It's Not a Bike Accident When a Car Hits a Rider

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Originally Posted by old goat

So what you're saying is that if we didn't have bikes we wouldn't have paved roads and everyone would slow down and stay close to home and we wouldn't have global warming. Thanks Obama.

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Pretty much, the automobile came about because of improved road conditions brought about by the bicycle lobby


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Originally Posted by highangle

I'm not talking about bike paths destroying entire towns and tax bases, only some of the hare-brained ideas some of you road bikers have pooped out - falcon3's nifty plan for removing the buildings on every 10th block of Manhattan comes to mind...Even bike boxes require traffic calming, something only feasible in residential and light commercial areas with plenty of RoW on roads that aren't thoroughfares...

What is a motor vehicle system? If you mean "The way the roads are!", you're talking about a thing that has evolved over several generations undertaken by thousands of unrelated entities for lots of different reasons. Kind of dumb to consider it as a single easily changeable thing built by a couple old guys with a shovel.

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None of which involved bulldozing entire neighborhoods, the use of eminent domain and reduction of the tax base in those locations of course.

Kind of dumb to assume I think it is easy to change the system to increase pedestrian and bike safety.

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Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

What about when you're driving and you get hit by a cyclist? Has happened twice to me (once not a big deal, the other had the cyclist flat out on the pavement behind me after he slammed into the back of my car--I had to stop abruptly because of a car in front of me and the cyclist hadn't been paying attention to what was in front of him, which was my car).

When I see cyclists on the ground following an incident with a car I tend to assume they were doing some of the crazy shit they do all the time--running lights without even looking for oncoming traffic (they just assume the cars will give way), riding against traffic, weaving between cars and getting ahead of them at traffic lights. It's too bad cyclists are so exposed, but I usually can't go two minutes in the street without seeing at least one (and usually a few) doing something dumb. But it's just accepted that that's how they operate (probably 50% or more are delivery guys and using e-bikes, but they're still on bicycles).

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except a bike hitting a car isn't going to kill the driver of the car.

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Originally Posted by Beaver

You are a fucking cunt.

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makerstelemark's comments were extremely aggressive. I agree, hateful cunt.

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Originally Posted by raisingarizona13

except a bike hitting a car isn't going to kill the driver of the car.

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Well, yeah. I really just posted that part as something unusual but which illustrated the point I was making about the nutty way bicyclists approach traffic. I will add (in case I didn't make it clear) that in NYC it's just such SOP for cyclists to break every traffic rule that no one really ever gets worked up about it--I can't remember the last time I noticed a driver upset at a cyclist for being in a lane or going the wrong way, etc. You'd stroke out in a day if you responded the way it seems some people posting here do.

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Originally Posted by raisingarizona13

makerstelemark's comments were extremely aggressive. I agree, hateful cunt.

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Relax. He prob just drives an ambulance in Pitkin County, Colorado.

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

Pretty much, the automobile came about because of improved road conditions brought about by the bicycle lobby


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And they're in debt to the horse lobby, who are, of course, the remnants of the North American conquistador and buffalo lobbies. What's your point?

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Originally Posted by highangle

Relax. He prob just drives an ambulance in Pitkin County, Colorado.

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And is incapable of driving around tourons and cannot avoid whining to the media

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Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

Well, yeah. I really just posted that part as something unusual but which illustrated the point I was making about the nutty way bicyclists approach traffic. I will add (in case I didn't make it clear) that in NYC it's just such SOP for cyclists to break every traffic rule that no one really ever gets worked up about it--I can't remember the last time I noticed a driver upset at a cyclist for being in a lane or going the wrong way, etc. You'd stroke out in a day if you responded the way it seems some people posting here do.

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Dex, did you ever bike? When the kryptonite comes down on the side view I'd say people are usually pretty worked up. And the cops, man they suck. Way more likely to issue a ticket to a biker than a driver.

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Originally Posted by highangle

falcon3's nifty plan for removing the buildings on every 10th block of Manhattan comes to mind...

