$425k for 3k sq ft in Killington, complete with "fire pole" and shag carpets--bring your own talent and cameras:
https://www.boston.com/real-estate/h...e-swing-sauna/
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$425k for 3k sq ft in Killington, complete with "fire pole" and shag carpets--bring your own talent and cameras:
https://www.boston.com/real-estate/h...e-swing-sauna/
As has been repeated in this thread many times - Boomers aren't moving out of their 4-5 bdrm, 3,500-5,000 sq. ft homes.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/16/econo...ies/index.html
Although my in-laws are putting their 5 bdrm, 4k sq. ft CT home on the market beginning of next month and moving to tax friendly DE.
Parents sold and downsized several years ago. Just my aunt and uncle here in Bend the lone holdouts that went big and their 5k sq ft. home, but the views of the Central Cascades are to die for.
Quote:
Meanwhile, Baby Boomers are staying in their larger homes for longer, preferring to age in place and stay active in a neighborhood that’s familiar to them. And even if they sold, where would they go? There is a shortage of smaller homes in those neighborhoods.
As a result, empty-nest Baby Boomers own 28% of large homes — and Milliennials with kids own just 14%, according to a Redfin analysis released Tuesday. Gen Z families own just 0.3% of homes with three bedrooms or more.
“Boomers love their homes. Even if they did want to sell, it is now prohibitively expensive for many Millennials,” said Sheharyar Bokhari, senior economist at Redfin, who did the analysis, to CNN. “These are larger homes where there are only one or two people living there and, typically, they bought it a while ago, so it has value.”
This supposed issue of boomers aging in place in homes to large for their current household size seems like putting the cart before the horse.
I think the world would be better served just getting off the pot and building more housing to start, then maybe shift to maximizing carrying capacity.
Besides almost all of them have leveraged that house in some way shape or form so they aint selling regardless.
I agree, but it would interesting to see if new home construction would be faster than the great Boomer homeowner die off.Quote:
Originally Posted by AdironRider
FIFYQuote:
Originally Posted by AdironRider
So you’re relying on a realtor, to bring their buyer clients, to buy the house they listed!? Seems dubious.Quote:
Originally Posted by AdironRider
Does anyone even really use their realtor to steer them into houses anymore? We bought in 18 and 21 and both times we found the house looking at Zillow or Redfin, then the realtor just got a showing setup. Most of the time we saw all the houses they were pushing us before they sent the email.
What could a realtor do that would out market the promotion listing with Redfin gives you? Redfin listings are more likely to be deemed a “hot home” and they get priority listing / pushed to any users of the app.
So I'm cruising the web drinking coffee and a say, "hey, that's not a bad price for a rental"...oops that's per night not per month. https://rockies.craigslist.org/apa/d...710583165.html
Anecdotally, more and more 2nd homeowners that actually use their houses in my neighborhood are STRing when they are not there.
Looks like mom's home is selling for an all time high in her project. Cash offer over asking price with a 10 day close. The other 7 offers are likely pissed today. I guess the market under $600k is still really strong in CA, even if it is the Inland Empire.
Dang, that place wasn't exactly super luxe, either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles
Just like sellers have their own motivations, so do STR owners. Some will rent a place for any price as long as they can keep the cash register humming along. This one seems like the owners will rent it if someone will pay their high price, but are happy to not have the wear and tear if not.
But "knotty alder cabinets"!!Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenboy
:D
I think that's right. Plenty of people manage their place with a price floor. As the weekend comes, if the weather looks questionable, the price drops.Quote:
Just like sellers have their own motivations, so do STR owners.
Around here, your neighbor is your business competitor. Friendly dog walk one minute that back to the computer to adjust the pricing.
There are definitely plenty of STR in Big Sky that are priced very high to only capture top demand. Places do sit vacant most of the time. They will take the money if it's a $/night they can't refuse but aren't trying to have it rented all the time to keep down on the wear. They can still jump on a flight short notice and their condo is probably available.
“Palm Springs capped Airbnb rentals. Now some home prices are in free-fall
Palm Springs curbed short-term rentals in some neighborhoods. Now homeowners are watching their property values drop, sometimes drastically.”
