WWMD? 300lb Gorilla vs my skinny ass.

[JBrian]

Long story short; I wound up face to face with a *HUDGE*, 300lb gorilla last night and because him and his friends or whatever were out of line and I knew the cops were coming, I started loudly reading off their license plate # and he rushed me. Like any sane, 180lb white boy with an interest in living another day, I turned tail and ran like a mofo, went inside and and grabbed a 2' piece of pipe to even up the odds, I went back outside ready to bust his fucking kneecaps but they were gone - probably because they knew the cops were coming too and from the looks of the gorilla, the car and his friends, they probably had something to hide.

I'm tired of this shit, this happens to me a couple times a year because I'm the only one in this (8 unit) hippy-dippy apartment complex that has half a sack to confront these assholes. Last night it was someone on the roof apparently throwing bricks at cars and people. I could write a small novel about the other incidents including the stabbings and shootings in the immediate area as well as the arson, criminal trespass and bloody knives that have peppered this property in the 8 years that I've lived in these apartments.

I want to take some defense classes. I'm not interested in flashy martial arts, tournaments, belts, ghees (sp?) or any of that shit (I have nothing against MMA, I just don't have room for any more hobbies). I want to learn how to bring someone down and disable them quickly and efficiently in a real world scenario. I've been told Jiu-Jitsu is good, I've also heard Hapkido is very good for street defense and I recently heard Krav Maga is a good art for real world fighting although the kinda stuff they teach is hard to practice in a gym, so it's mostly just theory.

Any advice? No way I'm offering that fuck a reach around next time, he wasn't my type.

[jonesy]

Well self defense is fine but,it's not much good against a gun and takes sometime to become proficient. Even if you do effectively protect yourself there will be the aftermath of the judicial system. "He was trained to fight and injured my client." Sounds like you should move to a small mountain town.

[montanaskier]

um.........move?

[summit]

You need to move. Why the hell are you still living there after putting up with this crap for 8 years? MOVE MOVE MOVE

You have at least learned that you cannot rely on the police to protect you. If your local laws allow, get a CCW permit and buy a firearm, take safety and training classes, and shoot a LOT. If you can't carry concealed, see if you can carry open. That is a deterrent too, but you have no surprise.

Or next time come out swinging a samurai sword and scream like a maniac. That will scare them off... unless one of them has a gun and shoots you.

Try no starting fights you don't have to start...

[detroit]

fourthed

[The Dad]

Another vote for life's too fucking short.

[leroy jenkins]

Move, but short of that, I'd say don't talk shit to people you know you have no chance against. Although carrying a gun makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside too.

[addict]

What you did was right, you need to run. Doesn't matter what self defense, 1 against many you are fucked. Up to 3 you have a slight chance, more and you're in trouble if they have any idea what they're doing. I do a (I hate to use this phrase) "street oriented" type of wing chun with a lot of other stuff thrown in. My sifu doesn't stick to tradition, and it's good to have, i've used it a couple of times in mugging situations where it happens fast and you have no choice, but losing pride and running is better than losing internal organs.

Take down martial arts are great, but if there's 2 guys, while you apply a skillful leg lock on the ground your head will be on the receiving end of his buddy's steel caps. And a 300lb guy that knows how to fight, even just gonzo style is not the guy I want to wrestle, some better guys may. I would however be more than happy to eye gouge/kick his balls/hit his throat before running like a wimp before him and his freinds put me in hospital. Basically, martial arts or not, you're outnumbered and any strategist will tell you the only thing you can do is increase your "army" size. Then you get into the delightful little thing called gang warfare. A gun would be a bad idea unless you want to use it and face the prison time for murder. Like everyone said, move.

[72Twenty]

Wait.

You know a 300lb gorilla that can drive a car?!?!?!

You need to call the Letterman show dude.

[MeatPuppet]

Wanting to learn how to fight because you have a situation where it would be useful is like wanting to learn how to swim because the boat you are on is sinking. It's a little late for that.

Take Summit's advice.

Then, if you still want to learn to take care of yourself:

Forget Jujitsu. The last thing you want to do is go to the ground with one guy while his four buddies kick the shit out of you. Or you roll around on a bar floor with broken glass everywhere.

Don't waste your time with Tae Kwon Do. TKD in America is a sport. I am yet to meet a TKD guy who could (in the real world) fight his way out of a wet paper bag.

Jeet Kuen Do is another one to avoid. Lot of well thought out, but poorly implemented ideas. A little of this and a little of that makes for a half baked partial artist who can't do anything well. IME.

I've also heard Hapkido is very good for street defense

My experience would suggest otherwise, but there isn't much of it around so I don't have a lot of exposure to it.

I recently heard Krav Maga is a good art for real world fighting although the kinda stuff they teach is hard to practice in a gym, so it's mostly just theory.

