DYNAFIT FAILURE

[SB]

I looked at the pictures as well as read the post, seems possible the two right hand screws may have not seated the binding well and there was fulcrum effect on the plate causing it to snap across the holes?

I was under the impression the toe plate was formed from a high quality stamping with some milling/drilling for the holes?

I will definitely keep an eye on my bindings for any cracks or issues.

Glad no one was hurt.

[Samo]

Hi, powerplates are a very good news and maybe solution for fat skis. Bud for wider skis then 100mm I am afraid that this is not enough. In soft snow it should not be a problem but in hard or icy condition there is much greater force on the opposite screws and metal. In soft snow force from ski boots is transmitted all over the ski width maybe by some mathematical function I guess logarithm or exponent. But on ice: in turn most of the ski is not on snow so power is not transmuted all over the ski width. My opinion is that lever is still quite short so torque force is very high. Also, at tech bindings most of the lateral force is transmitted via the toe, so load on screws is even higher.
I also have had problems with my FT12 (first edition). Bindings were mounted on the Head Monsters 88 with width 88mm, top alu sheet and sandwich construction. Last February I ski on hard snow slope and one ski broke under the toe. Alu plate crack and inner wood broke so all core looked up. I am sure skis were ok no problem there. Of course I did not ski soft and it was a carving turn. I am around 80 kg. In spring alu fraction in heel unit also broke, this issue is already presented on Lou's page: http://www.wildsnow.com/618/dynafit-durability/ (third picture). Before that I had broke naxo nx21 and it was also lateral issue. I think Dynafit should make completely new binding for wide skis with wider screws location and wide power support plate so force would be better distributed on the ski surface. They can also make a little stronger heel unit.
After my problem with the toe I made stainless steel plates and no problems with toe till now. But I do not dare to put a tech binding on wider skis then 100mm, certainly not on 125mm. For serious touring backcountry use and expeditions, I think Dynafit or other tech bindings are still the best chose. But for hardcore aggressive skiing and cliff hucking I would go with Duke or Baron.

[Nordic75]

I have experienced this as well, not uncommon I understand. Mounting the bindings with a dynaduke/sollyfit plate should prevent this giving a rock solid connection between the binding and the plate, and a wider mount on the ski.

[sfotex]

There have been froken STs & FTs toepieces before. I have broken one (probably doe to mismount) and seen 2-3 broken ones in the last 2 years. One had the similar toe wing breakage. So no,it is not uncommon. Rare,thank god yes..

If it's been happening with ST's then the it wouldn't be an inherent flaw only with the FT toe piece ....

[sfotex]

Go answer the comments in the thread you already started rather then double posting this.....

[Cosmic Suncloud]

sorry about your issues...possibly just a bad batch/pair you got..there are many users here who are slaying those same clamps everyday with little to no issue. In fact there is a pro (hoji) dropping big cliff hits with these with no issue.

I think its in poor taste to say that the 12's are a "total failure"....as with everything there are defects.

Glad you were not hurt...

you should apologize to the OP.
just because you watched a ski movie once doesn't mean shit.

[khyber.pass]

I have seen the future: PLUM Guide.

Waiting on their 16DIN binder. Same price as Dynafit; CNC machined; little plastic (no more broken volcanos); wider hole pattern. Ski Theory covers it above. Just needs brakes.

[Trainwreck]

I looked at the pics in the other thread and I did the same thing, destroying a Praxis ski in the process, but didn't break the binding. First year FT 12, both heel DIN maxed, toe piece was fully locked, I'm 225 lbs.

I am not an uber skier, I just wrote it off as going way too fast and being way to big and having the toe locked. I think I will inspect those bindings for cracks now though.

[splat]

fyi - I merged the two threads on this issue as of this post.

[Jonathan S.]

I have seen the future: PLUM Guide.

Waiting on their 16DIN binder. Same price as Dynafit; CNC machined; little plastic (no more broken volcanos); wider hole pattern. Ski Theory covers it above. Just needs brakes.

Bah, who needs brakes!

Anyway, I have three tours on my Plum Guide bindings so far (review coming up soon at WildSnow.com) and generally agree with Alex's assessments. Essentially the weight of the Speed with the release values and pin lengths of the FT12, along with various features trickled down from rando race bindings. However, the mounting pattern is identical to current Dynafit but without the front toe hole. (And not sure if your 16 reference was to a specified rumor or just a wish list?)

