Muscle Cramps...some more prone than others?

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 05-11-2007, 12:03 PM

Are some people more prone to muscle cramps than others?

I recently played my first outdoor soccer game of the season. Going into it, I knew I wasn't anywhere close to good enough shape to play an entire game as i've just begun my summer running/cycling training program, but I figured no big deal 'cause we usually have a ton of subs anyway. it's a super-competitive league, very intense, with lots of current college players and guys from the local Sacto semi-pro team (Sacto Knights) (e.g. lots of guys much faster and better shape than me

)

anyway, it turns out we had no subs, and in fact, had to play a man short the entire game, which resulted in me having to play mid-field for a solid 90 minutes with one less player. By the second half, when I'd go to sprint or make a few quick lateral moves, I could feel my calves begin to want to cramp up. I knew it was going to be tough to make it through the game without them locking up.

So sure enough, with about 5 minutes to go, as I am cocking my foot back to blast a shot from the penalty area, my right calf just locked and completely siezed up while I was in mid-shot. Holy FUCK that hurts. It was seized up for about a minute as my players massaged and stretch the fuck out of it to get it to release (shit that's a slow pitch).

Anyway, this shit has happened to me before (all at horrible competitive moments).....during the Downieville Classic Mtn. bike race a few years ago...calf muscles cramping and locking up not long after the brutal 4,000 ft climb. Last year it happened during the second running stage of a run-bike-run duathlon. I was in second place overall when with about a mile to go, my calves cramped and locked and I had to stop and stretch them and walk a bit so i could continue to finish. this caused me to drop from 2nd overal to 3rd.

so WTF? aside from the most recent episode where I know I was not in shape to play a full intense 90 minutes, I'm still constantly hydrating, eating bananas (potassium deficiency?), etc. I guess i just need to strech more?

I'm just curious if to see if this happens frequently to anyone else as it seems to happen to me all to frequently. Are some people more prone to it than others for some reason?

**pechelman** · 05-11-2007, 12:13 PM

This sounds just like me, of course it hasnt been happening to me the past 2 seasons.

Generally I started every biking season with having both my calves cramp. Not both at the same time, just one, and then the other. It always made for a slow start to the season. I stretched a ton and it didnt make much a difference. After their 1 cramp each, and letting them rest for 5ish days, I was good to go for the rest of the season.

You might also try drinking either pickle juice or something with lots of vinegar.

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 05-11-2007, 12:36 PM

pickle juice? vinegar? never hear of that one!

aside from stretching, potential B vitamin, potassium, salt, dehydration etc deficiencies..can't say i've heard of vinegar. what's the deal with that?

**Buster Highmen** · 05-11-2007, 02:34 PM

Diet can has a significant effect. I think calcium and sodium/potassium are pretty essential.

http://www.acu-cell.com/dis-mus.html

So drink a lot of water take salt pills, calcium and eat bananas.

**Buzzworthy** · 05-11-2007, 02:34 PM

Drink more water. I used to cramp. Now I don't.

**philippeR** · 05-11-2007, 04:56 PM

Stop running and watch more TV ?

**TurxSki** · 05-11-2007, 05:38 PM

I had similar pain, and was told it was a Strain, caused through overuse, and repetition...and getting old

Might be some insights, or advice for you, in that thread
http://tetongravity.com/forums/showt...ht=calf+strain

**MeatPuppet** · 05-11-2007, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces

Are some people more prone to muscle cramps than others?

Yeah, I think some people are more prone to it than others. I almost never cramp. Never have either, not as a reoccurring problem. But one of my old running buddies cramped all the time. We had almost identical diets/workout routines/body types, etc. The only noticeable difference between us was that I am naturally very flexible(so much so that I have to be careful to have really good form when I stretch, otherwise I'll damage my joints) and he's naturally very non flexible. I don't know if that has anything to do with it or not. But it was the only noticeable difference between us that might explain his constant fight with muscle cramps.

**Mgof** · 05-12-2007, 12:43 AM

Qualifier: All or none of this could be true, please call me out if you know better.

