What do you all think about dogs in the backcountry? (Terrifying experience today)

[Judge Smails]

I'm not a dog owner, but two of my friends that I ski with from time to time bring their dogs with them every time they go. Today we were skiing Crescent Chute on Round Top (near kirkwood) and I witnessed one of the worst falls ever.

A little backround for those of you not familiar with the Crescent: About 20-30 feet wide and a little over 500 feet of vert in the chute itself, 45-50 degrees. The chute starts off the summit on a hanging snowfield with deadly exposure on all sides and makes a gradual left turn (shaped like a crescent moon). The line needs to be taken seriously. Today the snow was nearly ideal. Not deep pow, but very dry and still fresh. The chute seemed to have slid on monday, but had been refilled with wind deposits.

The dogs worried me from the start, as they played at the feet of the first skier as he made his way down the snowfield into the chute. A blown turn at this point could be your last ever. The first skier skied halfway down the hanging snowfield and then entered the chute 1/3 of the way down and skied a 100 or so feet very cautiously, then stopped at the turn to shoot some video. Two dogs, one of which was his, and another who's owner was still up top, accompanied him down. I skied second and was planning to ski the whole chute non stop at relatively high speed. I was concerned about the dogs, but their owners didn't seem worried. Helmet cam rolling, I entered the chute cautiosly and upon finding the conditions nearly perfect I began to open it up a little. The snow began sloughing, and I worked my way from right to left to avoid being hit. As I neared the turn I took a quick look back at the slough accelerating towards me. Ready to straight run the remainder of the chute onto the snowfield below, as I turned my head back down the hill I saw one of the dogs jump out in front of me from the side of the chute where skier one was filming. Startled by the dog I slowed abruptly and was hit lightly by edge of my slough. I was knocked off my feet but able to ski out of it unharmed. The dog got clobbered though. The next thing I remember seeing is the dog explode out the bottom of the chute in the slough, tomahawking at close to 50 mph. Head, tail, head, tail, for almost 1000 feet. (If you remember McGovern's fall in Focused, this put it to shame)Luckily the dog was unhurt. I'm pretty sure I was more shaken up by the event than the dog was.

The dog which fell today has been in two avalanches this year alone, both of which she triggered. I do everything in my power to be as careful as possible when backcountry skiing, especially on high consequence lines and I'm very particular about who I'll ski with. Up until today I had never really minded the dogs coming with us, but now I don't want anything to do with them.

What do you all think about dogs in the backcountry? Would you take your pooch on a high consequence big line?

I'M SORRY THIS POST IS SO LONG.

[homeless]

I take my dog on all sorts of runs.... but she is smart and obedient. If I tell her to stay, she stays. Those two dogs don't sound very smart.

I will say, also, that I would never take her down the Crescent Couloir... the owner of those dogs doesn't sound very smart to me either.

Zach

[Seldom Seen]

The way i see it, there is backcountry dog terrain and non-dog terrain. Sounds like you were in non-dog terrain, which is not cool.
For me there are also dog days and non-dog days... if avy danger is significant and she might be a risk to herself, me and/or anybody else, my dog stays at home.
-SS

[String]

The owners of the dogs sound like morons, I wouldn't go out in the backcountry with them. Even if my dog was trained well I still would have a hand on the collar to prevent any possible interference.

[PimpMasterJ]

lets see the helmet cam footy!!

[Alpine Dreams]

Leave your pooch at home and let em shit in your own yard! Dogs can be dangerous distractions and I can't stand a trail littered with dog shit.

[jackstraw]

Originally Posted by Seldom Seen

The way i see it, there is backcountry dog terrain and non-dog terrain. Sounds like you were in non-dog terrain, which is not cool.
For me there are also dog days and non-dog days... if avy danger is significant and she might be a risk to herself, me and/or anybody else, my dog stays at home.
-SS

ya, i agree with that statement.

one place they shouldn't be is on top of the headwall at tuckermans. two yrs ago a dog tumbled all the way down and did not get up afterwards. im not sure if it lived or not as they had carted it away before i made it back to the lunch rocks. being a dog person it kinda pissed me off. there's just no need to have your dog up there.

[skiing-in-jackson]

A few years ago at the avi awareness night, amongst all the seriousness and talk reivewing death by stupidity, a speaker get up and engages in a serious lecture about dogs in the BC.

The whole jist of his talk was that dogs crapping on skin tracks is not cool. He went on for about 15 minutes and drove the point home.

Dogs in the BC will crap, that shit freezes up and hangs around all winter.

Even the best trained dogs still have to take a dump- ususally on a skin track.

That said, Jackson has clamped down on the random shittings, it is viewed as totally uncool to not pick up after your pooch. I think even a ticketable offense in the city limits.

[enlosandes]

Dogs are good backcontry companions. But, just like skiers, they need to be in their comfort zone and work there way up to radder terrain. Another words, they have to graduate from one level to the next, with somethig like the Crescent being at the high end.