[Southeast Maggot]

However, the mounting pattern is identical to current Dynafit but without the front toe hole. )

*Looks over to FT12s on jondrums dynaduke plates and raises eyebrows*

Any idea what size screw the holes take? Fit an M5 by chance?

[Jonathan S.]

Any idea what size screw the holes take? Fit an M5 by chance?

IIRC (I'm currently in CA with some old Speeds), both my Plum race bindings and Guide bindings take the same screws: standard pz drive type, the usual head diameter, and 11.5mm length (i.e., quite short, since the Plum bindings sit very close to the ski with no unnecessary shims/baseplates etc)

[jondrums]

*Looks over to FT12s on jondrums dynaduke plates and raises eyebrows*

Any idea what size screw the holes take? Fit an M5 by chance?

FWIW, the guys at PLUM asked me to take a look at a pair to confirm compatibility with my swap plates. I'm excited to do that, and I'll put together screw kits for them as soon as I can. sorry for off-topic comment...

[colinsamuels@yahoo.com]

photos on line now

[colinsamuels@yahoo.com]

Photos of Dynafit Failure now posted

[Jack Burton]

I will be paying more attention to my FT12s going forward as well, so thanks for posting.

Personally I'm just not smooth enough to ski at a din of 8 or 9 or what ever the chart says so my my toe's were always locked but I had not though about the ski staying on in a slide, going forward I'll make a more cognizant decision. No fall versus increased avalanche hazard. Those photos are nasty, looks more die-cast plastic when in multiple pieces.

[markcjr]

Its a good thing salomon didn't make those bindings, otherwise someone would have firebombed their corporate headquarters by now.

Seriously. If someone got hurt would they boycott Dynafit too?

Edit: Actually it would have to be a friend for people to take notice and or care.

[Jethro]

Seriously. If someone got hurt would they boycott Dynafit too?

Probably not, as Dynafit has a long, successful record. Salomon's error was in their very first venture into the Tech style binding/boot system to my knowledge and it was severely under engineered. Every other boot manufacturer who has made a tech style toe has done so successfully, or licensed it from Dynafit.

[markcjr]

Fair enough.

[Jonathan S.]

FWIW, the guys at PLUM asked me to take a look at a pair to confirm compatibility with my swap plates. I'm excited to do that, and I'll put together screw kits for them as soon as I can. sorry for off-topic comment...

I can't imagine that you'll have any problems. Granted the fifth toe hole will be superfluous, but given that the footprint is smaller by ditching all the excessive plastic of the Dynafit baseplates, seems like it should fit just fine on your plates.

[StuntCok]

It is pretty obvious ro me that the binding failed under stresses it was not really meant to take but I also think the way things things are being marketed is somewhat urealistic and misleading. I have a Dynafit brochure (in Japanese so it may not be the same everywhere) with people railing and hucking in them, we have Eric Hoji free-riding them in MSP movies (is he sposored by them?) and then we have the maggot bandwagon preaching the free-ridability of these bindings. I am a heavy guy and have had a bit of experience with tech binding pre-release and Loon's fat ass blew one out pretty fukking easy a couple weeks back, costing him a ski. Yes, Dynafit are great touring binding and getting better every year but let's be a bit more realistic about the downhill capabilities of these things.

[agent j]

If you don't lock out the toe, do you still need to worry about ripping out a toe piece on wider skis?

[Scottish_Skier]

Interesting photos - thanks for posting Colin.
A little worrying for anyone that use's dynafit bindings...

Based on the limited data set (i.e one failure) it is impossible to be sure if this is a problem specific to the torsion bar of FT12s (as implied) or if it really is a reliability / manufacturing failure ?

Though the consequences are scary.
Personally it makes me think where and when i would using ski touring kit ?

[skifishbum]

Well okay I apologise for calling him a jong at this point I think he is a damn good skier with unrealistic expectations of a light weight touring binders and possibly a dyna axe to grind.
Hopefully when he's done with his dyna e mission he'll expend some energy posting cool lines and stuff he's gettin after over the pond, or a review of some plum binders or nekid pics of hot french chicks. All of which would only make this place better.

[Skidog]

you should apologize to the OP.
just because you watched a ski movie once doesn't mean shit.

And you should go suck a back of cocks..

There have been VERY few failure compared to the amount of binders out there...to blatantly call them a "complete failure" is just bullshit.

I only mention that hoji rocks them and can drop cliffs with them without incident to bring to light the fact that there are many out there skiing the same type terrain without failure...

So yeah shut the fuck up douche..In fact i dont watch ski porn at all..it bores me...loud music and skiers doing shit most of us will never do....bore...