Thread: PMGEAR and Maggots worm their way into a book.

A while back, Pat Keane and myself were interviewed for a book being written by John Winsor. Winsor was writing a business book called SPARK. A glance at the dustcover shows why he gave Pat and I a call:

"Winsor is CEO and founder of Radar Communications and author of Beyond the Brand (2004). Defining innovation as a system of "co-creating with your customers and your fellow employees," he goes on to present, in this sprightly little handbook brimming with wisdom and energy, ideas on how business enterprises can spur innovation--co-creation, that is. His book is divided into four sections that correspond to the four basic spheres of a business "ecosystem": the employer's particular company "team," the pursuits of the company itself, the customer, and the nature of the company culture. These obviously are the primary arenas in which companies should concentrate their innovation practices. In the ideal situation, which Winsor guides the reader toward understanding, the best innovative inspirations of all four areas are integrated into one great innovative performance. Profiles of especially innovative business thinkers are included, as practical guidance, and feature Matt Jacobsen of Quicksilver, Mike Parker of Nike, and Christine Halvorson of Stonyfield Farms. A book bound to generate plenty of spark."

No one is ever going to accuse any of the PMGEAR founders of being business geniuses. We just did what we thought made sense, what came naturally, and what we had to do to make shit work. Turns out someone thinks its a good idea. We could not have done any of it without maggots. We co-created (and continue to create) our company and our skis with the Maggots. Will it work? So far... let's be honest... it's been really fucking painful. But time will tell if the growing pains will finally subside and lead to our eventual success.

Here's Mr. Winsor's entry about PMGEAR in his SPARK blog:

Let the Culture Create Itself

I was looking for a way to introduce the open source philosophy in the context of innovation when I thought of Pat Keane. When you meet Pat, a cofounder of PM Gear, the first thing you realize is how passionate he is about what he does. Heck, he calls himself a “Maggot;” that seems pretty passionate to me! Another thing I really like about the company’s perspective is their real focus on acting as the conduit to help push the culture forward; in this case, it’s the backcountry ski culture.

This energy and perspective is not unique; every industry, from software to automobiles, has small companies owned by passionate customers that have made their passions a business reality. But the guys at PM Gear have followed a creative path to take them where they are today.

While this happened a few years ago, our networked society has put PM Gear and its ski customers-turned-business owners into direct competition with bigger, more established brands. Some people inside larger organizations might think that their customers couldn’t possibly start competing with them. However, one only has to look at Microsoft and the threat that open-source software has provided them to realize that none of us are immune.

In this day and age, with our deepest secrets being shared online, and access to our suppliers and technologies no longer unique, the only way to survive is to engage customers and their culture in the process of co-creating innovation.

Whether you are PM Gear or IBM, you have no choice if you want to keep up today. This means being open, sharing both your successes and your failures, engaging in your culture in a very real, participatory way and often, operating at the speed of light.

How can you take advantage of the open source philosophy in your business?

To see Winsor's blog, go here: http://www.johnwinsor.com/spark/2005...e_culture.html

Anyway, back to the business of making skis. I wanted to give you all an update from the factory floor with pictures.


New stiffs with black base.


Hulk green base.


Profile shot of the higher tail tip against a last years
model. This year, the tails are slightly more turned up.


Base profile comparison. Old on left, new on right.

It's a cleaner line, the waist of the ski moved back 2 cm to
allow a slight move back on the boot center.


Hulk Green bases.


Cores coming out of sander.

Aaaarghhhh

Must


Have


Hulk


Green



Bases !!!

I wish you nothing but luck, focus and perserverence. If it grows, and eventually works, it will be one of the GREAT stories in the industry. Keep it up!

Wow. Very cool. As a customer -- bags, Bros, which I am, ahem, awaiting patiently as Schweitzer is about to open this weekend -- I can affirm that while everyone seems willing to share in and talk about your success, and that's rare enough, you've been astonishingly open with your customers about your setbacks and problems. I can't help but think that will pay dividends down the line. Great job and best of luck.

Originally Posted by lingcod

Wow. Very cool. As a customer -- bags, Bros, which I am, ahem, awaiting patiently as Schweitzer is about to open this weekend -- I can affirm that while everyone seems willing to share in and talk about your success, and that's rare enough, you've been astonishingly open with your customers about your setbacks and problems. I can't help but think that will pay dividends down the line. Great job and best of luck.

It's not always pretty, but it's always pretty honest.

glad i got some from the first year; special in a attending only the very first Summit kind of way

but this year's crop sounds like the shizzle
1. better bases
2. stronger edges (not that last year's weren't burly enough)
3. better sidewalls due to forms with sidewalls
4. baby blue sidewalls
5. boot center back 2cm's
6. more turned up tail
7. carbon fiber
8. and the mutha fuck'n HULK GREEN BASES

sickter mcrickter improvements fo shoo
nice work boys

kinda makes me wonder what the Ho Model will eventually look like

Could you guys come up with a base that changes from black to green for Xover and the rest of the pain train? That way, we could glance over our shoulder and see the Hulk colors changing and get the fukk out of the way as Xover and his posse come charging through.