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I’m not sure if you’re being an asshole or are just fucking stupid but clearly my suggestion was to close certain ROADS to cars and make them walk/ped areas.

Shit, allow the busses on there too! It would take half the time to go anywhere on transit because busses wouldn’t be hampered by car traffic.

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Originally Posted by highangle

And they're in debt to the horse lobby, who are, of course, the remnants of the North American conquistador and buffalo lobbies. What's your point?

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Don’t be obtuse


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Originally Posted by Falcon3

I’m not sure if you’re being an asshole or are just fucking stupid...

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You know, two things aren't always mutually exclusive.

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Originally Posted by Falcon3

I’m not sure if you’re being an asshole or are just fucking stupid but clearly my suggestion was to close certain ROADS to cars and make them walk/ped areas.

Shit, allow the busses on there too! It would take half the time to go anywhere on transit because busses wouldn’t be hampered by car traffic.

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I’m typically pro-bike allocation of ROW, but this isn’t a good idea in most situations. Tends to drive down car visitations which drives out business and then you end up with a dead zone where no one wants to go.

Pedestrian malls have worked in Burlington and Boulder, but Eugene is a cautionary tale about how these can go the other way.

Protected bike lanes are currently a better solution IMO.

I like protected bike lanes as well until HA hops on his E-scooter and pulls a salmon and rides agains traffic screaming "Out of my way bitches!"

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Originally Posted by #######

I like protected bike lanes as well until HA hops on his E-scooter and pulls a salmon and rides agains traffic screaming "Out of my way bitches!"

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rl8cATmwsN4

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Originally Posted by ml242

Dex, did you ever bike? When the kryptonite comes down on the side view I'd say people are usually pretty worked up. And the cops, man they suck. Way more likely to issue a ticket to a biker than a driver.

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Yeah, I used to bicycle (and my brother was a bike messenger for awhile), and all through the 90's I rollerbladed around the city. It was my primary mode of transportation for a few years. So I feel like I kind of get how it is biking around here. Driving I never got the side view mirror treatment although have gotten into it with a few asshole bikers (not for years, though)--but I was just comparing what people are posting about to what I see every day, not saying people don't get upset if a cyclist goes after a mirror or a car blatantly cuts off a biker (or worse). Point being, I feel like I witness dozens or hundreds of cyclist traffic violations every day and don't even think about it, but in this thread people seem worked up over much less.

Cops virtually never ticket bikers. I can't even say I've ever personally seen a biker get a ticket (maybe I have, but given how rare it is I think I would have noticed it--all I can think of right now is some guy getting ticketed with his bike on the subway), but most days I can look out my window and watch cops at 96th/2nd pulling cars over for traffic violations. Have never seen a bike get pulled over, even though the cops literally watch these guys roll through red lights all day (if a car did anything close it would 100% get a ticket). Honestly, I think if they just did some enforcement it might cut down on the bike shenanigans--it seems to have had an effect on drivers (red light/speeding cameras probably helped).

Cyclists get tickets frequently around here (Marin Co) for running stop signs on the weekends. Not so much during the week. When the cops are out, the savvy riders warn each other going opposite ways…

Guess I can point out that scooters and motorcycles seem similarly immune to tickets around here. Few times a week there's the parade of hundreds of (mostly unlicensed, illegal) dirt bikes and quads popping wheelies and otherwise being obnoxious down 2nd Ave. They all run red lights and block traffic--never a ticket AFAIK (always wonder if there is a reluctance to crack down due to demographics-- almost all those guys are black or Hispanic).

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

Don’t be obtuse

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Highangle has doubled down on obtuse over the past 6 months to a year. It makes me wonder what's going on. Everything okay in your world, Highangle? Just checking.

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Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

Guess I can point out that scooters and motorcycles seem similarly immune to tickets around here. Few times a week there's the parade of hundreds of (mostly unlicensed, illegal) dirt bikes and quads popping wheelies and otherwise being obnoxious down 2nd Ave. They all run red lights and block traffic--never a ticket AFAIK (always wonder if there is a reluctance to crack down due to demographics-- almost all those guys are black or Hispanic).

