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  1. #76
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    Sep 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kufo View Post
    new release.
    Release was never the problem. :-)

    Just a vote for your plan, though - I've been skiing inbounds and in the backcountry on Vulcans for the last 3-4 years. I picked mine up in the first release, and have really loved these boots. Mine don't have the bump stops, so they have a more progressive flex (I assume), but they've been plenty beefy for me at 6' and 195 pounds driving up to 120mm waist skis.

    Seth

  2. #77
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    Aug 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by sethschmautz View Post
    Release was never the problem. :-)
    I picked mine up in the first release,
    When I mentioned release I was referring to version/year

    You picked up Vulcan's? and they released first??

  3. #78
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    Sep 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kufo View Post
    When I mentioned release I was referring to version/year
    Yeah, I knew what you meant, I was just joking.

    Yeah I got the Vulcans, but no they didn't release first. I was trying to say that I think those Vulcans will be perfect for what you got them for.

  4. #79
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    Feb 2014
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    NorCal coast
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    I'm looking for some advice, given all the talk of Vulcans recently.

    I have feet that are flat, on the wider end of normal (~306mm forefoot), but due to the flatness stay that width basically all the way back to just in front of the ankle (lower buckle latch area on TLT6s). I have a pair TLT6s with ProTour liners that have been mercilessly punched and baked into submission that are now comfortable enough that I can wear them for a full day at a resort on groomers without foot pain. However, I do find that even with the black tongue, the TLT6 isn't stiff enough to really ski aggressively at a resort, and the Radical ST bindings make for a harsh ride on hard snow.

    I've kicked around the idea of getting a pair of Beast 14s or Kingpins to use at the resort, but then run into the issue of incompatibility with the TLT6s heel, besides the issue of the TLT6 not being stiff enough for that sort of binding. So, to go along with a more freeride tech binding, I'd need a beefier boot. Current ski quiver is Praxis 180 UL BCs, K2 178 Backdrops (want to replace with 182 UL GPOs), and Lotus 192 Pure 138s.

    Anyways, I'm tempted to pick up a pair of Vulcans now, while they still have Grilamid lowers, since any boot I buy will require punching. If I did, I'd kick myself for not grabbing the ones on S&C earlier this spring when they were like $400. I guess the other option would be a pair of Backland Carbons (for ease of fit), but it doesn't sound like they're any stiffer than my TLT6s. I figure Khions are out due to narrower last than Vulcan plus not Grilamid. MTN Lab is out due to narrow last, and not beefier. I had a pair of Maestrale RS that I sold to my dad - didn't fit well, disliked the tongue, and not enough ROM.

    Thoughts? I don't NEEEEED to get this setup now, but am worried about losing out on the option of the better punching plastic on the Vulcans, not to mention their wider last.

  5. #80
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    Sep 2010
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    Golden, Colorado
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    5,868
    Quote Originally Posted by Andeh View Post
    I'm looking for some advice, given all the talk of Vulcans recently.

    I have feet that are flat, on the wider end of normal (~306mm forefoot), but due to the flatness stay that width basically all the way back to just in front of the ankle (lower buckle latch area on TLT6s). I have a pair TLT6s with ProTour liners that have been mercilessly punched and baked into submission that are now comfortable enough that I can wear them for a full day at a resort on groomers without foot pain. However, I do find that even with the black tongue, the TLT6 isn't stiff enough to really ski aggressively at a resort, and the Radical ST bindings make for a harsh ride on hard snow.

    I've kicked around the idea of getting a pair of Beast 14s or Kingpins to use at the resort, but then run into the issue of incompatibility with the TLT6s heel, besides the issue of the TLT6 not being stiff enough for that sort of binding. So, to go along with a more freeride tech binding, I'd need a beefier boot. Current ski quiver is Praxis 180 UL BCs, K2 178 Backdrops (want to replace with 182 UL GPOs), and Lotus 192 Pure 138s.

    Anyways, I'm tempted to pick up a pair of Vulcans now, while they still have Grilamid lowers, since any boot I buy will require punching. If I did, I'd kick myself for not grabbing the ones on S&C earlier this spring when they were like $400. I guess the other option would be a pair of Backland Carbons (for ease of fit), but it doesn't sound like they're any stiffer than my TLT6s. I figure Khions are out due to narrower last than Vulcan plus not Grilamid. MTN Lab is out due to narrow last, and not beefier. I had a pair of Maestrale RS that I sold to my dad - didn't fit well, disliked the tongue, and not enough ROM.