LA-Times
Does capping STRs in resort towns reduce the cost of housing? Results in Palm Springs say yes. Poor YouTuber’s $1.5 mil property is now worth only a mil.
https://archive.fo/2024.01.23-132301...e-in-free-fall
not where I liveQuote:
Originally Posted by Flounder
don't see it
but the fantasy of all these local politicians who haven't really worked a day in their life seem to think regulations will bring down values so we can finally create the locals only utopia filled with bars restaurants ski lifts and a quaint downtown all without those pesky tourists
People love to say no but really their is little financial incentive to LTR. Plenty of renters I know have had their LTRs converted to STRs and now have to compete for a smaller pool of LTRs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flounder
This, in my opinion, is a big reason why all the mountain towns are all about the subsidized housing model. They want to have their cake and eat it too. Buoy real estate prices, pack it the tourists (wallets), keep wages low, maintain the veneer of happiness and generate tax revenue but externalize the costs of keeping it all going on life support.
STR caps make me rock hard.
A STR cap if you already have a STR license = profit, no?
It will be interesting to see how Crested Butte's new regulations play out, in terms of the "block face" cap. If you're selling a home on a block with no current STR's, you're stoked. If there are already too many STR's on the block face, the buyer will have to wait for a license.
I still like Winter Park's program of paying STR's to convert to LTR. I'm pretty sure the math works a lot better than trying to build. Maybe Foggy disagrees though
My town capped STRs early on, I have to say I love it. I'm glad they were doing this before STRs were a big deal, and they enforce the requirements too.
Will fewer STRs bring down housing prices? Yes. If an asset brings in less cash flow it is worth less. Appreciation and government market manipulation notwithstanding
I mean it does create rentable beds. But it should be available to anyone not just current STRs. And having the employer to the party on the rental contract is a bit much for me. And it is totally gamed. Chet has an STR that he converts to an LTR so Chets buddy Chad has a place for his four restaurant employees to live.Quote:
I still like Winter Park's program of paying STR's to convert to LTR. I'm pretty sure the math works a lot better than trying to build. Maybe Foggy disagrees though
Said a different way. I know a shit ton of people that would get in the LTR landlording game in the $10k year subsidy plus rent backed by a business owner was available. Seriously, I build the fuck outta a quadplex with $40k/annually in government cheese plus leases signed by established in town business owners.
https://wpgov.com/stf/#:~:text=The%2...operty%20owner.
Yeah, agreed. If the goal is to get beds, let an investor buy or build if it makes sense with the $10k.Quote:
Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles
Me too, since I have one of the few permits in the downtown area it makes my profits go up!Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazderati
Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk
Well, Jackson has very strict (and enforced) STR policies, (and capped them really early) and look at the shit-show here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yukonrider
I can go into the details, but basically there are NO permits unless you own in a “resort overlay” zone, which actually makes sense.
STR bans take me from calcite to corundum, brett.Quote:
Originally Posted by durangobrad
Surprisingly, yes, I thought the same thing but the reality is a lot of buyers rely on the advice and guidance of buyer broker. Especially where there is large immigrant communities.Quote:
Originally Posted by neufox47
same in breckenridge total junk show this weekend is going to be hell on earthQuote:
Originally Posted by rideit
they capped STR permits and pretty much said no to any future permits except the "resort overlaid"
some how property values are going down and hundreds of homes are going to revert back to the good ole days and become shit hole ski bum flop houses yeah right
Quick topic change, but my folks passed away last year and I'm trying to sell their home. I haven't listed it yet, but a family friend of a friend reached out and wants to buy it. So my question is that as long as it's a fair price, do a I bring in a real estate agent, and if so, can I negotiate a flat fee for helping us with paperwork etc? Any real estate folks have some thoughts here?
GGL. I would definitely have at least two agents do a market summary and price suggestion for you, as I have found stuff typically sells for more than the comps suggest to me as a value range and pricing stuff myself leaves a lot of cash off the table.
Case in point, my deceased mom's home comped out at $500k IMO. Agent suggested listing at $525k and it just sold for $550k.