Damn near everything that will actually keep you alive and put somebody down is going to have to be practiced in a modified fashion. KM is one I would steer you towards. Boxing is another, mostly because you get the proper high stress reactionary conditioning necessary to actually use it in a high stress environment.


There is a destination you want to get to(being able to fight well), the art is just the vehicle. The teacher is the guide. Some vehicles are better than others. But the best vehicle in the world won't do shit for you if you don't have a good guide. The best vehicle in the world also won't do shit for you if you haven't been properly trained to use it. Many times an "inferior" vehicle with a good guide will get you to your destination, while a great vehicle with a poor guide will just get you lost. The teacher is far more important than the art.

In order of importance: First is most important.
You.
The teacher.
The training methods.
The art you choose.

[StoneCold]

Unless you spend time in the gym sparring, which you said you didn't want to do, I'd seriously consider a type of class that is geared towards women preventing attacks/sexual assaults. I think you want a class that teaches the kicks to the balls, eye gouges, foot stomps, throat chops, etc.. The last-ditch-effort-to-save-yourself type stuff. The Krav Magna website looks like it has some of that stuff, but I had never heard of it before you mentioned it in your post.

If you are serious about protecting yourself I would sign up for boxing lessons or MMA type stuff and get into the ring and go at it with someone. Real world fights are basic: Fists to face. Most of those fight clips on the internet are unskilled people pounding on the face of their opponent. In my opinion, anyone with a little bit of boxing training stands a much better chance of surviving a fight than someone with basic "self defense techniques." SHIT HAPPENS FAST!

In your case, I agree with what most people are saying. Move. Also, keep running away from the guys. I highly doubt any training you can do in the short term will provide you with the skills you need to defend yourself against multiple three hundred pound people. The pipe is a good start. You need something to equalize the playing field.

The gun is another option, something you'd need to make a personal decision on. A lot depends on where you live. In Colorado, if you are legally allowed to carry a fire arm and you use it in the manner for which you were licensed (as in your life was threatened), you will not go to prison for murder. You'll be sued, but it'll be self defense. I don't think you can get away with that in CA or NY.

But before I would carry a gun I would move. Then take boxing lessons.

Where do you live that you are financially forced to live in such a shitty neighborhood, based on your description? Compton?

Upon rereading your post, I would say another option is to not confront the assholes. Just call the cops from the safety of your dead bolted door and not start a confrontation with someone who is: larger than you, scares you, and based on stereotypes, probably has a gun.

[Chemical Ali' The Wax Master]

pepper spray and a mag light

[Cyber Cop]

You'll stop confronting people and learn to use 911 when you get your ass beat.

[Zeedashbo]

go beat some ass. likely they don't give a fuck so why should you. i go toe up with mutherfuckers twice my size all the time. 99% of the time nothing happens. take the first punch, fight back with all anger. and if you lose fuck that guy up with a weapon.

[spindrift]

go beat some ass. likely they don't give a fuck so why should you. i go toe up with mutherfuckers twice my size all the time. 99% of the time nothing happens. take the first punch, fight back with all anger. and if you lose fuck that guy up with a weapon.

or move...

[gh444]

pepper spray and a mag light

yep

You'll stop confronting people and learn to use 911 when you get your ass beat.

yep


Gun?

Nope


-aaron

[Vets]

I'm surprised that no one has suggested this:


However, in all seriousness, I would probably have to agree with the advice to move.

[JBrian]

Wait.
You know a 300lb gorilla that can drive a car?!?!?!
You need to call the Letterman show dude.

I don't know him and I don't associate with "gangsta" fucktards. My advice to you is to call an agent and run an ad on CL "missed connections" (sfbay.craigslist.org) or "talent needed," - this could be the break you've been waiting for!! I have enough on my plate and I think Dave is annoying..

RE: CCW, trust me, I want one. I'm all but married to a convicted felon (she's a good girl now) and we can't have a gun in the house. Mace was mentioned and I have some, I didn't have it with me when the shit escalated which is my own fault. I've used it before and I could have used it last night although I hear California takes pepper spray pretty seriously. There were several witnesses that could attest self-defense on my part though.

Basically what happened is some drunk asshole climbed up on our roof and started throwing shit at cars and people. By the time I was out there, there were three dudes hanging around, one appearing from the property who I suspect was the one on the roof because he disappeared quickly, and I was grilling them about who they were and who was on the roof throwing shit, at this point the cops had been called (at least) twice and things were under reasonable control although I was pissed off.

Then out of nowhere, a newer white Cadillac shows up and I suddenly have a gorilla in my face. I have no idea who he was or what his relation was with all this. He was dressed similarly to some kids that sell crack and weed on the corner so it may be a territorial thing, I don't know. All I know is that after not backing down from him and trying to get his tag number, he tried to chase me down. If that fucker had caught me, I'd be in pieces hence the renewed interest in self defense, grappling and knowing pressure points could have made a huge difference if he had got a hold of me. Again, he came out of nowhere and it all escalated very quickly.

