UPHILL HIKER HAS R.O.W?

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

ive seen this "rule" in books and magazines and have heard old-timers mention it .........
i yield to uphill hikers, but, in my experiences most hikers do not ..........
is this a courtesy that has gone the way of dinosaurs or just wishful thinking?

[adrenalated]

The way it's supposed to work:
Bikes yield to everyone
Hikers yield to horses
Motorized yields to non motorized
Same type of transport, downhill traffic yields

In practice, use your best judgement. Sometimes it makes more sense for the vehicle traveling downhill to back up, sometimes the uphill hiker wants a rest, etc.

I suspect a lot of newer outdoor enthusiasts may not know these guidelines.

[Buster Highmen]

No, no, no. It's whoever's the biggest most narcissistic, self absorbed asshole that has the ROW. Get with the modern program. So yes, it's gone the way of the dinosaur.

[GeezerSteve]

A few years ago there was a long thread on NWHIkers about this rule. The best evidence is that the rule was first promulgated by hiking groups decades ago, when it was common for a group to be comprised of 20 or 30 or 50 hikers or climbers stacked up in a long line.

As a hard fast rule it makes no sense. The better rule is that the hiker in the better position to step aside should do so and allow the other hiker to pass.

[Tye 1on]

it helps a lot when you're hiking out of the grand canyon...

[TahoeJ]

It all depends if you're closing in on a KOM. ;-) Ugh, Stravassholes are the worst.

[mall walker]

I had always learned that the one heading down (or, heading homeward) has the right of way, since the one going up is deliberately proceeding onward while the one coming down may be exposed/retreating/in emergency... in practice I tend to just yield to anyone I can when convenient though (unless they are being a giant douchebag).

[ogi]

Same type of transport, downhill traffic yields

I don't think things are different on different side of ocean, but normally uphill traffic yields It's same rule or "rule" for cars, bikers, hikers or skiers.

[rudy]

I don't think things are different on different side of ocean, but normally uphill traffic yields It's same rule or "rule" for cars, bikers, hikers or skiers.

I wish that was the case on the bike as I want to keep the speed going on the down and am usually looking for an excuse to break on the way up but it isn't...

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Most of the mtb'ers I encounter now when on foot either try and force you off the trail or just ride around you off the trail if possible. No one yields anymore. I'm a biker too and would identify more with that user group, but mtber today are assholes. They never yield if they're descending and you're climbing on your bike. I don't really like horses and think they should be more restricted than bikes but I'm happy to yield because they're big and dangerous.

[plugboots]

Most of the mtb'ers I encounter now when on foot either try and force you off the trail or just ride around you off the trail if possible. No one yields anymore. I'm a biker too and would identify more with that user group, but mtber today are assholes. They never yield if they're descending and you're climbing on your bike. I don't really like horses and think they should be more restricted than bikes but I'm happy to yield because they're big and dangerous.

I'm riding near Seattle a bit more now and I see this. The trails just get wider.and wider as an effing byproduct too.

[TAFKALVS]

Most of the mtb'ers I encounter now when on foot either try and force you off the trail or just ride around you off the trail if possible. No one yields anymore. I'm a biker too and would identify more with that user group, but mtber today are assholes. They never yield if they're descending and you're climbing on your bike. I don't really like horses and think they should be more restricted than bikes but I'm happy to yield because they're big and dangerous.

freeride lifestyle bruh.

[NW_SKIER]

Horses are dead technology. Why do people still ride them?

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Horses are dead technology. Why do people still ride them?

I think chicks ride them because it feels good.

[old goat]

For the 50 years I've been hiking it's always been uphill hiker has ROW, although I'll step aside for someone with a big pack. The general theory is that if there is a clear right of way people who encounter each other on the trail don't have to guess who's going first--like two people on opposite sides of a door or cars at a 4 way stop who can't figure out who goes next. Makes life easier for everyone. Since what goes up must come down everyone gets to be both the yielder and the yieldee. Makes things fair for everyone in the end. I suspect that those who don't yield to the uphill hiker also don't yield when they're going uphill--in other words their rule is "Me first" whether "me" is going uphill or down. My observation is that this is not a generational thing--people of all ages don't seem aware of the "rule" these days, probably because few people get into hiking in structured situations where there is someone to teach etiquette.

To emphasize--the reason for the rule is not that their is any inherent need for the uphill hiker to go first but because having a rule makes it easier for everyone.

I hate it when I step aside for someone and they want to stop and chat, especially if I'm standing on one foot on a wobbly rock on the edge of a 2000 ft drop off, but also any other time. I don't mind a chat if I'm someplace where you can go days without seeing anyone, but when you're passing people every five minutes--well, if I want to chat that bad I'll go to a bar.

[SJG]

That's why you hike with a stick, and send it into their spokes if they pull this shit. I bike too, but lessons need to be learned, sometimes the hard way.

Most of the mtb'ers I encounter now when on foot either try and force you off the trail or just ride around you off the trail if possible. No one yields anymore. I'm a biker too and would identify more with that user group, but mtber today are assholes. They never yield if they're descending and you're climbing on your bike. I don't really like horses and think they should be more restricted than bikes but I'm happy to yield because they're big and dangerous.