Originally Posted by Trackhead

That way, we could glance over our shoulder and see the Hulk colors changing and get the fukk out of the way as Xover and his posse come charging through.

#1 you'll never be in front of me on the way down so you won't have to worry

#2 unless of course i'm lapping your bitch ass while your skiing with your buddy Red Baron

Now Xover, why'd you have to go drag me into this?

Any word on shipping dates?

Originally Posted by SkiEvil

Any word on shipping dates?

Skis are rolling off the presses literally right now and shipping will commence soon after! Pat will chime in here soon with more concrete information as it is available.

Notice the heavily bruised left shoulder from 'nudging' people out of the way.

Originally Posted by Red Baron

Now Xover, why'd you have to go drag me into this?

too try and cue Powho

Originally Posted by Trackhead

Could you guys come up with a base that changes from black to green for Xover and the rest of the pain train? That way, we could glance over our shoulder and see the Hulk colors changing and get the fukk out of the way as Xover and his posse come charging through.

We have teams of engineers working on this now.

Originally Posted by SkiEvil

Any word on shipping dates?

I'll start shipping skis out today or tomorrow in boxes of ten pair and some singles to Canucks. It'll take about 12 days for them to clear customs and arrive in Reno. I'll be back by then with a pair or two to doublecheck the boot center marks before shipping then out. So, about two weeks from today, Bros will be winging their way to everyone. New, better, and improved.

We cut the bases and a mold for the 179's last night -The next project to get attention as soon as everyone's skis are shipped. Thanks to those waiting. The shipping process will not be strung out like it was last year. Thank God!

Great news! Waiting with bindings in hand....

Did I miss this? Why did the boot centre move 2cm back?

Originally Posted by Tectonically_Neglected

Did I miss this? Why did the boot centre move 2cm back?

Although we kept the same dimensions of the ski (125-99-114), we changed it's profile slightly. I.e. The narrowest part of the ski is now just a tad closer to the tail.

Originally Posted by splat

I'll start shipping skis out today or tomorrow in boxes of ten pair and some singles to Canucks.

Arrgh! E-mailing you now Pat.

Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces

Although we kept the same dimensions of the ski (125-99-114), we changed it's profile slightly. I.e. The narrowest part of the ski is now just a tad closer to the tail.

This I understood. This is what was previously posted.

But maybe my english sucks, so let me rephrase my question in totally different wording:

WHY did the bootcentre move 2cm back?

Originally Posted by Tectonically_Neglected

WHY did the bootcentre move 2cm back?

Ty, Dos Planka and Splat,

allow me the priviledge to answer this one

TN - if you have skied them you know why biiiatch!!

does that answer your question

Originally Posted by Xover

Ty, Dos Planka and Splat,

allow me the priviledge to answer this one

TN - if you have skied them you know why biiiatch!!

does that answer your question

So send me a pair and I'll tell you if the boot centre is just right.

(Tell you what, once my Beasts get trashed, I'll buy a pair off you guys if the wallet allows it... get the shipping to the Netherlands down!)

I am happy to read you view answering me as a privilege. If you like I could write up a few more Q's, if that makes you feel good.

As for stemming my curiosity: I find your answer still lacking somewhat in detail and useful info. So in short, fuck no it does not answer my question, thanks for asking.

Originally Posted by Tectonically_Neglected

Did I miss this? Why did the boot centre move 2cm back?

Taking a wild guess here - to prevent tip dive in powder, which may have been a problem especially with stiffer models?
Eagerly awaiting a pair to test this theory..

Looks like I picked a good time to check in....

We moved the narrowest part of the waist back, not necessarily the boot center back, 2 cm because even though the Bros skied just fine last year, they are so center-mounted it can be disarming. In fact, some maggots moved their bindings back that far, even though it diminishes performance because the sweet spot for boot center is very small.

At the same time, we clean up the CAD profile for smoother lines all the way through the base profile. In all, we've made the Bros a better ski. As a result of this change, which really is quite minor, we will test the skis to see how much that optimum boot center line changed before we ship out to anyone. We nailed it quite well last year. I hope this answers your question, TN.

PS - Xover talks like that in real life, too.

Originally Posted by splat

Looks like I picked a good time to check in....

We moved the narrowest part of the waist back, not necessarily the boot center back, 2 cm because even though the Bros skied just fine last year, they are so center-mounted it can be disarming. In fact, some maggots moved their bindings back that far, even though it diminishes performance because the sweet spot for boot center is very small.

At the same time, we clean up the CAD profile for smoother lines all the way through the base profile. In all, we've made the Bros a better ski. As a result of this change, which really is quite minor, we will test the skis to see how much that optimum boot center line changed before we ship out to anyone. We nailed it quite well last year. I hope this answers your question, TN.

PS - Xover talks like that in real life, too.

Why geez, that wasn't too hard now was it? Cheers for the info. And yes, this does answer my curiousity. Guess you'll be hearing feedback quite soon then...

PS I know he was just yanking my chain as I was X's and TY's). No harm done on this side.