So obviously a muscle cramp is the result of uncontrolled and constant contraction of the muscle involved. The basic sequence of a normal muscle contraction is as follows: 1) an electro-chemical gradient is setup across an internal membrane in the muscle cell (this involves sodium, potassium, and calcium), 2) a nerve signal stimulates the cell resulting in an influx of calcium ions, 3) the calcium binds a protein complex (troponin/tropomyosin), which is displaced, allowing the interaction of myosin and actin fibers that 'pull' along eachother (myosin 'pulls' on actin, this step involves the hydrolysis of ATP), and the muscle contracts, 4) various ion channels/pumps restore the electro-chemical gradient by redistribution of potassium, sodium, and calcium ions, 5) the muscle cell 'relaxes'. So to my knowledge, several factors might lead to muscle cramps, including: water/electrolyte imbalance, energy depletion, overall muscle imbalance, and muscular tone. Basically, hydration, feeding, salt homeostasis, sport specific fitness, and individual physiology might all play a role in cramping. In other words, I think it'd be very difficult to determine why one person cramps and another does not. All things being equal (i.e. adequate hydration, nutrition, fitness), one might be genetically predisposed to cramping on several levels. Certainly, polymorphism's in the genes encoding ion handling proteins in the muscle cell could predispose one to cramps. Also, simple inadequate absorption of nutrients in the gut would be a problem. Water/salt balance is controlled on a neurological and endocrine level as well. Essentially signals are sent into circulation that 'tell' the kidney how much water/salt to retain/excrete, so the necessary nutrients might be ending up in the bladder instead of muscle cells. More simply, if one's been skiing all winter and then plays soccer or bikes, and the calf cramps up, perhaps simple tone or muscular imbalance issues are at play.

In summary: I'm not a doctor, but I play one on TGR.

**dn4989** · 05-12-2007, 07:54 AM

Potassium is the key! Eat Bananas.

Or just sit on the couch!

**TWINS** · 05-12-2007, 08:56 AM

ThermoTabs.They are sold at RiteAid.You have to ask for them at the Pharmacy.Non prescription but behind the counter.Inexpensive and might do the job for you.They work for me.Bananas are your friends.

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 05-12-2007, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by Mgof

Qualifier: All or none of this could be true, please call me out if you know better.

So obviously a muscle cramp is the result of uncontrolled and constant contraction of the muscle involved. The basic sequence of a normal muscle contraction is as follows: 1) an electro-chemical gradient is setup across an internal membrane in the muscle cell (this involves sodium, potassium, and calcium), 2) a nerve signal stimulates the cell resulting in an influx of calcium ions, 3) the calcium binds a protein complex (troponin/tropomyosin), which is displaced, allowing the interaction of myosin and actin fibers that 'pull' along eachother (myosin 'pulls' on actin, this step involves the hydrolysis of ATP), and the muscle contracts, 4) various ion channels/pumps restore the electro-chemical gradient by redistribution of potassium, sodium, and calcium ions, 5) the muscle cell 'relaxes'. So to my knowledge, several factors might lead to muscle cramps, including: water/electrolyte imbalance, energy depletion, overall muscle imbalance, and muscular tone. Basically, hydration, feeding, salt homeostasis, sport specific fitness, and individual physiology might all play a role in cramping. In other words, I think it'd be very difficult to determine why one person cramps and another does not. All things being equal (i.e. adequate hydration, nutrition, fitness), one might be genetically predisposed to cramping on several levels. Certainly, polymorphism's in the genes encoding ion handling proteins in the muscle cell could predispose one to cramps. Also, simple inadequate absorption of nutrients in the gut would be a problem. Water/salt balance is controlled on a neurological and endocrine level as well. Essentially signals are sent into circulation that 'tell' the kidney how much water/salt to retain/excrete, so the necessary nutrients might be ending up in the bladder instead of muscle cells. More simply, if one's been skiing all winter and then plays soccer or bikes, and the calf cramps up, perhaps simple tone or muscular imbalance issues are at play.

In summary: I'm not a doctor, but I play one on TGR.

It's been awhile since my physiology classes, but i hear what you're saying.

And I'm guessing researchers have better things to do than look for genetic markers or create a diagnostic array that would show if someone is more predisposed to muscle cramping than another

meatpuppet -- yeah, i'd definitely throw myself into the generally non-flexible bin.

had a deep tissue massage last night

, and it when it came to my right calf, there was clearly a huge deep golf ball-ish sized knot in there that was so fucking tender to get worked out.

