Khion vs Merc vs Vulcan vs Mtn Lab vs Maestrale RS

[Kufo]

I've done a fair bit of research and reading regarding all these AT boots and what they offer. Their advantages and disadvantages. I'm simply not sure what boot I need for my application though. I am looking for a one-boot to add to my one ski quiver for this winter. 186 cm Armada Kufo with 6-13 Marker Kingpins. I will be skiing in the Kootenays and most likely a variety of resort, slack and hopefully a few multi day tours. I have never skied in an AT boot before. The boot I skied last winter was an Atomic Tracker 130 (obviously a very stiff boot). I am 5'10 and 160 lbs so I'm assuming I don't need a super still boot to drive my 2700 gram skis? (2000 skis + 700 bindings). I have a medium/wide foot so I feel the MTN lab might be out of the question. I haven't heard much on range of motion for the Khion. Feel free to add input on any other boots you feel would fit into this category as a one boot quiver.

Thanks

[Kevin_mcbride]

The vulcan beats the pants off of anything I've ever skied, khion looks good too.

[jvskinn]

The nice thing about the Vulcan/Mercury is you get a removable tongue piece that stiffens up the boot when you need it. I think you'd probably want the stiffer Vulcan, but they're both great boots.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

There all good. Get what fits. It's been a while since I tried on the Vulcan/Merc, but my memory is that they are a bit more narrow mid foot, with significantly more volume above the instep than the Scarpas. Never tried on Khions of Mountain Labs. I'd personally stick to Dynafit or Scarpa if I had a choice as they're far more experienced in this realm.

[adrenalated]

Buy the one that fits.

In terms of stiffness, Maestrale RS and Mercury are similar, Vulcan is stiffer. The Vulcan has been revised for this season, so that may change. TBD where the Khion and Mtn Lab fit into that.

Vulcan/Merc fit narrower at the ankle, wider at the forefoot, and lower volume at the instep than the Maestrale RS. Vulcan/Merc have the exact same fit, the difference is the flex. I think Black Diamonds above got them reversed. I am 100% positive of this, I sold many pairs of both boots.

ROM on both boots is great. Sure, some might prefer one or the other, or prefer this feature or that, but in reality they're close enough it doesn't matter.

Buy the one that fits.

[XXX-er]

Buy the one that fits.

In terms of stiffness, Maestrale RS and Mercury are similar, Vulcan is stiffer. The Vulcan has been revised for this season, so that may change. TBD where the Khion and Mtn Lab fit into that.

Vulcan/Merc fit narrower at the ankle, wider at the forefoot, and lower volume at the instep than the Maestrale RS. Vulcan/Merc have the exact same fit, the difference is the flex. I think Black Diamonds above got them reversed. I am 100% positive of this, I sold many pairs of both boots.

ROM on both boots is great. Sure, some might prefer one or the other, or prefer this feature or that, but in reality they're close enough it doesn't matter.

Buy the one that fits.

pretty much this^^ I have the Mercury and recently got the Vulcan on a crazy closeout deal, I find the merc is a pretty good flex for touring or lift riding while the vulcan is DAMN stiff enough to not need the tongue, both have good room in the forefoot for a wide forefoot but are tight on the instep with the stock liner which IMO sucks so I used a power wrap liner

I picked up the Vulcan cuz I hear the new Khion will fit narrower??


http://www.dynafit.com/us/footwear/boots.html

the official Dynafit site is showing 3 khions and 2 vulcans which has to be wrong, I think the vulcan TF is history and the Vuulcan boot is the actual new Vulcan

"The new Custom Plus liner is completely thermoformable. It cradles the foot to provide precision and comfort at the same time, thanks to the construction technique employing 3 different types of foam."

if this^^ liner is any good that would be nice cuz the liner Dynafit has been flogging for the last 3 yrs sucks dead goats

The Maestrale doesn't fit my wide flat forefoot and the Khion might not, like everyone sez get the boot that fits your foot

[Lindahl]

I found the opposite - the Maestrale RS was lower in the instep to me - couldn't even close the boot, when compared to the Vulcan/Merc. Not sure about the Khion, but I do hear that the Mtn Lab skis better than Maestrale RS and tours just as well (no info vs. the Merc/Vulcan).

[PNWbrit]

Buy the one that fits.

Or red ones.

[adrenalated]

I found the opposite - the Maestrale RS was lower in the instep to me - couldn't even close the boot, when compared to the Vulcan/Merc. Not sure about the Khion, but I do hear that the Mtn Lab skis better than Maestrale RS and tours just as well (no info vs. the Merc/Vulcan).

The shell has more space in the Maestrale. The liner out of the box is very thick though and it can feel lower volume to some before the liner is molded.

[gregL]

It's not just the stiffness, it's the flex pattern that differs in these boots. The designers of the Khion and the MTN Lab are both striving for a boot that feels more like a traditional overlap shell, and I think they're on to something.

I have some experience with all of these, though I've only had the Khion on my foot (haven't skied it). In half a day in the MTN Lab I thought it was outstanding in terms of skiability and not bad at all for skinning (this isn't really a negative; my usual touring boot is the TLT6P or Backland Carbon). I skied it without punching even though I have a ~103mm forefoot, so don't count it out because of a "wider" foot (haven't tried to punch one yet).

The 2016 Vulcan is essentially the 2015 Mercury in a green-on-green colorway (fiberglass reinforced cuff) and they are dropping the Mercury name from the lineup. The Khion takes the Vulcan's place at the top of the $$$ pile, and all the shells will be Pebax instead of Grilamid. In the past my experience with modifying Pebax shells left something to be desired, we will see about the new Dynafit shells (there are many Pebax formulas, some better than others for punching).

