I haven't seen anybody in ER or clinic for probably a year who has had any significant pulmonary burden with covid, young or old, vaccinated/boosted or not. Interpret that however you want.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX-er
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I haven't seen anybody in ER or clinic for probably a year who has had any significant pulmonary burden with covid, young or old, vaccinated/boosted or not. Interpret that however you want.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX-er
We could all see this one coming. The fact that most people got vaccinated, and especially the elderly, led to many lives being saved and also got us to where we are now with--hopefully--the worst of the pandemic in the rear view. But instead of recognizing this the anti-vax crowd thinks the fact that cases are down and doctors are less adamant about Covid boosters shows the vaccinations weren't needed in the first place.
so while ski bro is pretty smart and usually up on it he just hasnt got all the info this time cuz he was busy skiing and its fallen off most people's radarQuote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
I got no idea ^^ which MD's were vaxed and in the small town a lot of BS floats around but as you point out we all got vaccines when we were 11 so I bookd the shot cuz you never know
I used to follow worldometer where america had put up some big death figures and so i havent forgot thatQuote:
Originally Posted by The AD
but if you think was all fake news it doesn matter
so what about before " probably a year " how about 2 years ago, how about 3 years ago ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
My point is it appears you don’t have to guess which MDs and PTs got vaxxed and which ones didn’t - if they were seeing patients (in hospital or in their private physiotherapy clinic) they are vaxxed.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX-er
yeah I can see the edict so they should have been but I can't say for sure which of them were or were still seeing patients, I just don't know
Shit stop hitting the fan in my clinical world (ER/ICU) about January 2022. Is that specific enough for you? Before that, working in a largely unvaccinated population, it was problematic.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX-er
Love it!Quote:
Originally Posted by SumJongGuy
I just did Pfizer #6 !
Was at the Doc’s office for assorted old guy stuff, and the Nurse asked if I wanted another Covid Booster. I said sure.
Got the Pneumonia shot today at the same time. I’m up to date on my Tetnus and Shingles vaccinations, so I’m all caught up on vaccinations for now. I’ll get a Flu shot in the fall.
Fuck. I'm jealous. I got all five previously, now I need a new one!Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry
I got the bivalent booster but prolly due for another one in the fall I guess. Didn't stop me from finally getting the covid in march on a trip to Spain and Andorra. Had a good run though, only other person I know who hasn't had (that we now of) it is my GF.Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry
I tried to get the shingles vax in the fall when I got my booster and I was a year early. Actually really want that one. I see shingles at work occasionally so I'm exposed, and it doesn't look fun!
Damn, Harry. Sounds like time for a shot of whiskey to celebrate. Then you will just need to take a shot of bourbon, a shot of rum, a shot of tequila....:D
I asked when I was at my doc a few months ago, and he said they expect an updated booster in the Fall, like an annual flu shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by riser4
I think getting more shots the vid will probably not hit you very hard, I've had 5 and i will keep doing them so long as they keep releasing them
You're where I need to be - this year: tetanus, shingles.... then later Flu and maybe another 'vid one if there's a new and improved formula. Just had surgery and they mentioned that pneumonia one... but said I was probably a bit young still... need to look into that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry
I thought the women start looking good only after a couple shots of whiskeyQuote:
Originally Posted by Toadman
I got the shingles vaxes in the winter and spring. The first one was brutal. 2nd made me take notice. Probably would have seemed worse if i hadn't been knocked for a loop the first time.
Generally speaking, Shingles results from exposure in your "Yute" i.e. chicken pox. Haven't heard of it being transmitted during an actual acute episode, but .......Quote:
Originally Posted by beaterdit
Enjoy the ride! Boost up!
My wife had shingles and when I saw that , it went to priority 1 for vaccinations but that was right before covid started and I still haven’t got the shot. Maybe this summer I’ll finally deal w that one
Shingles is supposed to be non contagious and just dormant chicken pox essentially getting activated by stress usually iirc.
I didn’t get chicken pox until I was in my 20s so I’m wondering if that changes the equation at all
I may be going to a hell in a bucketQuote:
Originally Posted by supermodel159
Someone with shingles can’t give “shingles” to someone else - but someone with shingles can transmit the shingles virus (which is the chickenpox virus) to someone who has never had chicken pox before (and thereby give that person chickenpox) - chickenpox as an adult is no fun and can be bad news if you get chicken pox during a pregnancy.
I’ve had shingles a couple of times, not fun, although I’ve seen far worse cases.
My in-laws are on shot #6 never got COVID though. An uncle is recovering from long COVID, tough to watch. He’s 75 but generally healthy and very active. No energy and lots of fatigue doing very little for over 6 months now.
I was in the never got covid crew until May this year and I’m still not totally sure I had it.
Everyone in the fam had a cold off and on in May. Multi tests by everyone kept coming back neg for covid.
I had a really bad headache on the 3rd go around and went thru the motions of testing again and went back to bed so the test results w the faint line were way past the 30’min window.
I was a little incredulous because didn’t even feel sick, just a headache. Exact same the next day, so if I did have it it was barely noticiable
Next round of boosters will NOT have the original strain (first vax). The believe that is now extinct or close enough. Plan is to get what they have Sept or Oct when I get a flu shot.
