Downsizing 187 GPO: New 179 BillyGoat or 182 GPO

**Shu Shu** · 07-24-2015, 09:29 AM

yeah so summer n' everything.

Thinking I would like to downsize my 187 GPOs. Question is trade in for a 182, or try out the the new 179 BG. In my experience Praxis skis measure about 1.5 short and ON3Ps measure at about 2cm longer, so pretty much the same size ski.

I always been really curious about the BG for obvious reasons, and wondering whether the revised tail shape (which to my eyes seems quite minor), will put it on par with GPO in terms of its hard snow versatility.

Thoughts?

WestCoastPDR · 07-24-2015, 09:35 AM

I'll trade my 182 gpo for your 187's. Good shape 1 mount and has storage wax on em. I'm 500 miles away from em now but will be home Monday to take pics. Standard layup. Skis are in Tahoe

**adrenalated** · 07-24-2015, 09:38 AM

My understanding is the new tail shape is basically just knocking 2cm off the twin and making it flat across the back rather than rounded... ie, not really changing the shape. I don't think there will be any change in hard snow performance.

My 187 GPOs measure 187cm, and my 186 BGs measure 186cm (straight pull). So I would suspect that the 179 BG is going to be shorter in real life than the 182 GPO.

You really can't go wrong with either ski. The GPO carves better on hard snow, the BG is fine but is more into sliding on hard snow than carving (though it will carve). The BG is less hooky in funky 3D snow, and more damp. The GPO is turnier and a little more poppy, and lighter.

**Shu Shu** · 07-24-2015, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by adrenalated

My understanding is the new tail shape is basically just knocking 2cm off the twin and making it flat across the back rather than rounded... ie, not really changing the shape. I don't think there will be any change in hard snow performance.

Thanks good to know

Originally Posted by WestCoastPDR

I'm 500 miles away from em now but will be home Monday to take pics. Standard layup. Skis are in Tahoe

Thanks will definitely check out pics. No rush though just doing some summer quiver over thinking.

WestCoastPDR · 07-30-2015, 11:41 AM

U still want pics. Been slammed with work since I got home.

Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

Pm me your email address

**TahoeJ** · 07-30-2015, 11:47 AM

Why not the new 184cm BG's?

**Shu Shu** · 07-31-2015, 06:53 AM

Thanks PDR, after mulling it over, I think If I do anything it will be to try out the BG's, hoard for a while and then make a choice whether to keep both.

TahoeJ: Based on my experience with my brothers OG Jeffrey's (amazingly fun ski btw) the 186's measured a lot closer to 188, I was thinking that if it was the same with 184-s they'd be closer to 186 which, is pretty much the same size as the 187 GPO.

In any significant terrain that is the perfect length for me, but 80% of my season is spent on really insignificant terrain. I love my 177 Concepts for this, so in this case I'd rather do the very un-TGR like thing and err on the side of shorter.

**undertow2** · 07-31-2015, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by Shu Shu

yeah so summer n' everything.

Thinking I would like to downsize my 187 GPOs. Question is trade in for a 182, or try out the the new 179 BG. In my experience Praxis skis measure about 1.5 short and ON3Ps measure at about 2cm longer, so pretty much the same size ski.

I always been really curious about the BG for obvious reasons, and wondering whether the revised tail shape (which to my eyes seems quite minor), will put it on par with GPO in terms of its hard snow versatility.

Thoughts?

I can't comment on the sizing question, buy I own the 192 GPO and 191 Billy Goat and for me the only area in which the Billy beats the GPO is in POW... The GPO is a great travel ski and when conditions are not known I will usually pick the GPO... It rails on groomers, does great in crud, does well on dust on crust, killer in trees and a decent job in POW... The Billy def holds its own on groomers/shallow snow, but not on par with the GPO... It def beats the GPO in POW as you cannot sink the tip and it def skis looser...

Both are great skis from great companies and you cannot go wrong either way as I am sure you know...

**whyturn** · 07-31-2015, 09:03 AM

BG is surprisingly stable on groomers. Sold my GPO and got BG as daily driver. So quick and stable. It really is all I need when I fly and don't have to think about it. Maybe down 1 on groomer but up 3-4 in pow and 5-6 in trees

**eskido** · 07-31-2015, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by Shu Shu

Thanks PDR, after mulling it over, I think If I do anything it will be to try out the BG's, hoard for a while and then make a choice.

^^^^this.... you'd be pissed at yourself later for not givin the BG's a go, and that's not taking anything away from the GPO's. You'd just have 2 dope sticks at your disposal, sounds like a win win to me!

