your fucking kids, not only do you deserve a swift kick in the balls for the disservice that you are doing them, but you deserve one from everyone else in society for running a walking epidemiology experiment to see if you can create some sort of awful super-measles.
    Nonsense. Measles, Mumps, Rubella - these are just trifling ailments.

    Going to the hospital with a feverish child to hear "he has polio" wouldn't be a big deal /sarcasm

  8. #8
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    Meh. Been bombarded by that philosophy, but there have been some nasty consequences like the rise in rates of whooping cough, chicken pox, etc brought about by noninoculators.

    So, after some debate we inoculated the pink things because we felt that the likelihood of some of these bad diseases is greater than that of Autism.

    It is weird how much autism rates are up. Maybe it's the new ADD or whatever the latest fashionable hypochondria. My feeling is that our society hasn't taken the time to give the little things the time, contact and quiet they need. But what the fuck do I know.

    They made be the wrong reasons, but thems the ones I used.
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  9. #9
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    Folks have blamed it on the MMR and have even linked it to the dioxins in disposable diapers, but the bottom line is that they have no clue why there has been such a massive increase in the autism numbers.

  10. #10
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    Many of the vaccines these days are Thimerosal-free (the source of the Hg). Check out the below link if you are interested in which ones still contain mercury:

    http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-table.htm
    "Go Balls Deep!"

  11. #11
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    It's a struggle i'm in at the moment as well. I'm all for vaccinations... I do wonder though if we should pursue a slowed down schedule. There are 2 specific ones I'll be asking our Dr. about at length..

    1. The Hep B shot given at the hospital. As long as mom and dad are Hep B free.. what's the point. This seems an awfully young time to be given a pretty serious shot, that isn't always even suggested to healthy adults traveling to areas they could get exposed. In this case I'm going to ask if they can hold off on that shot for a month or so.

    2. The MMR is less of an issue, but some Drs suggest splitting them up into 3 equal shots. Perhaps I'm just not a fan of a one shot to rule them all philosophy. So.. we may see if our practice can spread out those three.

    I guess none of that has anything to do with Autism... just seems like a smoother potential path for the little one, although it does mean more shots over the course of a few years.

  12. #12
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    Thimerosal free vaccinations that have been used for over five years only have a trace amount of mercury. AsheanMT, what you are saying may have been true in 2001, but it is not the case today.

    To those who choose not to vaccinate. Yes, you may know somebody that is without all vaccinations and is doing fine today. Tomorrow they could have Polio.

    Check the time magazine cover story from a few weeks ago.
    http://www.time.com/time/health/arti...808438,00.html

    Pockets of intentionally unvaccinated children provide a perfect place for a disease to squat, leading to outbreaks that spread to other unprotected kids, infants and the elderly. Ongoing measles outbreaks in four states are centered in such communities; one originated with an unimmunized boy from San Diego who contracted the virus while traveling in Europe—where the bug was thriving among intentionally unimmunized people in Switzerland.
    There's only one law ya can't break .......embarrassing a cop in public.

  13. #13
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    We have done almost all of the vaccinations recommended by our pediatrician, but we asked questions about each one and read about it and made an at least somewhat informed choice. We delayed several vaccinations until he was bigger, and only did one vaccination per visit. I refused to let them stick him with the Hep B shot at the hospital.

    The increase in autism is scary, but from what I've read there does not seem to be any proven causal connection, just correlation.

  14. #14
    Craven Morehead Guest
    Medicine fights nature tooth and nail. However, when we ALL suffer from overpopulation,are disease riddled, saturated with drugs, genetically neutered, and the elderly suck up all our resources, we might question the wisdom of medicine.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by AsheanMT View Post
    Worried about that too. We opted out of many of the immunizations. I've met a few people who have NEVER had an immunization their whole life and are just fine.
    What vaccinations did you end up getting for the little guy? With our kiddo due in Nov. we are currently deciding which ones are important and which ones can be skipped (chicken pox = no go for sure). I think our plan may be just to go with the ones we got as kids and skip all the fancy new ones.
    ‎"Powder snow skiing is not fun. It's life, fully lived, life lived in a blaze of reality." -Dolores LaChapelle

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hutch View Post
    We have done almost all of the vaccinations recommended by our pediatrician, but we asked questions about each one and read about it and made an at least somewhat informed choice. We delayed several vaccinations until he was bigger, and only did one vaccination per visit. I refused to let them stick him with the Hep B shot at the hospital.

    The increase in autism is scary, but from what I've read there does not seem to be any proven causal connection, just correlation.
    One reason for the spike in numbers is that they have gotten much better at diagnosing Autism (btw, there are apparently a bunch of forms of it), so cases that went undiagnosed previously are now added to the numbers.

    My dad also says that these new diagnoses are accurate, not like the trend years ago of declaring some kids who were "just fucking stupid", as he delicately put it, Dyslexic. Or the trend of diagnosing "just fucking hyper" kids with ADD.
    No Roger, No Rerun, No Rent

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by bumpskier View Post
    . I think our plan may be just to go with the ones we got as kids and skip all the fancy new ones.
    That is essentially what we did. No HEP B no chix pox. I believe there was another one that we were asked about at the hospital and were told that we had to sign a waiver in order to keep him from getting the vaccine. I found it very peculiar that the HAD to ask us if they could give that specific shot so we decided against it. ( I can't remember what it was due to the fact that he was in the NICU for a week and I was averaging about 1 hour of sleep for every 20 or so that I was awake, I'll ask Ash when she gets home.)