Our Redfin agent listed it for 1.5% and likely would of done both sides for under 3% which I think is very fair.
FACT: There's no more ski bum houses in ski towns because now that's where the fucking middle class is expected to live. Reasonable housing opportunities for the middle class open up the less desirable properties for the working class.Quote:
Originally Posted by fastfred
17 of 44 homes in my middle class subdivision are STR. They are booked maybe 1 night in 3, at best. If you think this doesn't have massive effects on a ski town, you are an idiot.
It's such a cliche to say the billionaires are chasing out the millionaires. You know who says that horseshit? The dirtpimps and millionaire property investors who priced out everyone else. Billionaires don't chase anyone out of town. But, their presence sure does make the millionaires go buck wild with greed.
Everyone likes to hate on HOAs, but one of the top reasons for ours is to enforce no rentals under 6 months.
As long as you are fine with the price, I’d handle that with just a real estate attorney on hourlyQuote:
Originally Posted by G. Gordon Liddy
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
Yeah, when my parents passed we sold the house via an attorney because it was a hot sellers market and people came to us. There is value with comp comparisons when setting the sell price that an agent can provide, but you can do that on your own with some work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Shirk
What state? How long have the covenant been in place and what was the threshold for approval? I think the challenges in Colorado is that a. too many owners are pro STRs to pass the super majority (2/3s usually I think)? And the HOAs have such little legal teeth that they would be unable to inforce.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowagriz
Yes. I had a friend use a RE agent (turns out to be our agent that we have used multiple times as well) that she had used in the past at regular commission rates but in this one similar to yours, she asked her agent if she would be okay doing this for a flat fee to shepherd the process through to completion. Obviously helps to have that prior relationship.Quote:
Originally Posted by G. Gordon Liddy
I had a lawyer write my deal and it went great, but different country eh
IMO Jackson shouldn't be mentioned as a real estate data point in this or any conversation because we all know it's unique and irrelevant to the big picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by rideit
Palm Springs recently capped STR and their house prices have been reported to be dropping because of it and a few other factors. I hope these caps become a trend nationwide.
Two years ago, YouTube star Luan Palomera paid $1.5 million for a chic vacation home in Palm Springs.
Today, he’d be lucky to get $1 million for it.
As L.A. continues its crackdown on Airbnb, city officials can turn toward the desert for an example — perhaps a cautionary tale — of the potential side effects of curbing the short-term rental market.
In Palm Springs, a cap on short-term rentals in specific high-demand neighborhoods has all but frozen the market in those communities.
Sales are down. Homes languish on the market for months. And investors who bought up Palm Springs properties during the COVID-19 pandemic are facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in losses.
Palm Springs, a city dependent on tourism, tried something new in an attempt to preserve its local identity in the era of Airbnb.
In 2022, the City Council adopted an ordinance that capped the number of rental certificates in any given neighborhood to 20% of the homes there.
If you live in one of 10 Palm Springs neighborhoods that already are over the limit, you’re trapped in permit purgatory, stuck on a waiting list for a rental license that may take years.
Those with licenses before the cap were grandfathered in. Those count toward the cap, so most of the capped neighborhoods were over the limit as soon as the ordinance passed. Some, like Movie Colony East at 21.8%, are just above the limit. Others, like Racquet Club Estates at 41.6%, have blown through it.
But beyond the grandfathered homes, the rules are extremely strict. If you have a license and sell your home, the license isn’t passed down to the buyer.
Real estate agent Tim Sarlund had a homeowner client who died with a rental license. When the client’s brother took over the property and applied for the license to be renewed, he was denied because there was technically a change in ownership, according to Sarlund.
Of the 66 organized neighborhoods in Palm Springs, the 10 over the limit are spread throughout the city: Desert Park Estates, El Mirador, El Rancho Vista Estates, Gene Autry, Lawrence Crossley, Movie Colony East, Racquet Club Estates, Ranch Club Estates, Sunmor and Vista Las Palmas.