**TahoeJ** · 07-31-2015, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by Shu Shu

Thanks PDR, after mulling it over, I think If I do anything it will be to try out the BG's, hoard for a while and then make a choice whether to keep both.

TahoeJ: Based on my experience with my brothers OG Jeffrey's (amazingly fun ski btw) the 186's measured a lot closer to 188, I was thinking that if it was the same with 184-s they'd be closer to 186 which, is pretty much the same size as the 187 GPO.

In any significant terrain that is the perfect length for me, but 80% of my season is spent on really insignificant terrain. I love my 177 Concepts for this, so in this case I'd rather do the very un-TGR like thing and err on the side of shorter.

The Jeffrey's tend to run long (I have some that are 181 but are closer to 183) but the BG's measured true (at least the 2014 model), so if that holds true this year the 184's should actually be 184. Just curious, how tall are you and how much do you weigh?

**adrenalated** · 07-31-2015, 09:47 AM

I think the GPO is perhaps a touch more versatile, and I definitely enjoy my pair...

...but I really think the BG is the top of the "playful soft snow charger" category. Especially for resort skiing. That ski is truly special. Try a pair, for sure.

**Shu Shu** · 07-31-2015, 11:54 AM

Originally Posted by eskido

^^^^this.... you'd be pissed at yourself later for not givin the BG's a go, and that's not taking anything away from the GPO's. You'd just have 2 dope sticks at your disposal, sounds like a win win to me!

My thinking exactly

Originally Posted by TahoeJ

The Jeffrey's tend to run long (I have some that are 181 but are closer to 183) but the BG's measured true (at least the 2014 model), so if that holds true this year the 184's should actually be 184. Just curious, how tall are you and how much do you weigh?

5,10" 160lbs. I'm sure I'd have no problems with the 184 and arguably I wouldn't need anything longer for trips to bigger terrain, it's just with most of my season out east on the little hill my kids are learning on the average run is maxing out at 700 vert. My GPOs run out of terrain real fast. Hence the idea of sizing down. I can still get a lot of fun turns out of my 177 Concepts at this scale. Plan to get in touch with the ON3P guys about how true the measures are for this year. Will report back.

Originally Posted by adrenalated

I think the GPO is perhaps a touch more versatile, and I definitely enjoy my pair...

...but I really think the BG is the top of the "playful soft snow charger" category. Especially for resort skiing. That ski is truly special. Try a pair, for sure.

Nicely said. This seems to be the general consensus out of those who ski/own both. Pretty sure there will be a BG in the line up this year, just to make the final call on size.

**TahoeJ** · 07-31-2015, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by adrenalated

...but I really think the BG is the top of the "playful soft snow charger" category. Especially for resort skiing. That ski is truly special. Try a pair, for sure.

Me too. This is going to be my third season on the BG's and despite being a total gear whore I have no desire to try any other powder skis at this point. Every time I get out on them I'm reminded how great they are. Having said that, I do have some Candide 3.0's I'm anxious to try, but that's more of a weight issue for a touring setup because the BG's are a little beefy for skinning. But for riding lifts, absolutely perfect.

Originally Posted by Shu Shu

5,10" 160lbs. I'm sure I'd have no problems with the 184 and arguably I wouldn't need anything longer for trips to bigger terrain, it's just with most of my season out east on the little hill my kids are learning on the average run is maxing out at 700 vert.

For reference I'm 5' 11" / 170 lbs and have the 186cm. They don't feel that long. I get what you're saying about the east coast thing, but you should definitely still consider the 184. There's a healthy amount of tip and tail rocker involved.

**XavierD** · 07-31-2015, 01:38 PM

the 184 = old 186, just the twin got cut off a bit If you would not feel comfortable going with a 186 you should get the 179. That said, I think the 184/186 is a good length for the 165-185lb 5'9-6'0 crowd. 160 is on the edge between the 179 and 184.

**adrenalated** · 07-31-2015, 01:53 PM

FWIW I'm 5'9" 140lb and very happily ski the 186... and can ski the 191. But I'm compensating.

**Shu Shu** · 07-31-2015, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by XavierD

the 184 = old 186, .

Ok this complicates things a little seeing as the price of the 186s is crazy right now....ugh (edit NM i see its only the 176). Still leaning towards the 179 as I think it would give me a few more turns on any given run, but I'm sure the 184/186 is dead easy. Probably over thinking it.

Thanks for the input everyone

**ghosthop** · 07-31-2015, 06:43 PM

are you really debating the merits of GPO vs BG for a 700 vert hill back east?

Why not buy something that will actually be fun to ski for those conditions and keep the GPO's for traveling?