Wasatch Trails 2015

[Dantheman]

If someone got rid of Sam's trail no one would care. It's terrible. You Sam? Hikers can have it.

That's not it. His trail is some truly epic subdivision riding though.

Also, this seems like a good time to resurrect this itsnowjoke gem:
http://straightchuter.com/skilink-circle-of-trust/

[Canada1]

Since there is not even the slightest possibility that MM would be included in a potential Wilderness boundary, I have no idea what you are insinuating or threatening here. Colony homeowners are going to take their trail and go home?

They already did. Note the seven figure lot has been built out on the saddle that was mid mountain. This was what caused the re-route that became colonies suck switchbacks and iron man. I've vented on this a million times, and all of the players have changed their story 3 times. Originally they actually thought more is better and that it was a good thing. Now, they realize they screwed up, and say, the trails aren't a right, and we have to work with the developers. I think what we, the trail users, should take from the mid mountain mistake is that we can't take common sense for granted. Bad decisions can be made, and unwinding them may be impossible. Certainly we have more of a voice now. I used to know everyone I ran into as I climbed holly's for an evening ride. Now it's a damn highway and up climbing it is flat out dangerous. As many people ride mid mountain a day now in the summer as did in a month back when they were first conceding to the bad choice. I know I've become more involved so I am not left saying what the fuck just happened next time. I also am on a first name basis with some people I know and like at mountain trails. Before I knew who some of the players were, but never actively voiced my opinion. So Snow, don't bash someone who is pointing out that Vail is screwing with something precious and they better make it right.

Your both right. If they re-route mid mountain, create a problem for them. If they attempt to take the crest, create chaos. Don't let some tool from California create the colony sucks switch backs ever again so he can have a room with a view. Don't let a developer sell the idea that the scar that is the re-route is a better alternative. Fight that sort of bullshit actively, and vocally let them know what you think of passive cooperation when they are screwing up what was then rated one of the top five trails in the state. The rest of the time praise them for the awesome job they do maintaining our trails. Lets never be stuck saying "How the hell did someone sign off on that?" again.

[joetron]

Wow. This has been quite an informative morning.

I have to say..I fucking love Iron Man. Its a really good descent when riding CW.

[Canada1]

You recognize Iron Man was Mid Mountain before the re-route and re-name, right?

It used to go right through the saddle. They built the reroute below the ridge and the switch backs back up to go around the development. All of that could have been avoided with a road crossing in the development. They then did the re-name and reroutes when they cut the scar around iron mountain 2 or 3 summers later. Imagine single track fast flow from Pine Cone across to where the trail meets the first ski run off the back or iron mountain.

So, yes it is my personal windmill, and yes it is a first world problem, but I really miss what we lost up there.

[itsnowjoke]

[QUOTE=Dantheman;4553322]That's not it. His trail is some truly epic subdivision riding though./QUOTE]

You're just jealous.

The only reason I mentioned it was to establish that I know a thing or two about right-of-ways, access, lack thereof, etc. Your ignorance trumps my knowledge, however. (Golf clap).

[joetron]

You recognize Iron Man was Mid Mountain before the re-route and re-name, right?

It used to go right through the saddle. They built the reroute below the ridge and the switch backs back up to go around the development. All of that could have been avoided with a road crossing in the development. They then did the re-name and reroutes when they cut the scar around iron mountain 2 or 3 summers later. Imagine single track fast flow from Pine Cone across to where the trail meets the first ski run off the back or iron mountain.

So, yes it is my personal windmill, and yes it is a first world problem, but I really miss what we lost up there.

Aha. I only rode through that saddle once, right after the trail was completed I think. It was originally called the 8500 trail or something?

I like Iron Man because its off the beaten path, narrow and overgrown. I can go do that loop on a Saturday and not see the masses until I get back to top of Armstrong.

[Dantheman]

They already did. Note the seven figure lot has been built out on the saddle that was mid mountain. This was what caused the re-route that became colonies suck switchbacks and iron man. I've vented on this a million times, and all of the players have changed their story 3 times. Originally they actually thought more is better and that it was a good thing. Now, they realize they screwed up, and say, the trails aren't a right, and we have to work with the developers. I think what we, the trail users, should take from the mid mountain mistake is that we can't take common sense for granted. Bad decisions can be made, and unwinding them may be impossible. Certainly we have more of a voice now. I used to know everyone I ran into as I climbed holly's for an evening ride. Now it's a damn highway and up climbing it is flat out dangerous. As many people ride mid mountain a day now in the summer as did in a month back when they were first conceding to the bad choice. I know I've become more involved so I am not left saying what the fuck just happened next time. I also am on a first name basis with some people I know and like at mountain trails. Before I knew who some of the players were, but never actively voiced my opinion. So Snow, don't bash someone who is pointing out that Vail is screwing with something precious and they better make it right.