At a time when many Palm Springs home buyers have purchased properties specifically to list them on Airbnb, having one that you can’t rent out quickly loses its luster. And the new ordinance is killing home values in those 10 neighborhoods, real estate agents say.
A “Stunning Mid-Century Palm Springs Oasis,” as an Airbnb listing brags, could — if sold — become an overpriced, mostly unoccupied box getting blasted by the brutal desert sun for most of the year. Listings in these neighborhoods carry a proverbial scarlet letter as Palm Springs becomes a city of rentable homes versus non-rentable homes.
Michael Slate, a local real estate agent, said most agents don’t even bother hosting open houses for listings in capped neighborhoods.
“No one shows up,” he said. “Buyers are aware of the cap, and properties on the market in those neighborhoods don’t get a lot of activity.”
Slate has one client who paid $1.1 million for a home and spent $300,000 on renovations. Then the cap kicked in. Now, she’s not sure she’d be able to sell it for $1 million.
The good news is that there are plenty of great deals to be found for those in the market, as long as you’re only looking to live there yourself. In the Gene Autry neighborhood, one listing warns potential buyers: “Property can not be short term rented as there is a STR permit cap in the neighborhood.”
Michael Copeland said the cap came as a surprise to many, including some investors who bought homes in 2022 hoping to rent them but didn’t secure a permit before the ordinance passed.
Copeland, a resident and real estate agent, is facing a similar predicament. He bought a home in the Gene Autry neighborhood for $1.8 million in March 2022 and quickly obtained a rental license. The ban kicked in eight months later.
But now he wants to sell the home, and Gene Autry has the longest waiting list of any neighborhood in the city, with 32 applications in limbo. Copeland listed the home for $1.725 million, but with no takers he slashed the price to $1.595 million. It still hasn’t found a buyer after more than a year on the market.
Michael Copeland’s home is currently listed at $1.595 million. It still hasn’t found a buyer after more than a year on the market.
“One of the things Palm Springs did wrong with this ordinance is not letting licenses transfer when you sell a home,” Copeland said.
In the second half of 2022, Desert Park Estates saw 42 sales with a median price of $908,500, and the average home sold after 38 days on the market. During the same stretch the following year after the cap was introduced, there were only 22 sales with a median price of $832,500, and the average home took 74 days to sell. Half the sales, double the time.
To be clear, caps aren’t the only thing driving down prices. The market in Palm Springs — and all of Southern California — is still nursing a hangover from the wild pandemic market. Low interest rates led to record prices in the last few years, but as interest rates climbed higher and higher, home values dipped across the board.
In addition, people simply aren’t renting as many Airbnbs in Palm Springs these days.
“Occupancy rates are dismal,” said Sarlund, who runs a small short-term rental business in addition to working as a real estate agent. “Even people with rental licenses aren’t getting as many contracts as they used to.”
But to many in the 10 affected neighborhoods — and neighborhoods inching closer to the 20% mark, such as Twin Palms and Little Beverly Hills — the cap is a major factor in declining home values.
Dealing with the influx of rentals has been a priority for the city and its residents for years. Of the 35,127 residential units in Palm Springs, 2,813 are registered as vacation rentals — roughly 8%, according to city data.
The city has been more lax than others in the desert on short-term rentals. A handful of Coachella Valley cities such La Quinta, Cathedral City and Indian Wells have more or less banned new short-term rental permits entirely, with a few exceptions.
New ski bum housing= van down by the river brah!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by neckdeep
I prefer to think of.myself as a Renaissance bohemian.
It's a spiritual journey.
Have you seen what vans are going for these days?!?Quote:
Originally Posted by byates1
[QUOTE=byates1;7013783]New ski bum housing= van down by the river brah!!!!
/QUOTE]
True.
That worn out 1960's ranch design with all original fixtures, bad roof, hobo spiders and sketchy septic system is now a highly coveted starter home for a two income couple with some family money for a downpayment.
[QUOTE=neckdeep;7013815]that was mostly out of ski bum reach by the 90s, depending. Ski bum was a 2bd condo with 8 dudes and a coffee table that was 1/4 sheet plywood resting on someone’s summer tiresQuote:
Originally Posted by byates1