[jmedslc]

case in point - i encountered approx 20 mtb riders on the shoreline trail yesterday. exactly ONE (1) rider yielded to us. we (two humans and a hard of hearing dog) had to dodge slow/moderate moving bikers the entire time we were walking on the trail. it didn't give me the warm and fuzzies. given the season and the limited terrain open right now due to the melt, i find myself in this position often.

my opinion is that if you're going to ride your mtb on a mixed use trail, you should be yielding to walkers. as for foot traffic, i typically give the person walking uphill the ROW, but i found myself pulling over for downhill runners all day yesterday. seems to be easier to letem roll downhill and get back in the track.

Most of the mtb'ers I encounter now when on foot either try and force you off the trail or just ride around you off the trail if possible. No one yields anymore. I'm a biker too and would identify more with that user group, but mtber today are assholes. They never yield if they're descending and you're climbing on your bike. I don't really like horses and think they should be more restricted than bikes but I'm happy to yield because they're big and dangerous.

[char_]

As a hard fast rule it makes no sense. The better rule is that the hiker in the better position to step aside should do so and allow the other hiker to pass.

This is really the best, but it requires others extending courtesy to each other on the trail instead of some sort of entitled "I have ROW" attitude.



Out on a trail run this weekend I had a guy walking side by side with his wife look right at me and then forced me to run around off trail rather than stepping in behind the wife. He did this both times as I ran up and then back down the trail. Both times the trail was at least double wide, no rocks, no drop off, etc.

I learned the uphill traffic has right of way rule on forest roads where uphill traffic might not be able to get going again if forced to stop. Same goes for traffic moving faster or traffic that is much larger than you, pull over and let them go.

[Dantheman]

Most of the mtb'ers I encounter now when on foot either try and force you off the trail or just ride around you off the trail if possible. No one yields anymore. I'm a biker too and would identify more with that user group, but mtber today are assholes. They never yield if they're descending and you're climbing on your bike. I don't really like horses and think they should be more restricted than bikes but I'm happy to yield because they're big and dangerous.

See:

My observation is that this is not a generational thing--people of all ages don't seem aware of the "rule" these days, probably because few people get into hiking in structured situations where there is someone to teach etiquette.

Replace "hiking" with "biking" in old goat's post and I think this nails it. Most people never get taught the etiquette and don't bother reading signs.

I learned the uphill traffic has right of way rule on forest roads where uphill traffic might not be able to get going again if forced to stop.

That has more to do with dirt roads often not being wide enough for passing. When two vehicles encounter each other on a grade where the road is not wide enough to pass, it is much more dangerous for the uphill vehicle to reverse downhill than it is for the downhill vehicle to reverse uphill under power.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

I'm not saying it's generational or just bikers, I'm saying people are ignorant and don't give a fuck about anyone but themselves. I've had hikers try and force me off the trail too but it doesn't seem as egregious. I look at it like this, if you're being overtaken on the trail yield and get off the trail. If you're meeting another user the faster user should yield, especially it they're coming down. There are exceptions. What I observe is that most users are unyielding assholes in general and that mtbers seems to think that all trails were built for them and they always have the right of way, even over other mtbers.

[char_]

That has more to do with dirt roads often not being wide enough for passing. When two vehicles encounter each other on a grade where the road is not wide enough to pass, it is much more dangerous for the uphill vehicle to reverse downhill than it is for the downhill vehicle to reverse uphill under power.

I've heard that as well. My experience was on heavily used logging roads with large vehicles pulling heavy loads. Loaded truck going uphill may not be able to get going again or would be in for a long, slow pull up the hill if forced to use the pullout was the concern.

Of course if they are loaded coming downhill, the little guy is backing down the hill or finding a spot to squeeze over anyways.....common sense and all that.

Implied in the downhill yield rule is that you need to be able to stop in time to yield, a concept lost on many downhill high velocity trail users.

[MakersTeleMark]

Sometimes you just have to make it work. This was a lot dicier than it looks:

[mall walker]

if you're being overtaken on the trail yield and get off the trail.

QFT. This drives me nuts... hiking behind a gaggle of tourists off a bus, or a family and their shit kids, or just 2 arrogant fat people, whatever. If I have caught up to you, I am moving faster than you, and I will continue moving faster than you. Take the 5 seconds to step aside and yield rather than make me sprint past you dangerously (which I also will do if need be). You wouldn't think this concept would be so difficult to grasp...

[stuckathuntermtn]

I consider whoever is lower in elevation to have the right of way. examples: I'm going uphill, gtfo of my way. Yes, you on the horse. If your horse is going to rear up and throw you off because of that, shoot it. Now let's say I'm riding downhill: Oh, hello there uphill traveler, let me stop and move off to the side for you.
It seems to work pretty well. Most people seem to do this. A lot of people seem to yield to bikes when they don't have to. If a rider is stopped and unclipped, especially if it's steep, just go by. Please.
Also, if you're wearing headphones, or don't at least smile by way of a hello (seems to often go hand in hand), please remove yourself from this planet.
I try not to ride in places where there's lots of horses (Blue Mountain) on the weekends. Seems to also mean lots of trail traffic in general.

Also, if you're on a busy rec path, please get over to the right.

[2FUNKY]

Horses are dead technology. Why do people still ride them?

Try packing a wall tent, gear and 3 bull elk 12 miles out of the back country. You will change that tune.