    Thoughts? I don't NEEEEED to get this setup now, but am worried about losing out on the option of the better punching plastic on the Vulcans, not to mention their wider last.
    The Backlands are similar to the TLT6s, so don't look at those (though, when your TLT6s shit the bed, the Backlands will be a MUCH better fit for your foot). The MTN Labs might work, and they're a lot beefier than the TLT6s. The Khions may still work too - the last is very similar to the Vulcans, if not wider. I use more of a crossover boot at the resorts - a Technica Cochise - you could look at something like that too. The Scarpa Freedom is another option.

    The way you describe your foot sounds VERY similar to mine, and I feel like the Cochise is a great fit for my foot. I pair that with the Backland Carbons. Your setup would be similar with the TLT6s as your lightweight touring boot.

  6. #81
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    Nottingham, UK
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    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by Andeh View Post
    .......I've kicked around the idea of getting a pair of Beast 14s or Kingpins to use at the resort, but then run into the issue of incompatibility with the TLT6s heel......
    There's obviously no problem using the TLT6 with the Beasts with the Power Insert fitted in the heel but Marker also offer a similar fitting so that the TLT6 can be used with the Kingpin: http://www.thepisteoffice.com/index....er-detail.html
    The same fitting is also required to use the Atomic Backland boot with the Kingpin.

  7. #82
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    Nov 2003
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    Vallee Teton
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    2,586
    Quote Originally Posted by Andeh View Post
    I'm looking for some advice, given all the talk of Vulcans recently.

    I have feet that are flat, on the wider end of normal (~306mm forefoot), but due to the flatness stay that width basically all the way back to just in front of the ankle (lower buckle latch area on TLT6s). I have a pair TLT6s with ProTour liners that have been mercilessly punched and baked into submission that are now comfortable enough that I can wear them for a full day at a resort on groomers without foot pain. However, I do find that even with the black tongue, the TLT6 isn't stiff enough to really ski aggressively at a resort, and the Radical ST bindings make for a harsh ride on hard snow.

    I've kicked around the idea of getting a pair of Beast 14s or Kingpins to use at the resort, but then run into the issue of incompatibility with the TLT6s heel, besides the issue of the TLT6 not being stiff enough for that sort of binding. So, to go along with a more freeride tech binding, I'd need a beefier boot. Current ski quiver is Praxis 180 UL BCs, K2 178 Backdrops (want to replace with 182 UL GPOs), and Lotus 192 Pure 138s.

    Anyways, I'm tempted to pick up a pair of Vulcans now, while they still have Grilamid lowers, since any boot I buy will require punching. If I did, I'd kick myself for not grabbing the ones on S&C earlier this spring when they were like $400. I guess the other option would be a pair of Backland Carbons (for ease of fit), but it doesn't sound like they're any stiffer than my TLT6s. I figure Khions are out due to narrower last than Vulcan plus not Grilamid. MTN Lab is out due to narrow last, and not beefier. I had a pair of Maestrale RS that I sold to my dad - didn't fit well, disliked the tongue, and not enough ROM.

    Thoughts? I don't NEEEEED to get this setup now, but am worried about losing out on the option of the better punching plastic on the Vulcans, not to mention their wider last.
    If you can get a Mercury, that would likely be stiff enough for you intended resort use...
    so that might be another option to look out for deals...

    I just bought TLT6P's, so that will be my lwt touring boot, to complement my mercury's for touring.
    Although I could use mercury's for resort skiing, I still have alpine boots, so will use those.
    Aggressive in my own mind

  8. #83
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    Feb 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    There's obviously no problem using the TLT6 with the Beasts with the Power Insert fitted in the heel but Marker also offer a similar fitting so that the TLT6 can be used with the Kingpin: http://www.thepisteoffice.com/index....er-detail.html
    The same fitting is also required to use the Atomic Backland boot with the Kingpin.
    I was under the impression that Dynafit says "don't use the adapter on the TLT6, the plastic is too thin."

    Good point on the Mercury. They look like they're going for around $480 at Backcountry, which is more palatable than $600. That may be the ticket.

  9. #84
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    Apr 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by cat in january View Post
    Odd Dynafit is going to all Pebax as it has not seemed as stiff as Grilamid in my limited experience in boots of both plastics.
    the khion design makes pebax stiff enough.

  10. #85
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    Apr 2004
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    skied all of them but the MTN lab. Khion and maestrale RS are my favs because they're both stiff and progressive. Never liked the on/off feeling of the vulcan/merc. Khion's and maestrale RS's ROM are pretty similar, the khion (even the non carbo) is stiffer, the maestrale RS is more progressive, and has less plastic below the foot, which for some skiers (not all) is a big plus for driving.

  11. #86
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    May 2007
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    Sandy, Utah
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    14,410
    I will say hoji posted an imstagram getting fitted for his new khions for a trip to SA. Don't know if this helps but I would bet they are stiff enough for us mere mortals.