[XXX-er]

The shell has more space in the Maestrale. The liner out of the box is very thick though and it can feel lower volume to some before the liner is molded.

Also the Scarpa use a liner made to their spec by intuition (not exactly like the aftermarket intuition but damn close) if the Maestrale fit me I would have been in it to save myself 300$ on an aftermarket liner with the mercury /vulcan

The Salomon Freeski boys were all up here on the blue mtnlab they said they liked em but they DO get paid by Salomon, one of them had modded an extra buckle over the instep

Atomic Backland with the memoryfit heat moldable shell will be one to look at

really the only boots that have been out for general use are Scarpa & Dynafit, it looks like Dynafit added boots to their site but didn't delete the old models, does anybody know what happended to the ONE, looks like its gone so what is the replacement?

[ghosthop]

For those of you that fit, which of the new breed of do it all touring boots have the tightest fit in the ankle with decent volume over the instep? I have super skinny ankles and a fucked up right instep, I have been shying away from tongue style boots recently because it seems like an instep punch is easier in an overlap. Kinda hard to find a shop that has all of these boots in a 24 to get my foot into.

[cat in january]

Odd Dynafit is going to all Pebax as it has not seemed as stiff as Grilamid in my limited experience in boots of both plastics.

[gregL]

does anybody know what happended to the ONE, looks like its gone so what is the replacement?

They dropped the One in name only last year; the replacement is the Neo.

[babybear]

has anyone mentioned adding a booster strap to whatever boot you get too?
I have the maestrales and that helped add stiff-ness and helped with the flex

[El Chupacabra]

has anyone mentioned adding a booster strap to whatever boot you get too?
I have the maestrales and that helped add stiff-ness and helped with the flex

Any chance you (or anyone else) want to part with your stock Maestrale straps? I liked those -- they're stretchy, kind of like a Booster, but lighter weight.

[XXX-er]

I got booster straps on my alpine boots but I took the velrco strap off my mercury which fell off on day 2 anyhow and I didn't notice any difference, i might wrap them around the boot tops at the hill but for touring its one less thing to fluff with

[gregL]

For those of you that fit, which of the new breed of do it all touring boots have the tightest fit in the ankle with decent volume over the instep? I have super skinny ankles and a fucked up right instep, I have been shying away from tongue style boots recently because it seems like an instep punch is easier in an overlap. Kinda hard to find a shop that has all of these boots in a 24 to get my foot into.

The Vulcan/Mercury is tight over the instep, the others are more relaxed. None are really "skinny" through the ankles, the designers are trying to fit an "average" ankle volume. Tecnica Cochise Pro 130 might also be a contender if you're willing to carry a little more weight.

[gregL]

Odd Dynafit is going to all Pebax as it has not seemed as stiff as Grilamid in my limited experience in boots of both plastics.

I talked to Giordano Vechiet (Dynafit product manager for footwear) last week when he was in town and apparently there are many different formulas for Pebax, as well as the option to "custom" formulate your own version. He said they went with Pebax primarily because they preferred the rebound characteristics. He didn't really say anything about the punchability of the Pebax shells, I guess we will see.

[XXX-er]

For those of you that fit, which of the new breed of do it all touring boots have the tightest fit in the ankle with decent volume over the instep? I have super skinny ankles and a fucked up right instep, I have been shying away from tongue style boots recently because it seems like an instep punch is easier in an overlap. Kinda hard to find a shop that has all of these boots in a 24 to get my foot into.

IME 24 is pretty fucking small so I would be a 175lb guy stuck in a powder blue chick boot or something with pink accents that was suposed to have the right flex for a woman weighing 50lbs less SO the nice thing about mercury/vulcan is unisex color (except chick mercury) and sizing all the way down to 22

The overlap Scarpa Maestrale/GEA (you would be in the pinko GEA) break on the 1/2 size so you would be in a 23.5/24 sized shell scarpa which was too narrow in the toe for me

IME the Mercury/Vulcan have a narrow heel but the stock liner is tight on the instep but ok with a different liner (I DO have a high instep) so I went with power wraps, it sucks to spend so much money and spend more on a liner but that was my only option

any discontinued boot will likely be cheaper cuz its last years model so Mercury Vulcan ONE might be cheaper, instead of 1000$ I paid 335 $ for Vulcans from conrad, swapped my PW's & power strap to go touring with no boot mods and I can sell the mercs next season for 200$

maybe one of the new offerings will work for small feet??

and if you are a chick ... Hi there! (joke)

[babybear]

Any chance you (or anyone else) want to part with your stock Maestrale straps? I liked those -- they're stretchy, kind of like a Booster, but lighter weight.

yea I'll chk in the garage when I get home and will send a msg if we still have em

[LightRanger]

The shell has more space in the Maestrale. The liner out of the box is very thick though and it can feel lower volume to some before the liner is molded.

Yep. High instep and arch checking in here. Skied without molding and that was a terrible idea. Mold+some punching and they fit great.

[adrenalated]

Yep. High instep and arch checking in here. Skied without molding and that was a terrible idea. Mold+some punching and they fit great.

The stock Maestrale liner also has a generous and unnecessary amount of elastic over the instep that can contribute to pressure there. I'd say I ended up trimming some of it away on about 25% of the boots I sold (including my own).

[El Chupacabra]

yea I'll chk in the garage when I get home and will send a msg if we still have em

Thanks!

[XXX-er]

Same thing with the vulcan/merc liner, that piece of Naugahyde sewn to the top of the liner hides a piece of elastic sanwiched under it, the whole thing is 3mm thick and really puts pressure on the instep ... incredibly bad design

it comes off easily in 3 min with a razor blade no problem