Your both right. If they re-route mid mountain, create a problem for them. If they attempt to take the crest, create chaos. Don't let some tool from California create the colony sucks switch backs ever again so he can have a room with a view. Don't let a developer sell the idea that the scar that is the re-route is a better alternative. Fight that sort of bullshit actively, and vocally let them know what you think of passive cooperation when they are screwing up what was then rated one of the top five trails in the state. The rest of the time praise them for the awesome job they do maintaining our trails. Lets never be stuck saying "How the hell did someone sign off on that?" again.

Circle of Trust's post implied wholesale closure of MM, which is absurd.

I'm all too aware of how much better the old Iron Mtn alignment used to be. You are absolutely right, Death of 1,000 Cuts is almost inevitable if every incursion isn't fought back against.

[Swine]

[QUOTE=itsnowjoke;4553483]

That's not it. His trail is some truly epic subdivision riding though./QUOTE]

You're just jealous.

The only reason I mentioned it was to establish that I know a thing or two about right-of-ways, access, lack thereof, etc. Your ignorance trumps my knowledge, however. (Golf clap).

The Oracle of the Wasatch has spoken, all hail his omniscience.

[itsnowjoke]

Circle of Trust's post implied wholesale closure of MM, which is absurd.

Hey Einstein, I didn't imply a wholesale closure of the mid-mountain trail. Get your head out of your ass.

On post #24 on this very thread, I disseminated information that Mountain Trails wanted the broad PC trail using community to know. Because you failed reading comprehension, I will reiterate:

The Iron Man Goldfinger, and sections of the Mid-Mountain trail through the Colony is entirely on private property. You ride there at the whim of Colony property owners. Colony property owners don't like a bunch of attention. They don't like reading how selfish they are when it comes to how much the former Mid-Mountain trail now sucks, etc., etc., etc. Too much, and they will just not allow you to ride there anymore. Is that too complicated for you?

Though the warning was Colony-specific, most of the PC-side trails are on private property, built with private funds. You are a guest on those trails. You don't have a "right" to them. Complaining about closures due to gondola construction just showed that some are awful guests in another's house. It's ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. They could have just shut the thing down all summer, but were courteous and conscientious enough that they kept the local MTB users informed on a daily, sometimes hourly basis. There's a long history of a few people ruining things for the rest of the group, so keep going on your mindless anonymous tirade, we can thank you when things go south. STFU, enjoy the riding, be courteous, and just be thankful we can do laps around the mid-section of Iron Mountain, or whatever the hell it is that we like to do.

I think it's funny that you bring up the Circle of Trust. I was right about the whole Skilink thing. What is coming is about to make that look quaint. I like quaint, but I also like connectivity. One Wasatch!

[joetron]

Though the warning was Colony-specific, most of the PC-side trails are on private property, built with private funds. You are a guest on those trails. You don't have a "right" to them. Complaining about closures due to gondola construction just showed that some are awful guests in another's house. It's ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. They could have just shut the thing down all summer, but were courteous and conscientious enough that they kept the local MTB users informed on a daily, sometimes hourly basis. There's a long history of a few people ruining things for the rest of the group, so keep going on your mindless anonymous tirade, we can thank you when things go south. STFU, enjoy the riding, be courteous, and just be thankful we can do laps around the mid-section of Iron Mountain, or whatever the hell it is that we like to do.

I know! Its CRAZY they keep building and improving trails on their property. Its like they realize some sort of, oh I don't know....value.., in creating a world class mountain bike destination. I know, it's a little 'out there'!
I'm sure local businesses and residents would have just kept their mouths shut, unlike these 3 or 4 internet forum rabble rousers, if VR decided to just shut everything down all summer to build lifts.

[Canada1]

The Iron Man Goldfinger, and sections of the Mid-Mountain trail through the Colony is entirely on private property. You ride there at the whim of Colony property owners. Colony property owners don't like a bunch of attention. They don't like reading how selfish they are when it comes to how much the former Mid-Mountain trail now sucks, etc., etc., etc. Too much, and they will just not allow you to ride there anymore. Is that too complicated for you?

Though the warning was Colony-specific, most of the PC-side trails are on private property, built with private funds. You are a guest on those trails. You don't have a "right" to them. Complaining about closures due to gondola construction just showed that some are awful guests in another's house. It's ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. They could have just shut the thing down all summer, but were courteous and conscientious enough that they kept the local MTB users informed on a daily, sometimes hourly basis. There's a long history of a few people ruining things for the rest of the group, so keep going on your mindless anonymous tirade, we can thank you when things go south. STFU, enjoy the riding, be courteous, and just be thankful we can do laps around the mid-section of Iron Mountain, or whatever the hell it is that we like to do.