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It's that some kid, somewhere, got smoked by a car while fleeing the cops who were chasing him for dirtbiking while urban (DWU). I spend some time in Baltimore, original home of the urban dirt bike scene (not exactly a claim to fame, but it's true, you could look it up) and the cops have completely given up on it.

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Originally Posted by ötzi

Highangle has doubled down on obtuse over the past 6 months to a year. It makes me wonder what's going on. Everything okay in your world, Highangle? Just checking.

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Thanks man. I try to be nice, I really do. But it's hard to straighten up and fly right with that sumbitch Reagan in the White House...


You know roads predate the bicycle, right? And the horse & wagon, and people afoot, and most importantly moving freight and armies...were the reason roads were invented. The Appian Way was not made for bicycles, but to move armies quickly. Every road leading to/from any city and port was put there to move freight. The automobile was not invented to take advantage of roads put there by penny-farthing lobbies. jfc

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Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

Cops virtually never ticket bikers. I can't even say I've ever personally seen a biker get a ticket (maybe I have, but given how rare it is I think I would have noticed it--all I can think of right now is some guy getting ticketed with his bike on the subway), but most days I can look out my window and watch cops at 96th/2nd pulling cars over for traffic violations.

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recipient of two bike tickets, both in brooklyn- no car tickets.

the cops suck and only do anything when it’s a sting (see the dirt bikes or rolling stops in cars at any intersection) but that’s a different story.

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Originally Posted by old_newguy

Protected bike lanes are currently a better solution IMO.

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“Protected” being the key to this equation.

Dutch bike lane

Attachment 381454

American bike lane

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simpler times.

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Originally Posted by ml242

simpler times.

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Was that cop highangle’s brother?


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Originally Posted by Peruvian

“Protected” being the key to this equation.

Dutch bike lane

Attachment 381454

American bike lane

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We have protected bike lanes in the US, just not enough.

Not enough for road bikers to use them.

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Originally Posted by highangle

You're a kook and a nictating goofball though. One who found and joined this forum based on a Jet Plane on a Treadmill or Paleo Diet thread. It's only natural you would misapprehend and become confused in your Naruto rush to be the goofiest bastard in any given room - pretty sure you can't even ride a bike.
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It's kinda cute really that some jong from 2009 thinks I joined the forum because of anything else than skiing, but go on elaborate on your Brilliant ideas.

I mainly downhill mtbed ( until the kids came along and I decided to keep climbing and skiing and lost mtbing along the way), but I commute to work every day, on a road.

Luckily there are no truck owning angry freedom lovers here in our communist utopia who want to kill me because I'm on the road.

You don't know that...

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Originally Posted by old_newguy

I’m typically pro-bike allocation of ROW, but this isn’t a good idea in most situations. Tends to drive down car visitations which drives out business and then you end up with a dead zone where no one wants to go.

Pedestrian malls have worked in Burlington and Boulder, but Eugene is a cautionary tale about how these can go the other way.

Protected bike lanes are currently a better solution IMO.

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Car free zones work where there is already a lot of foot traffic--ie the old center of many European cities but taking out the cars doesn't bring pedestrians where there were few before--K St mall in Sacramento.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrUAxye4zkE

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Originally Posted by old goat

Car free zones work where there is already a lot of foot traffic--ie the old center of many European cities but taking out the cars doesn't bring pedestrians where there were few before--K St mall in Sacramento.

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It's called urban planning and it's about thinking 50 years down the road, not next year. In 50 years, do you think K St pedestrian mall in Sac will be empty? No, it will be the heart of the city with dense housing, walk able (and bike able) neighborhoods, and transit connecting it to other neighborhoods. E.G. a place where lots of people can live together without using a car. Thank god we have urban planners designing our cities and not ignorant buffoons like highangle.

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Originally Posted by altasnob

It's called urban planning and it's about thinking 50 years down the road, not next year. In 50 years, do you think K St pedestrian mall in Sac will be empty? No, it will be the heart of the city with dense housing, walk able (and bike able) neighborhoods, and transit connecting it to other neighborhoods. E.G. a place where lots of people can live together without using a car. Thank god we have urban planners designing our cities and not ignorant buffoons like highangle.