Heard about first European vacation snafu. Friends came down with covid in first week of a 2.5 week trip. They all felt sick, even the teens. Generally isolated at their Airbnb’s, but kept their travel itinerary (wearing masks). Transcontinental flight home (wearing masks) while still feeling sick and testing positive. All finally negative, and at least the middle age woman is still feeling bad/weak. It’s the second or third infection for all of them (and the most sick any of them have been from covid).
Have another set of friends traveling in EU that caught covid and are taking refuge and cancelling most of their plans.
Review article published today with Dr Altman as lead author: “The immunology of long COVID”
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41577-023-00904-7
Abstract
Last paragraphQuote:
Long COVID is the patient-coined term for the disease entity whereby persistent symptoms ensue in a significant proportion of those who have had COVID-19, whether asymptomatic, mild or severe. Estimated numbers vary but the assumption is that, of all those who had COVID-19 globally, at least 10% have long COVID. The disease burden spans from mild symptoms to profound disability, the scale making this a huge, new health-care challenge. Long COVID will likely be stratified into several more or less discrete entities with potentially distinct pathogenic pathways. The evolving symptom list is extensive, multi-organ, multisystem and relapsing–remitting, including fatigue, breathlessness, neurocognitive effects and dysautonomia. A range of radiological abnormalities in the olfactory bulb, brain, heart, lung and other sites have been observed in individuals with long COVID. Some body sites indicate the presence of microclots; these and other blood markers of hypercoagulation implicate a likely role of endothelial activation and clotting abnormalities. Diverse auto-antibody (AAB) specificities have been found, as yet without a clear consensus or correlation with symptom clusters. There is support for a role of persistent SARS-CoV-2 reservoirs and/or an effect of Epstein–Barr virus reactivation, and evidence from immune subset changes for broad immune perturbation. Thus, the current picture is one of convergence towards a map of an immunopathogenic aetiology of long COVID, though as yet with insufficient data for a mechanistic synthesis or to fully inform therapeutic pathways.
Quote:
The oncoming burden of long COVID faced by patients, health-care providers, governments and economies is so large as to be unfathomable, which is possibly why minimal high-level planning is currently allocated to it. If 10% of acute infections lead to persistent symptoms, it could be predicted that ~400 million individuals globally are in need of support for long COVID. The biggest unknowns remain the joined-up scheme of its pathogenesis and thus the best candidate therapeutics to be trialled in randomized controlled trials, along with a better understanding of the kinetics of recovery and the factors influencing this. Some countries have invested in first-round funding for the pilot investigations. From the above, far more will be needed.
My immune compromised (Lupus) sister finally got it last month. She swears it was the FIRST time she went out to a club without a mask. (BIL plays in bands around Boston every week). She had like twice as many boosters as us regular people have on board. Three weeks of testing positive, finally negative but still has a fever of 101 + She's complaining of bad vertigo, still can't walk up or down stairs right now..
I'm kinda glad she did prove to herself and us that she can survive it, but her immune system won't benefit from it nearly as much as ours does..
When I was going through chemo last winter I asked my oncologist if she recommended booster. She was pretty unimpressed with disease severity in her cancer patients, as were most of the chemo infusion nurses. I skipped the booster. That said, I was getting a shot every two weeks to keep my white count up and not bottoming out. Still haven’t personally seen any COVID patients in ER that have required admission since Delta faded out. Yes, I know this does not account for long covid sequelae.Quote:
Originally Posted by SumJongGuy
Question is then, if the vaccinated are still getting long covid but having minimal acute disease severity, what’s the point? I’d start to question are we potentially causing harm? Read a couple creepy case reports about rapid progression of lymphoma after vaccination and some case reports of non-Hodgkins after vaccination. Spooked me out, as I was being treated for Hodgkins.
I was first in line to get vaccinated but now I’m honestly wondering if we’re over doing it.
Wouldn’t part of the question be whether the unvaxed (or under vaxed) are having more severe outcomes from acute infection and/or higher prevalence of long covid. And what’s the rate of those that are recently vaxed being exposed but not infected because of boosted vax-based immunity (therefore not infecting others)?Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
I'm no epidemiologist.. Wild guess is that we've surpassed critical vaxxed mass to sufficiently reverse the spread... and/or the newer strains are not as vicious as the one of 2020-2021 were. Same goes for masks. You do you as long as hospitals aren't filling up again..Quote:
Originally Posted by bodywhomper
That does not make sense to me.
Personally, I know people that are infected in my community (positive RAT). Some are feeling sick and continuing to do their thing and going about their everyday lives. Some are intentionally isolating or at least wearing a mask when they are trying to continue some of their daily things. We had our 4th July weekend plans derailed because a whole household (8 people) were all infected (they were to host another family of friends). My large doctor’s office no longer requires any mitigation or separation of sick and healthy. One of my wrk offices is in the middle of remodel, coworkers are being cramped into a small space, and the hvac isn’t turning on until 10 or 11 am, and a coworker came in sick this week after finishing their 2 week family vacation (they apparently never tested). Unclear how that’s unfolding.