  12. #87
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    Nov 2007
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    395
    Looks like he's getting Surefooted, or at least some foot beds for those. Would be nice if Surefoot figured out a touring liner.

    I'm in Maestrale RS' with Pro Tongues right now, but the fit isn't great. Khion looks good, though I'd like to hear the MTN Lab review that Blister hinted at in the spring, but has yet to drop.

    Anyone with skinnier ankles/calves try the Khion?

  13. #88
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    Apr 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post

    Anyone with skinnier ankles/calves try the Khion?
    skinnier calfs on khion -> you want to use the aftermarket booster dyna will sell in fall

  14. #89
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    Nov 2007
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    395
    Any different than a regular booster that I could retrofit? For a boot that's pushing a grand retail, It should include it.

  15. #90
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    Nov 2003
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    Vallee Teton
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    fyi, i've been skiing 177 carbon protests and 175 UL GPO's with my mercury's sans tongue (teton pass)
    and there is plenty of beef for me.

    I came from skiing dynafit titans as a boot quiver of one for many years, and the mercury skis similarly flex wise and is lighter, and better rom, blah, blah, blah

    I'm 5'8" and 180 lbs.
    Aggressive in my own mind

  16. #91
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    Sep 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by verbier61 View Post
    ... and has less plastic below the foot, which for some skiers (not all) is a big plus for driving.
    Good point. Archaic ancient history, but I still pine for the 'skin on ski' feel of my old school single leather tele boots from back in the day. Somethin' to be said for feeling the individual kernals of corn snow crystals as you glide over them.

  17. #92
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    Feb 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoarhey View Post
    fyi, i've been skiing 177 carbon protests and 175 UL GPO's with my mercury's sans tongue (teton pass)
    and there is plenty of beef for me.

    I came from skiing dynafit titans as a boot quiver of one for many years, and the mercury skis similarly flex wise and is lighter, and better rom, blah, blah, blah

    I'm 5'8" and 180 lbs.
    This is useful, thanks. Haven't skied Titans but if you're able to ski them without tongues and weigh 25 lbs more than me, they sound pretty stiff.

  18. #93
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    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
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    I'm 5'9"/177lbs and have Mercury's & Cochise 120's (both with factory liners) and an old pair of Atomic M-Tech 110's (with ZipFit liners). I reckon that the Mercurys with the tongue installed are a true 110 flex. I've skied the Titans and they're definately softer (probably a 90 or 95 flex at best). I've not skied my Mercurys with the tongue removed but I can see how they'd be close to the Titan.
    Last edited by Spyderjon; 08-21-2015 at 03:52 PM.

  19. #94
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    Feb 2005
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    North Vancouver/Whistler
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andeh View Post
    I'm looking for some advice, given all the talk of Vulcans recently.

    I have feet that are flat, on the wider end of normal (~306mm forefoot), but due to the flatness stay that width basically all the way back to just in front of the ankle (lower buckle latch area on TLT6s). I have a pair TLT6s with ProTour liners that have been mercilessly punched and baked into submission that are now comfortable enough that I can wear them for a full day at a resort on groomers without foot pain. However, I do find that even with the black tongue, the TLT6 isn't stiff enough to really ski aggressively at a resort, and the Radical ST bindings make for a harsh ride on hard snow.

    I've kicked around the idea of getting a pair of Beast 14s or Kingpins to use at the resort, but then run into the issue of incompatibility with the TLT6s heel, besides the issue of the TLT6 not being stiff enough for that sort of binding. So, to go along with a more freeride tech binding, I'd need a beefier boot. Current ski quiver is Praxis 180 UL BCs, K2 178 Backdrops (want to replace with 182 UL GPOs), and Lotus 192 Pure 138s.

    Anyways, I'm tempted to pick up a pair of Vulcans now, while they still have Grilamid lowers, since any boot I buy will require punching. If I did, I'd kick myself for not grabbing the ones on S&C earlier this spring when they were like $400. I guess the other option would be a pair of Backland Carbons (for ease of fit), but it doesn't sound like they're any stiffer than my TLT6s. I figure Khions are out due to narrower last than Vulcan plus not Grilamid. MTN Lab is out due to narrow last, and not beefier. I had a pair of Maestrale RS that I sold to my dad - didn't fit well, disliked the tongue, and not enough ROM.