  18. #18
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    Autism is up for a number of reasons, but not because of vaccinations. Do vaccinate your kids against all the majors. Just because you don't know anybody with polio doesn't mean we can't see it again. I do know someone with polio, one of the last significant episodes in California 50+ years ago. It is a scary as fuck disease, and we will see it again.

    Sit down with your Ped. and discuss vaccinations and options. They are still the single best source of information about your kids health. Certainly better then all the dentists here at TGR. Your kids certainly don't need every vaccine ever invented. but a lot of them are scary important.

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldLarry View Post
    One reason for the spike in numbers is that they have gotten much better at diagnosing Autism (btw, there are apparently a bunch of forms of it), so cases that went undiagnosed previously are now added to the numbers.
    That is a Bingo

  20. #20
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    Exclamation

    Quote Originally Posted by AsheanMT View Post
    It comes down to the insane amount of mercury in those vaccines. The levels of mercury far exceed limits set by the FDA and the EPA. Their little bodies shouldn't be exposed to such high levels. The levels of mercury that they are exposed to are higher than what the FDA says a full grown adult male should injest.

    Vaccinations also help promote new strains of germs that become resilient to current immunizations. YOU CAN RECEIVE immunizations later in life when your body is a little more developed and better capable of handling them. Shit, when I get a shot I can feel it effect me the rest of the day and I'm 6'2" 190lbs. Imagine what my little guy has to go through at 28" and only 20lbs.
    no offense dude, but your information is outdated and you also don't understand how vaccines work.

    thiomersal (the source of mercury) is no longer used as a preservative in vaccines and even when it was used for years and years, it was riskier to leave it out of vaccines than it was to put it in. thankfully technology has made thiomersal obsolete.

    vaccines are attenuated versions of the "full-strength" bug used to elicit a primary immune response via presentation of antigens so that the next time one is exposed to the bug, no matter what, the body's immune system recognizes the antigen presented and kicks its' ass.

    yes, you can receive those vaccines later in life when your immune system is more robust, but the reason they urge people to immunize children is because childrens' immune systems are too weak to fight off the very illnesses they encourage people to vaccinate against! fuckin' duh, homie.

    anyway, you're supposed to feel slightly under the weather after any vaccination because whenever your immune system detects an invader (attenuated or full-strength), your body alters the environment these bugs are in to aid the immune system in fighting it off. after a vaccine you or your child may feel slightly under the weather, but it sure as hell beats suffering full-blown symptoms or watching your child suffer those full-blown symptoms.

    i'm not trying to tell you what to do as a parent because YOU are the parent, but i strongly encourage you to do your homework or speak to your pediatrician. believe it or not, by and large, they have your child's best interest at heart. they wouldn't have chosen their particular field of medicine if they didn't.

    note: i am not a doctor, but i have some education in this arena and i am sick to death of this vaccine/autism hysteria.
    Balls Deep in the 'Ho

  21. #21
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    Lots of good answers + Im' not fluent enough... I'll just say :
    As a dad and from having a stepmother who's a psychiatrist and psychoanalyst, specialized in kids (and autist kids) : Vaccinate. VACCINATE. No question about it. The odds of a nasty disease are far greater that the odds of becoming autist trough vaccination. Whose association with autism is disputed, at best.
    In the current state of medicine, to not vaccine your kids would be pure luddism.
    Last edited by philippeR; 06-20-2008 at 12:50 PM. Reason: Spelling
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by AsheanMT View Post
    I've met a few people who have NEVER had an immunization their whole life and are just fine.
    Specious argument, IMO. There are also 100 year olds out there who have smoked their entire lives.

  23. #23
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    As was previously alluded to above, if you're concerned, you can educate yourself on all the vaccinations and options and go the route you're must comfortable with. Read the documentation that comes w/ the vaccines. Read a couple books about it. Your pediatrician should be open to your concerns and informative about this stuff, especially w/ all the hysteria in the media.

    While it's correct to say that vaccinations = good, and that if society stops vaccinating we're asking for some nasty epidemics, it is also important to recognize the bureaucracy and inefficiency of many of the oversight organizations. If you're going to be intellectually lazy about it, however, go with what your doctor recommends.

    For our kids, we had some split up, we ordered a couple alternative formulations, and we delayed a few. edit: this was something we worked out with our pediatrician's guidance. I don't mean to imply that reading some books and documentation equals up to an M.D. I am amused by the "doctor always knows best" sentiments, however.
    Last edited by focus; 06-20-2008 at 12:09 PM.

  24. #24
    Hugh Conway Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by focus View Post
    As was previously alluded to above, if you're concerned, you can educate yourself on all the vaccinations and options and go the route you're must comfortable with. Read the documentation that comes w/ the vaccines. Read a couple books about it. Your pediatrician should be open to your concerns and informative about this stuff, especially w/ all the hysteria in the media.

    While it's correct to say that vaccinations = good, and that if society stops vaccinating we're asking for some nasty epidemics, it is also important to recognize the bureaucracy and inefficiency of many of the oversight organizations. If you're going to be intellectually lazy about it, however, go with what your doctor recommends.

    For our kids, we had some split up, we ordered a couple alternative formulations, and we delayed a few.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post


    edit to go with: You're a fucking idiot, hugh.
    Last edited by focus; 06-20-2008 at 12:17 PM.

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