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In the meantime, why don't you use all that self-righteous pedantic energy to elucidate road bikers to the wisdom bike paths?

I don't get your complaint that bikers don't use bike paths? That certainly isn't the case in the Seattle area, one of the bike capitals of the US. There are not that many bike paths in Seattle and the ones they do have are packed to the gills with bikers. And out in the suburbs, there are rails to trails conversions to bike paths that are packed with bikers and pedestrians. All types of people. The biggest issue with bike paths in Seattle is they are too crowded, and consequently, quite dangerous (take a spin on the Burke Gilman on a hot Saturday afternoon if you don't believe me). When you see a biker in Seattle on a road it is because there is no bike path option. Maybe things are different in AK (highly doubt it though), but no one living in Alaska has a basis in knowledge to complain how lower 48 cities deal with bikes.

Well perhaps you just skipped post #5 and post #18 itt? Or perhaps you're just too far up on your high horse to read as well as you should?

And your gross ex recto generalizations of both Seattleites and Alaskans, while copius and free-flowing, are indicative of an entitled digestive system, a judgemental little colon, and a diet rich in fantasy fiber. Please shut the fuck up with that stupid shit.

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Originally Posted by highangle

In the meantime, why don't you use all that self-righteous pedantic energy to elucidate road bikers to the wisdom bike paths?

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Most places, they aren't actually "bike paths" but multi use paths. A bicyclist on the up can usually operate well amongst most other users. On the down, they are typically more akin to a passenger vehicle than a pedestrian. On level ground, a recreationalist will probably be better off on the path, but a road cyclist will be more akin to passenger vehicles.

But anyway, this thread is full of hatred and bigotry in the weirdest ways. It's unfortunate.

I just biked in a bunch of different states as I drove from CO to NY and back. You can tell the places that don't often see cyclists on the road because the drivers, in general, have no idea how to pass safely.

So how much of the 125 mile Seward Highway has a bike path next to it? Ever ride on that bike path? Wouldn't be surprised if it's cracked and buckled forcing cyclist to chose the smoother paved shoulder of the highway despite the added risks. Per google maps, the only bike paths on the Seward highway are a stretch north of Anchorage to just north of Eagle River, around Girdwood, and a stretch into Seward. Looks like Alaskans need to pony up and get some more bike paths built.
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Originally Posted by grskier

But anyway, this thread is full of hatred and bigotry in the weirdest ways. It's unfortunate.

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i think you are mistaken
this is the thread where we get to see various entries from HA's word-of-the-day desk calendar & see if they make him look thoughtful

https://www.kindpng.com/picc/m/188-1...k-calendar.png

I'd love to see highangle get stuck in one of the Critical Mass protests in Seattle (Critical Mass is a monthly public bike rides through Seattle to demonstrate for bicyclists’ road rights). My friend was the biker who got hit by the car and drug on the ground. Here's his bike:

https://static.seattletimes.com/wp-c...5671-300x0.jpg

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The group of at least 100 bicyclists was moving en masse down East Aloha Street when a man and his girlfriend in a Subaru station wagon tried to pull out of a parking spot. The riders commonly engage in what they call “corking,” in which several bikers block cars while the mass of riders passes. The Critical Mass group moved down the street blocking traffic, some riders got in the way of the Subaru and prevented it from leaving. Some bikers sat on the car and were banging on it The driver tried to back up but bumped into a cyclist. “This enraged the group,” and several of the cyclists bashed up the Subaru, shattering the windshield and rear window. The driver tried to drive away but hit another bicyclist. Still, he drove about a block, to Aloha and 15th Avenue East, before the Critical Mass riders cornered the car and started spitting on it and banging against it. One bicyclist punched the driver through his open window, and another used a knife to slash the Subaru’s tires. The driver got out of his car, was hit in the back of the head and suffered a large gash.

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https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...de-in-seattle/

* gets popcorn *