I think it's funny that you bring up the Circle of Trust. I was right about the whole Skilink thing. What is coming is about to make that look quaint. I like quaint, but I also like connectivity. One Wasatch!

If the residents of the colonies dislike the press, then they can go to the developer and ask them to reopen the saddle section of mid mountain and problem solved. I doubt the developer ever brought it up at one of the HOA meetings, and the residents were just as surprised as the public? If they deny access, I will dedicate my time to fighting the constructive easement battle that will ensue. I know mountain trails weakened that argument when they allowed the re-route, but I still think it's a winner and can certainly tie up changes for the next couple decades while we continue to ride the trails every day. So, I'm not really worried about them kicking me off. In fact, I think it is a fight worth having.

Snow, you're my neighbor and I understand your points, but your style in presentation sometimes makes it very hard to be civil with you.

I don't mind interconnected resorts. I did mind cutting a chair through undeveloped backcountry when better options exist. Your blind support of ski link and comments on property values show a different perspective than me. As I've said all along, connect the damn resorts, but do it over guardsman. But Tallisker didn't want to work with the property owners, they just wanted to steal access from national forest. It didn't end well for them.

[itsnowjoke]

If the residents of the colonies dislike the press, then they can go to the developer and ask them to reopen the saddle section of mid mountain and problem solved. I doubt the developer ever brought it up at one of the HOA meetings, and the residents were just as surprised as the public? If they deny access, I will dedicate my time to fighting the constructive easement battle that will ensue. I know mountain trails weakened that argument when they allowed the re-route, but I still think it's a winner and can certainly tie up changes for the next couple decades while we continue to ride the trails every day. So, I'm not really worried about them kicking me off. In fact, I think it is a fight worth having.

Snow, you're my neighbor and I understand your points, but your style in presentation sometimes makes it very hard to be civil with you.

I don't mind interconnected resorts. I did mind cutting a chair through undeveloped backcountry when better options exist. Your blind support of ski link and comments on property values show a different perspective than me. As I've said all along, connect the damn resorts, but do it over guardsman. But Tallisker didn't want to work with the property owners, they just wanted to steal access from national forest. It didn't end well for them.

Hey, I'm just reiterating what Mountain Trails put out. This isn't my fight, and I doubt that a bunch of Colony owners come on to TGR to be personally offended. We could talk about a constructive easement all day -for weeks, actually- but I'll bet their lawyers are better than yours. If this is an issue that really bothers you, have you tried to get involved in making a change?

Yes, I'm an internet asshole. I've been told that I'm not one in person, but that's always open to interpretation and subject to change on an hourly basis. I've got nothin' on Hugh though.

Although I was accused by various dingleberries of supporting Skink due to my desperation for higher property values, that was actually never the case. So I don't know how I offended you in that regard, but yeah, it's going over Guardsman, so we've got that going for us. In the meantime, I'm fairly ecstatic about the connection happening now. Cheers, D

[Dantheman]

Corner Canyon sure is fubar at the moment. Couldn't have asked for better conditions than yesterday morning though. Even Jacob's was tacky.

[steeze_pizza]

Utah folks get in on this! Reposting from somebody on emptybeer

"New Trails at Utah Olympic Park - make your voice heard for technical trails!
Long story short, here's maybe the best chance ever to get a directional, technical trail built that could be easily shuttled, on really nice steep (and rocky) terrain with a decent amount of elevation. The Utah Olympic Park owns the land and can build whatever they want (yes, jumps/drops/etc) and *the trail would be easily shuttled via Bear Hollow/Sun Peak*.

The area will connect to Hunters/Midmountain as well, so it would be a RAD way to finish a Crest ride.

If they hear from enough of us, they might think it's worth doing something like that. I'm sure the main plan is to build multiuse/bidirectional trails, and that's great, but this is the perfect area to add a gravity trail with some tech without causing conflict problems.

Here's the info from Basin Rec:

Hello trail users,

We want your input.

The Snyderville Basin Special Recreation District is currently contemplating new trails in the Kimball Junction Open Space, below the Utah Olympic Park. The plan considers approximately 1.5 to 2 miles of natural surface (single track) trails. One trail will connect to the new Olympic Park trails and another trail will be a loop above the RTS Trail. Basin Recreation is seeking public input on what type of trails will best suit this area.

