Thread: Cloudveil Rayzar pants (and Koven) vs Patagonia Super Guide

Hi,

Has anybody tried these two pairs of pants and been able to compare them? The Rayzar's MSRP is $245 while the Super Guide's is $145.

My summer/spring pants are all from Clouveil and I love them: they're nice and durable (I have a zipper issue but don't doubt that Cloudveil will fix it). I've also been happy with Patagonia gear, so I am looking for experience in the field.

I want these pants for skiing and climbing (incl. ice climbing) in winter. I hve some Switchback pants that I have been using for spring/summer backcountry skiing but then I need gaiters and all that stuff I don't want to have to deal with when I ski in bounds.

What about the Koven too? I am not really looking for a shell but it looks interesting.

Thanks!
drC

I use the older style Patagonia guide pants and love for spring conditions, but they are not heavy enough/water proof enough for winter. The nes super guides are much heavier, but I would still be concerned about wetting. It appears to be the same material, just thicker. The guide pants are bomb proof after several seasons.

Crash, I put a small rip in my fairly new Koven pant that time we were on Rainier, I don't know how. Anywho, I don't think these are very durable as I've had other pants that I've used and abused for years and those held up very well.

cloudveil markets the koven line for ice climbing, whereas the rayzar is more a BC skiing pant.

i've been psyched on my koven jacket, which stood up to a 130-day season of skiing, hiking, climbing with no issues. i'm looking at the koven pant if i can 'form it... i would have no hesitation buying it.

i don't know anyone using the rayzar, but it's softshell, no? as such, it's not ideal for climbing ice.

Originally Posted by upallnight

i don't know anyone using the rayzar, but it's softshell, no? as such, it's not ideal for climbing ice.

I guess that depends. Since about fall of 01 if it's winter I've been wearing a pair of Mammut Castor pants (some sort of Schoeller fabric); ice climbing, lift-served, BC, whatever - they work. I've sprayed them down with some DWR stuff once or twice and they're still going strong. They're not totally waterproof, and can wet through when the ice is really dripping, but they dry out quickly and to be honest it really doesn't bother me.
YMMV of course, but for me the breathability and increased mobility balances out the disadvantages them not being totally waterproof.

just looked up both in last year's CV catalog... the rayzar is water resistant; the koven, waterproof w/ full side zips.

I've got the Rayzors, they are similar to the Symmetry pant that have been very popular touring pants for years. They are Schoeller fabrice, but with reinforced knees (maybe butt too, cant remember right now) powder cuffs which I dont use, and built in suspenders which I like. I was going to get Symmetries, but the Rayzors fit a lot better on me. The Kovens are Gore tex with full side zips I think, and my buddy tours in them and loves them. I give the Rayzors a thumbs up overall, it feels a bit weird touring in soft shells at first (for me at least) but im not constantly screwing with the side zips to vent, and I never accidentally leave them down then fill my pants with snow when I fall, which of course I do plenty of.

i wasn't a fan of my patagonia super guide pants for reasons previously mentioned. i have used the koven pant and jacket for a short time in spring and loved them both. they were very comfortable and breath well. my only complaint about hte pants would be that they need a higher leg guard for cramponing. my eider pants have that part down but they did not hold up as well as i've hoped they would. after half a season with only touring they had seams coming unstitched. anyone know if eider warranties or repairs their gear?

Originally Posted by wilcox510

The Kovens are Gore tex with full side zips I think, and my buddy tours in them and loves them.

thanks for the field report on the Rayzars.

Minor point...the Koven series is not soft-shell, but it's also not one of CV's GoreTex items. It's "EV3"...CV's waterproof material.

Originally Posted by upallnight

i'm looking at the koven pant if i can 'form it...

If they're not changing the design this year and you wear a size M I've seen it online for less than the generic 'form price is (dunno about shop people).

I'm a soft shell guy. And yes sometimes it hurts but hey.

drC

my 0.02, i've got the guide pant and love them for spring touring, etc but yes, they're too thin/wimpy for winter, BUT the new super guides have been quite substantially redesigned to be more core, so i'd try to find 'em in a shop to check them out.

Originally Posted by Dr. Crash

If they're not changing the design this year and you wear a size M I've seen it online for less than the generic 'form price is (dunno about shop people).

let us in on your secret stash. i'd love to find a deal on those. and yes, i wear a medium. we could have swaped for my super guides.

Hey upallnight your box is full, so I can't reply to you. I saw the Koven on STP recently for a decent price, and I think a Google search may lead some more deals.

drC

Originally Posted by Dr. Crash

Hey upallnight your box is full, so I can't reply to you. I saw the Koven on STP recently for a decent price, and I think a Google search may lead some more deals.

drC

d'oh! guess i'm too late. they only have men's small now.

thanks, though.