**Spats** · 05-13-2007, 11:41 PM

Potassium salt:

Try dissolving a bunch in water and drinking that prior to exercise, and see if that makes a difference.

**Vinman** · 05-14-2007, 04:07 PM

ty most of your cramping sounds like it comes from one of two things, fatigue or dehydration.

recent soccer game, fatigue/out of shape possible dehydration, or lack of energy stores

downiville, nutrition, fatigue or dehaydration.

In short you need to experiment with your pre-event and during event nutrition and hydration. Also is you are a heavy sweater you might need a drink with some electrolytes in it. I like Gatorade endurance. Less sweet that gatorade with a touch more salts.

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 05-14-2007, 04:30 PM

you're probably right vin. recent soccer cramping episode was indeed most likely fatigue. Since that episode, I've played 2 more full games with no problems and now that I'm getting back into shape it's been fine.

The downieville XC race incident was definitely a matter of dehydration (and perhaps fatigue). We had gone on nutty long strenuous ride the day before (not smart before a race), and I blew through all my water on the initial 4K climb and was still thirsty and then the cramping settled in.

Been training again for some long century road rides with lots of climbing and went on my longest ride of the season so far with no problems yesterday. 80 miles with about 6700 ft of climbing and I made sure I was thoroughly hydrated throughout the day. I was clearly intaking more fluids than most others in my riding group, but I'm just hyper-sensitive now to having this happen to me again.

**pechelman** · 05-14-2007, 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces

pickle juice? vinegar? never hear of that one!

aside from stretching, potential B vitamin, potassium, salt, dehydration etc deficiencies..can't say i've heard of vinegar. what's the deal with that?

yea

its cheap and pretty available in most houses

pickle juice cause its got salt (electros) and vinegar

vinegars, have acetic acid, which helps produce acetylcholine, a stimulant for your leg muscles. If I understand it right, it helps the electrolytes do their job by allowing them more mobilization, or something.

furrthermore, apple cider vinegar, is really high in potassium.

dont go crazy
like a few spoonfull or so in a bottle
or one quick swig of pickle

**Crud's Uncle** · 05-20-2007, 04:53 AM

Stop playing Euro gay sports and get involved in a mans sport.

**Yossarian** · 05-21-2007, 02:34 PM

Ha! I laugh in your general direction Ty, but only because familiarity breeds amusement, or something like that.

Seeing as how I play at a similar skill level (i.e. not enough) in the identical corresponding league here in Denver (we have a player who plays against your Sac semi-pro team on the Colorado Crimson here; there's a few Colorado Rapids reserves players in the league; and apparently Marcelo Balboa just started playing with one of the teams too, how unfair is that?), and also like to ski like you (or at least, I wish I could), and am the same age as you, and blah blah blah...

I think it's funny because this used to happen to me in high school, and happens once in a while in the first few matches in a season if I have to go the full 90mins.

Fatigue and dehydration, that's all. Salt, bananas, lots of water, and more match fitness always cures it!

So, want to come out to CO and play in the Breck or Vail tournaments this summer? Good times!

**chaka** · 05-21-2007, 05:23 PM

Ty- I hear you, I have dealt on and off with pretty severe cramping, mostly during longer mtn bike rides and the occasional long format race. During the Coolest 24 Hr Mtn bike race a couple weeks ago, (which kicked ass btw, and you should check it out next year as a fellow greater sacto area local) I finished one of my laps on the verge of leg cramps, and a fellow racer threw me a bottle of these:
http://www.succeedscaps.com/main_scaps.html

Basically a combo potassium, sodium charger I think. Was warned the first five or so minutes after taking them I might experience a bit of stomach upset, I didn't, and man, for once, no cramping as I finished out the race. That was probably the first time I was cramp free on an extended event. I'm sure there are food sources which can deliver similar results, but FWIW, these were gold for me.

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 05-21-2007, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by Crud's Uncle

Stop playing Euro gay sports and get involved in a mans sport.

Ha! I laugh in your general direction Ty, but only because familiarity breeds amusement, or something like that.