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/MJJ2MKR

If you are having trouble with the link, you can find the survey on our website Basin Recreation | Snyderville Basin Special Recreation District | Park City, Utah

Thanks


Trails Team
Snyderville Basin Recreation District
Basin Recreation | Snyderville Basin Special Recreation District | Park City, Utah
office: 435-649-1564

Parks • Trails • Recreation

Go do the survey! Pass it on to anyone interested!"

[muted]

Not sure how that poster thinks drops/jumps or anything worth shuttling will be built rather than another sidewalk-trail, but I like his enthusiasm.

[Dantheman]

Not sure how that poster thinks drops/jumps or anything worth shuttling will be built rather than another sidewalk-trail, but I like his enthusiasm.

Best you could hope for is probably a Bob's Basin-type trail. Never hurts to ask though.

[Dantheman]

Hey Einstein, I didn't imply a wholesale closure of the mid-mountain trail. Get your head out of your ass.

I forgot I never responded to this. Wholesale closure of MM through The Colony, FFS.

Colony property owners don't like a bunch of attention. They don't like reading how selfish they are when it comes to how much the former Mid-Mountain trail now sucks, etc., etc., etc. Too much, and they will just not allow you to ride there anymore. Is that too complicated for you?

Closing some of the most popular trails in the state will definitely get them less negative attention and PR than just not screwing up what currently exists[/sarcasm]. Like Canada1 said, they could have preserved the original Iron Mountain alignment with a simple road crossing.

Complaining about closures due to gondola construction just showed that some are awful guests in another's house. It's ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. They could have just shut the thing down all summer, but were courteous and conscientious enough that they kept the local MTB users informed on a daily, sometimes hourly basis.

It wasn't the temporary gondola closures people were angry about (not me at least). It was that they completely rerouted MM between Spiro and Pinecone, and the new trail sucks compared to the old one.

[One (+) Sentence]

It wasn't the temporary gondola closures people were angry about (not me at least). It was that they completely rerouted MM between Spiro and Pinecone, and the new trail sucks compared to the old one.

I think the new half mile re route on MM is fine and it will get better over time - besides, MM has just become a main vein thorofare to get to what you actually want to ride anyways...

[Canada1]

Is MM clear of snow? I get the shifter delivered after last weeks break and am hungry to get back on the bike!

One Sentence, MM used to be a great ride and not just a connector. I would argue it has become a connector because it was not stewarded as the gem it was. The interest and convenience of three resorts and the developers superseded the public interest in preserving the only lateral flow trail. I feel it was a failing on mountain trails. That said, they do a lot of good, and as previously stated several times now, I have an unhealthy attachment on this one for some reason.

I've given up and moved on. There is a shitload of riding in town and I need to be happy when I ride!

[Sirshredalot]

Is MM clear of snow? I get the shifter delivered after last weeks break and am hungry to get back on the bike!

One Sentence, MM used to be a great ride and not just a connector. I would argue it has become a connector because it was not stewarded as the gem it was. The interest and convenience of three resorts and the developers superseded the public interest in preserving the only lateral flow trail. I feel it was a failing on mountain trails. That said, they do a lot of good, and as previously stated several times now, I have an unhealthy attachment on this one for some reason.

I've given up and moved on. There is a shitload of riding in town and I need to be happy when I ride!

Significant portions of mm are clear of snow. I was talking to someone on yesterday who had just ridden Colin's to mm to insurgent and reported goodness.

[Dantheman]

I think the new half mile re route on MM is fine and it will get better over time

We are all entitled to our opinion

Is MM clear of snow?

Can't be more than a few isolated snow patches in well shaded north-facing pockets, and those will be going away fast.

[SJG]

in other news the Purple Bus (Empire) is limiting to 6 bikes max. This is going to be a problem sooner rather than later......

[My Pet Powder Goat]

in other news the Purple Bus (Empire) is limiting to 6 bikes max. This is going to be a problem sooner rather than later......

Seriously, we would fit 25-30 bikes/bus on a weekend. I Foresee riots, and biker on biker violence. They should get a trailer to haul up the bikes. It's a simple route. No reason to fuck up a good thing

Eta: will 6bike limit include the orange//silver lake bus?

[BC_ski_BC]

Heading out to SLC for 4 days of work next week. Going to rent a hard tail from the U for the few evenings I have to poke around the foothills. Looking to rent something full squish for riding on Saturday. Anyone have suggestions on a shop?

[One (+) Sentence]

Seriously, we would fit 25-30 bikes/bus on a weekend. I Foresee riots, and biker on biker violence. They should get a trailer to haul up the bikes. It's a simple route. No reason to fuck up a good thing

Eta: will 6bike limit include the orange//silver lake bus?

Pedaling your bike up to Empire may be even easier than convincing Park City to invest in bike trailers to run free mtb shuttles with their public bus system.