Broader examples: WTF is going on currently in Okinawa with hospitals and covid? I’ve skimmed through some head scratching theories. China apparently has a hot mess of variant soup in circulation https://public.tableau.com/app/profi...riantDashboard
At this point almost everyone has been vaccinated (usually 2-4 doses) and/or infected (often multiple). That seems to address most of the severe morbidity/mortality cases.
So for those without multiple risk factors, is there additional benefit for boosters beyond the bivalent? I have not seen the evidence saying so.
Future studies may indicate the need for boosters after x many years... or a new virulent extreme escape variant could emerge necessitating a new formulation (but probably not)... until then I don't have a personal plan for more COVID vaccinations after reactions to booster 3 & 4 (gross hematuria, unexplained, not a known AE).
My numbers are down and I am hoping we have reached a point of persistent low level spread with seasonal epidemic activity... kinda like a nasty version of the flu.
I believe those are just Omicron XBB.1 or Omicron BA.2 sub sub variants.Quote:
Originally Posted by bodywhomper
^^CT abd/pelvis?
UA UC CT abd/pelvis, clean... referral to urology. Gross hematuria resolved. Persistent microhematuria on repeat dips. Clean cystoscopy. Urology said "some people have persistent microhematuria. it's not cancer. go away." Then it happened again with the bivalent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
Is there good data on prevalence of long covid from those with multiple infections or fully vaxed/boosted?
1 of 10 are not good odds, but that is a very coarse average. Know several former(!) athletes now that were fully vaxed… :(
ETA: hematuria: that sucks and sorry to hear about. :( . It looks like there are observational studies of it post covid vaccine and post covid infection.
hematuria was also not that rare a thing prior to this whole covid problem - would want to see evidence it’s worsened/caused by covid/vax
For me?Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
My piss turned pink <24 hours after booster 3 & 4. It was accompanied by bilateral flank pain and lab confirmation. It might have even happened on vax 2 and I missed it as I wasn't paying attention to my piss as i felt like hell (certainly had the flank aches). Nothing like that has ever happened to me before, or since.
Once I thought was coincidence since it wasn't a known AE. Two correlated events is an AE for me to consider for me going forward, albeit negligibly rare in the population.
We do know vaccinations and infections reduce risks of LC. We also know that strain evolution has also reduced the risk of LC- with WA1 and Alpha this was >20%, Delta was more like 10% and now Omicron is less than 5% going on to develop LC. So both increases in immunity either via vax or infection help reduce risks, as well as the strain evolution resulting in less LC.Quote:
Originally Posted by bodywhomper
https://www.science.org/content/arti...get-long-covid
(People who catch Omicron are less likely to get Long Covid.
Vaccination, virus biology may be driving down risk)
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9212672/
(Risk of long COVID associated with delta versus omicron variants of SARS-CoV-2)
Also- this is not a new post-viral infection phenomena as similar/overlapping symptoms can occur after a number of different viral and bacterial infections, and is likely a major contributor to ME/Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (25 of 29 symptoms overlap- see below). Also likely that reactivation of dormat life long viruses (EBV, CMV, etc) you are carrying after Sars-S infection are contributing to symptoms.
from the review https://www.nature.com/articles/s41577-023-00904-7
Quote:
Box 3 Lessons from and for ME/CFS and the case of ‘long SARS’
It is hard to discuss or present data on long COVID without being challenged about the relationship of findings to mechanisms in myalgic encephalomyelitis/chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), not least by patient groups who understandably feel that their condition has endured decades of neglect in terms of biomedical research prioritization. In light of clear overlaps with long COVID, there now exists an opportunity for cross-hybridization, with much to be learnt from the long, past experience and investigations in ME/CFS, and from the new momentum of long COVID investigations over the past few years. The symptom overlap is self-evident, encompassing the key features of post-exertional fatigue, neurocognitive symptoms, dysautonomia and postural orthostatic tachycardic syndrome. A systematic review found that 25 of 29 CFS symptoms were reported by at least one long COVID study18, whereas another study compared genes common between the two conditions in a number of ways, including pathway and network analysis148. This study found common hub proteins, such as IL-6 and IL-1β, between the two conditions. Another review focused on their similarities through the link of TGFβ signalling and circadian rhythms148. There is resonance in the post-acute viral infection symptomology across the two conditions19. ME/CFS has commonly been described as a post-viral condition that may ensue following a range of infections, including pandemic H1N1 influenza149, Varicella zoster virus150, enteroviruses and SARS-CoV-117. Overlap in the immunopathological analyses is particularly interesting. It is noteworthy that raised CCL11, which has credentials as a long COVID serum biomarker functionally linked to neurocognitive symptoms, is also a biomarker of ME/CFS151. Revisiting the ME/CFS data also raises the possibility of investigating some of the implicated biomarkers, such as CXCL10 and leptin, in more detail in long COVID152. Furthermore, the ME/CFS data set may offer a reference framework to consider a role for Epstein–Barr virus reactivation in long COVID, noting that CFS can ensue from infectious mononucleosis associated with an enhanced imprint of T cell activation153.