    Thoughts? I don't NEEEEED to get this setup now, but am worried about losing out on the option of the better punching plastic on the Vulcans, not to mention their wider last.
    What Lindahl said. The Cochise fit me fine without punching and with a cooked Intuition liner. I have flat Azn feet. Read review on TGR frontpage. Vulcans also fit me without punching and with an Intuition liner

    Quote Originally Posted by verbier61 View Post
    skied all of them but the MTN lab. Khion and maestrale RS are my favs because they're both stiff and progressive. Never liked the on/off feeling of the vulcan/merc. Khion's and maestrale RS's ROM are pretty similar, the khion (even the non carbo) is stiffer, the maestrale RS is more progressive, and has less plastic below the foot, which for some skiers (not all) is a big plus for driving.
    As almost always I agree with Verbier and have skied all the mentioned boots except for Backland. Hard to say if Khion is stiffer than Vulcan with tongue which is the only place I might disagree but even then it's a tiny difference IMO

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    Looks like he's getting Surefooted, or at least some foot beds for those. Would be nice if Surefoot figured out a touring liner.

    I'm in Maestrale RS' with Pro Tongues right now, but the fit isn't great. Khion looks good, though I'd like to hear the MTN Lab review that Blister hinted at in the spring, but has yet to drop.

    Anyone with skinnier ankles/calves try the Khion?
    I put some foam on the instep of the Khion to take up space but my ankles/calves are pretty much middle of the road.

  20. #95
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    Sep 2014
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    Andeh, re; vulcan fit. I have very hard to fit, somewhat box shaped feet that are thin vertically and 104mm at forefoot, 70mm ankle bones width, 51mm just above ankle bones...skinny, along with fairly skinny calves. Also, non existent arch, zero instep height and horrifically (according to the foot doctor folks) pronated and loose foot. Ski in the Mercury with custom orthotic, same last as Vulcan with multiple punches required in forefoot to accommodate width for a 2 finger shell fit. Initially skied with stock liners which were okay in fit, good heel fit but a hair loose in ankle and above.... but too cold. They wore out and were replaced with high volume intuition luxury liners. Cooked the hell out of 'em and now have the best fit of any touring boots I've yet owned...and super warm. Suffered a few season in some mango Maestrale's...countless punches and dicking around with other custom fit mods and could not get them to fit right. For heavyweight in bounds/sidecountry boots, I have a pair of Garmont Deliriums...they fit wide box shaped feet with narrower rear foot/ankles pretty good...did not mold the liner or punch shells and I can ski pain free all day long...a revelation...great performance too; solid laterally and damp, progressive forward flex that's just right for my 175 pounds.....but, way too heavy for daily ski touring needs.
    Master of mediocrity.

  21. #96
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    Dec 2007
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    Denver
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    Khion vs Merc vs Vulcan vs Mtn Lab vs Maestrale RS

    Tons of great information in here. I have been on Dynafit Titan Ultralights for several years now as a quiver of one. I want to keep with just one pair of boots inbounds or not. Would the Vulcans be a NOTABLE upgrade from the Titan Ultralights for this purpose? Except for some weight how so?

  22. #97
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Colorado Front Range
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    Try the following search, and then use your imagination to come up with other search terms:

    http://site:https://www.tetongravity.com/forums "overlap vs. tongue"

    You're asking us to tell yo whether you prefer the progressive feel of an overlap boot (Titan/Khion), vs. the "on-off" feel of a Vulcan. Dig into threads on specific boots you have on your short list and you'll learn a lot.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  23. #98
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    Dec 2007
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    ^^^^I'm really just asking if Titans are outdated enough to warrant something new.

  24. #99
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    30,881
    So the answer is YES!!

    IME the new boots ( 2013 mercury) are a generational leap in weight/rom/ski control over what was avilable (2006 garmont xena/endorphin ) last decade

    and my new vulcans (2014) are in the stiff as fuck category

    I would say the Vulcans without the tongue are as stiff as Mercs with the tongue but more ROM without having to screw with removing the tongue, I can see only using the tongue at the local hill
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  25. #100
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    The Chicken Coop, Seattle
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    About the only thing I loved with the Vulcans was the fact that they fit in a ski bag (with skis!) and didn't need their own boot bag for travel.

    I have skinny calves. So I really have to crank down to get them out of off mode. My tolerance of them cranked was intermittent at best.

    So if the khion has less fiddly buckles, similar weight, similar ROM, a more punchable shell and a less dichotomous on/off feel, I might be interested.

    But really, I think the best plan for me is to mount the beast heel insert on my Cochise 130, use a pro tour liner for touring days and a powerwrap or HD race for inbounds and continue the sole block swap routine.

    Maybe try out a backland or tlt6 in the meantime and determine how much fun the descent is in a minimalist boot...maybe try that raider binding that seems so dope...
    wait!!!! waitwaitwaitwaitwaitwaitwaitwait...Wait!
    Zoolander wasn't a documentary?

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