Seeing as how I play at a similar skill level (i.e. not enough) in the identical corresponding league here in Denver (we have a player who plays against your Sac semi-pro team on the Colorado Crimson here; there's a few Colorado Rapids reserves players in the league; and apparently Marcelo Balboa just started playing with one of the teams too, how unfair is that?), and also like to ski like you (or at least, I wish I could), and am the same age as you, and blah blah blah...

I think it's funny because this used to happen to me in high school, and happens once in a while in the first few matches in a season if I have to go the full 90mins.

Fatigue and dehydration, that's all. Salt, bananas, lots of water, and more match fitness always cures it!

So, want to come out to CO and play in the Breck or Vail tournaments this summer? Good times!

ha..funny shit. Yeah I'm pretty much over it (the early season out-of-shape cramping) now for the time being I hope. Played a few full 90's, have done some nuttty long road rides in the heat...and no problems anymore.

Breck & Vail tournaments? Ummmm...sure?

Ty- I hear you, I have dealt on and off with pretty severe cramping, mostly during longer mtn bike rides and the occasional long format race. During the Coolest 24 Hr Mtn bike race a couple weeks ago, (which kicked ass btw, and you should check it out next year as a fellow greater sacto area local) I finished one of my laps on the verge of leg cramps, and a fellow racer threw me a bottle of these:
http://www.succeedscaps.com/main_scaps.html

Basically a combo potassium, sodium charger I think. Was warned the first five or so minutes after taking them I might experience a bit of stomach upset, I didn't, and man, for once, no cramping as I finished out the race. That was probably the first time I was cramp free on an extended event. I'm sure there are food sources which can deliver similar results, but FWIW, these were gold for me.

A buddy of mine on our road ride yesterday downed a few of those caps. His hamstrings started cramping on our longest climb (Mosquito Rd just north of Placerville) and he had to stop and rest and take those so he could make it back to Folsom. Wouldn't be a bad idea to keep a few as an emergency especially as it starts getting hotter.

So you did the Cool 24 huh? I totally forgot about that thing. A bunch of us were in the middle of our long weekend ride the other week when our route took us right past the staging area at the school off of hwy 49. Was wondering if I knew anyone there. Congrats on doing that sucker!

**chaka** · 05-22-2007, 07:40 AM

Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces

Congrats on doing that sucker!

thx. very well organized, fun event, except for the manual timing station, that is supposed to be automated next year. Great loop for a race format as well, good mix of terrain. You should def check it out.

**Tuckerman** · 05-23-2007, 08:20 AM

Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces

I'm just curious if to see if this happens frequently to anyone else as it seems to happen to me all to frequently. Are some people more prone to it than others for some reason?

Happens to me a lot. Especially on days when I have MMA like last night. I run 4 miles at lunch then have MMA and last night I had to tap out twice while rolling for no other reason than my calf is always cramping so badly. I drink at least 64 oz of water a day and eat a banana for breakfast and two for lunch. I also eat pretzel rods at lunch that are loaded with salt. I'm thinking of just eating packets of salt.

**ArmadaBC** · 05-29-2007, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by Tuckerman

I'm thinking of just eating packets of salt.

I tried that once two or three years ago, It is alot harder to get down multiple packets of salt than you would think. I noticed while surfing in mid 50 water my calfs would cramp up pretty good, the salt did almost nothing while a good 4/3 wetsuit fixed the whole thing up.

**Tuckerman** · 05-30-2007, 08:09 AM

I have been using the ThermoTabs as suggested here and it works great.

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 03-29-2009, 11:46 AM

BUMPing this old thread....

I found my solution to the cramping in endurance events. PICKLE JUICE. I think Pechelman or Vin recommended this somewhere in this tread.

I never tried it before, but yesterday I raced solo singlespeed in an 8-hour endurance race and a bunch of team mates were swearing by taking some pickle juice in a flask and taking some as soon as they'd feel a cramp twinge and it would help hold it off. so I figured I'd try.

so on my 5th lap (out of 9 total I ended up doing), I felt some cramping twinges in my quads while trying to power up a climb, so I stopped, and downed my flask of pickle juice. Worked wonders. didn't feel any more cramping coming on until my last lap, when I downed some more. I think i'm sold.

pickle juice. pickle juice. pickle juice.