[Conundrum]

Dogs have their place just like skiers do. There are some skiers I won't go to certain places with and I wouldn't take dogs there either. My dog joins us some days and some days he stays in the truck.

[Baconzoo]

Originally Posted by bauerbrian

Leave your pooch at home and let em shit in your own yard! Dogs can be dangerous distractions and I can't stand a trail littered with dog shit.

I'll second your first post.

I love my dog, but the ones who chase cars and skiers down a run piss me off. I'd come unglued if a dog nearly got me wrecked in a chute.
Glad you're allright!

[Trackhead]

Originally Posted by skiing-in-jackson

The whole jist of his talk was that dogs crapping on skin tracks is not cool. He went on for about 15 minutes and drove the point home.

Dogs in the BC will crap, that shit freezes up and hangs around all winter.

Even the best trained dogs still have to take a dump- ususally on a skin track.

That said, Jackson has clamped down on the random shittings, it is viewed as totally uncool to not pick up after your pooch. I think even a ticketable offense in the city limits.

The booter on Glory is a shithole, no pun intended. But how about all the pig humans who can't step off the booter to take a piss? Fucking pigs.

A big hello from Fritz.

[Danno]

Originally Posted by Judge Smails

What do you all think about dogs in the backcountry? Would you take your pooch on a high consequence big line?

2 very distinct questions. I have no problem with well-behaved dogs in the backcountry if it is low consquence. But having dogs where you are (I don't know it, but I am gathering from your decsription), sounds like a freaking death wish (for you or the dogs).

I am gripped enough skiing something high consequence, I don't need to worry about an avy poodle.

[Viva]

Originally Posted by Judge Smails

The dog which fell today has been in two avalanches this year alone, both of which she triggered.

Does this make a dog "core"?

[Conundrum]

Originally Posted by Viva

Does this make a dog "core"?

No, the fact it humps Chuck Norris's dog makes the dog core.

Being caught in two avalanches just makes the owner stupid and means the dog is in a place it shouldn't be.

[AltaPowderDaze]

It sounds like either the dog's owner does not know it's limitations/habits or doesn't care. Does he/she happen to have an insurance policy on you or the dogs that you don't know about?

[bad_roo]

I like it when dogs get an itchy ass and scoot along on it.

Just thought I'd share that.

[Conundrum]

Originally Posted by bad_roo

I like it when dogs get an itchy ass and scoot along on it.

Just thought I'd share that.

I think that move is called the worm crawl...

The tapeworms making their exit cause the dog to itch apparently.

[snowsprite]

Roo, I like it even better when humans do that!

I am not a BC skier Judge, but I don't have to be to know that the situation you have described is dangerous for both the animals and the skier. Not great judgement involved here IMO. I'd advise speaking w/ your friends in a tactful way about keeping the dogs home next time.

Sprite

[splat]

I love dogs but, considering the last guy that went over the edge of Crescent left a 300 foot blood trail and died, I don't think I'd be wanting to share a space like that with dogs. I've kinda been waiting for someone to post something like this. The dogs get close to the action, but you can't expect them to make human-level judgements.

[BSS]

Post the vid. Leave the dogs at home in hi-carnage risk situations.

[kidwoo]

Originally Posted by splat

I love dogs but, considering the last guy that went over the edge of Crescent left a 300 foot blood trail and died, I don't think I'd be wanting to share a space like that with dogs. I've kinda been waiting for someone to post something like this. The dogs get close to the action, but you can't expect them to make human-level judgements.

Yeah no shit. There are plenty of PEOPLE I'd never take to the top of roundtop, much less a dog. That's equal parts dangerous and cruel.

A good friend of mine who introduced a huge part of the sierras to me over the last 5 years used to always take his two dogs with him. I've run over his dogs so many times I lost count. Finally he chopped one thier achiles tendons in half with his ski and had to drag the poor guy out bleeding all over the place. He was fine but it sucks that this is what it took to quit bringing them.

Hopefully your buddy learned something from this. I can't even imagine watching dog ragdoll down that chute. Much less my own. Glad you and the dog were okay.

[stomp]

i have to deal with this issue pretty often, and while i started out not really giving a shit, i've now seen more than enough bc mayhem caused by dogs to refuse to go on a trip with one in my party.

as great as dogs are under normal circumstances, when you bring them in to the bc they are dumb beasts that present a huge liability. i've seen the most obedient dogs catch sight of a bird or other animal and cover and obscene amount of hazardous/exposed terrain during the chase.

keep in mind i don't really give a shit if the dog gets itself in trouble, but inevitably the dogs owner will put themselves at considerable risk to save their pet. which means i get put at risk when the dumb-fuck owner gets in trouble and needs rescue.

keep em at home ppl.

[Greydon Clark]

Glad you didn’t get taken out of the sluff. Dogs in the BC are cool and fun, but, as many have mentioned, some lines are inappropriate for canine companionship and not all dogs are equal. How is that for blind concurrence?

[splat]

Originally Posted by Greydon Clark

How is that for blind concurrence?

Turn on the light, I can't hear you.