I live in Santa Cruz, a nice little California tourist trap by the sea. Big wooden roller coaster, kick ass surfing and all the tourists, shopping, crack, heroin, shootings and stabbings you could ever want. And oh, yeah, the coastline is beautiful and I can make Kirkwood in 3.5 hours. Unfortunately the cost of housing is through the roof assuming you can find someone to rent to you, and if you aren't a 22 year old lesbian with new tattoos and three facial piercings, you won't get a place for under $2k/mo. (I pray every night that I wake up a 22 year old lesbian but so far, no dice.)

I have a couple friends that had a flat in the outer Mission in SF until last year. One guy I know really well and the other was his roomate. My buddy is east indian (although born and raised in OC) and looks like he could be latino. He got mugged a couple times but was never injured although a little shook up. His roomate got mugged a couple times too. They pretty much took it in stride. Then a few months ago the roomate was coming back from the Mission bar on 23rd and was confronted by like 3 15 year olds, they pistol whipped the shit out of him, within inches of his life and nearly caused permanent damage, he coulda easily been killed - over the few dollars he had in his pocket. My friend moved and now lives in a bad part of Oakland and feels much safer these days.

I appreciate the realistic feedback. I am willing to spend time in a gym I just don't care about belts and ranks and shit like that. I'm leaning towards a mix of boxing and jiu-jitsu for the grappling and maybe Krav Maga for the theory. I did consider rex-kwan-do but I'm convinced that guy is a fag and his "wife" is a man which creeps me out, plus his students are really fucking weird..

[JBrian]

Meh, it hung on submit and I double posted..

[MeatPuppet]

I'm leaning towards a mix of boxing and jiu-jitsu for the grappling and maybe Krav Maga for the theory.

Martial arts are a lot like airplanes. They consist of a set of interlocking parts that are designed to work together.

What you are talking about doing is taking the wings of one airplane and sticking it on the fuselage of another airplane then taking the engine from an entirely different airplane, putting it all together and expecting it to fly well.

If that's really what you want to do, knock yourself out. But you would be far better off picking one system and learning it well. Then, after you know one system really, really well(15-20 hours a week for 5-6 years, min), maybe look to another system to augment your training, if you feel the need.

There are no quick fixes in your situation. If you attempt a quick fix, you are probably going to get your ass kicked.

Imagine someone saying they wanted to be able to go everywhere on the mountain that had snow. So, to do this, they were going to take ski lessons, then they were going to take snowboard lessons, then, because they liked the theory, they were going to take some lessons on telemark skis and take them all at the same times with the intent of taking the best techniques from each approach.

Pick one thing(the initial choice is critical), learn it well, it will take you where you want to go far better than the cafeteria approach.

[addict]

self defense, grappling and knowing pressure points could have made a huge difference if he had got a hold of me.

Pressure points are great, but if a "300lb gorilla" is raining blows on you, pressing the nerve under his arm or some other mystical technique is a little unrealistc. Like I said, throat, eyes and groin are a lot more effective than a pressure point.

Also meat puppet is on the money here, good analogies and good advice. I know some people who have done Krav Magda, it's pretty basic, and with the right person to learn from/with it would be great. But it all depends on the person you learn with/from, it could also be useless.

This: http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/ is the TGR of martial arts in general. Like TGR it is full of characters and opinions. Haven't been on there for a while but there's some good people if you take it with a grain of salt, it might help you with people in your area who will give or share what you are looking for.

[house]

"I don't know you, that's my purse!"

[Tuckerman]

300lbs vs 180lbs you'll run circles around that fool. Just don't set him get a hold of you.


MMA is the way to go. After a few months we'll become proficient you'll learn a little bit of no Gi Jiu-Jitsu or catch wrestling, dirty boxing, Mui Ti Kick Boxing and maybe some Jodo. You'll become fight fit with strong hips and good balance (good for skiing). Just be aware that you will be able to hurt people badly. A heel hook can cause inoperable damage to someones leg, and they will be walking with a cane for the rest of their life.

Krav Maga, don't waste your time. Boxing uses a lot of bending at the knees to avoid getting punched, do that in the street or against a well rounded fighter and you'll get kicked in the face. Boxers don't have to worry about getting kicked or keened in the ring.

Or just move.

[DJSapp]

Most importantly, find a system that involves full contact sparring and body conditioning as part of your training. All the bag kicks and strikes in the world will not help you against a living, moving, thinking opponent, or how you will react once you take a blow.

That said, I'm a fan of Choy Li Fut. Plenty of knees, elbows, kicks and speed to be a highly effective defense system.

edit: and Santa Cruz sucks. Move.

[Phill]

How did you end up in the situation in the first place