Bitterroot National Forest Travel Plan

[jamal]

Awesome, thanks! Guess I know what I'm doing tomorrow.

Edit: definitely noticed some new and improved things.

[stuckathuntermtn]

I was up this morning digging in the dirt on the reroutes on Fenceline. Keeps getting better and better up there! So glad MTB Missoula is rallying to work with the FS and get permission to work on these trails. Rode Ewok with my 7 year old today too. I agree, that needed work and it is way better now. Lots more opportunities to get out for trail work coming up, so no worries.

I have been posting that link in as many places as I can think of. Just put it on Drunkcyclist, Facebook, here, emails, etc. Gotta get the word out; 100,000 is a lot of signatures.

Did you do some work on Mo Z the last volunteer day? Maybe we met?

[ikswoldar]

I didn't work on the MoZ trail the last trail day but did a bit last year early season. Planning to be out for the Sheep Mt trail clearing day and perhaps another one or two...maybe the North Jumbo Trails on May 2nd.

[creaky fossil]

Woozie swings for the fences with a joke he tried running in 2003 on mtbr.

stuckie me-toos it while being thankful that woozie's describing me with a picture that's actually better suited to stuckie.

And someone works a "he drinks California beer" angle on me? You'll have to tell me how that one works.

RoooooR, I guess your little jokes are funny? I don't know. Like woozie's, they describe someone other than me. Have fun mistaking that scarecrow for me. It kept Wendell Stam busy for at least a decade, has kept Kevin Bazar busy for over a decade -- you may as well join the ranks!

The praise for MTB Missoula's trail work is humorous. The best trails built in town in the past 15 years have been built by either Bobby Grillo/MCC, or the early 2000s predecessor to MTB Missoula. MTB Missoula's trail projects have been as poorly done as the ones USFS did on its own during the past 15 years. You know -- like the dismantling of the stuff that got approved by Don Carroll on Dead Man's.

But hey, it's all good if you wanna ride your cross bike, or take your 3 year old on the balance-bike. Since Missoula didn't have enough of that sort of trail already.

Where's Wendell Stam's voice? He usually pretends to be the expert on this subject. Why's he quiet?

I didn't work on the MoZ trail the last trail day but did a bit last year early season. Planning to be out for the Sheep Mt trail clearing day and perhaps another one or two...maybe the North Jumbo Trails on May 2nd.

I think it's awesome that Sheep, E Fork, Mineral all are now blown to 3 foot width with braids, ride-arounds, rock removals, root cut-outs. Seriously. That shit should be passable in a wheelchair.

[RoooR]

You're not impressing anybody by shitting on Sheep Mountain. Ain't no ride-rounds, root cut-outs, or rock removals up Sheep, and the only wide part is where the trail used to be a forest service road. All they do is clear the deadfall. Mineral peak in particular is on par with Palisades in the bitteroot and the steep stuff up in Nelson BC as far as challenge. That loop is one of the best back-country rides you will find anywhere. Maybe you liked it better when the trails didn't get cleared until the week before hunting season?

If you're such a "rad" rider then show up for the hair of the dog and beat everybody down dead mans. But you won't because you're just some loser bitching on the internet. You don't help clear trails, you don't race, you don't volunteer. You have no involvement.

[creaky fossil]

Jesus Shitbird K. Riced, rooseroo. You obviously know nothing about me. Like woo and others here who pretend to know everything about me. It's stunning, really.

You're not impressing anybody by shitting on Sheep Mountain.

I didn't "shit on Sheep Mountain" literally or figuratively. That's such lousy aim, little kanga. Here you are, thinking you know me, and yet... not. Be proud in your ignorance.

Ain't no ride-rounds, root cut-outs, or rock removals up Sheep, and the only wide part is where the trail used to be a forest service road.

Nope. Unless you started riding it within the last 2 years or so. It's widened out in many places, has multi-channel spots in many places, and has quite a few root-cutouts and rock removals. But you keep rewriting history, eh? Since you're such an expert on the internet.

All they do is clear the deadfall.

I didn't say exactly who was churning widening ruining Sheep. But it wouldn't surprise me if MTB Missoula people, or the Alex/stuckies of the world, were doing it. Also you may want to find out by asking around town who has been clearing trails for over a decade in the early season. If you think it's always been MTB Missoula you'd be sadly mistaken. If you think it's always been USFS you'd be wrong again. But keep proving your ignorance and rookie status, little arrogant putz!

Mineral peak in particular is on par with Palisades in the bitteroot and the steep stuff up in Nelson BC as far as challenge.

HAH HAH HAH, you crack me up. Mineral is not like Palisades at all. Unless you really suck, in which case I suppose it may be. SCAY-UHD little rooser. So scay-uhd.

I'm guessing this is Kevin Bazar or Wendell Stam as RoooooR. Same "strategy", anyway.

That loop is one of the best back-country rides you will find anywhere.

So you don't get out much. I hear you on that one. You're inexperienced and yet unaware how little you know. Kudos.

Maybe you liked it better when the trails didn't get cleared until the week before hunting season?

What? You obviously either don't know me, or are Kevvie/Wendy acting. Either way, you're wrong. Good job! You're right, I know nothing about trail clearing and I should be more thankful that MTB Missoula is on the case. Since they've been doing it for over 15 years, 'n' shit. Right?

If you're such a "rad" rider then show up for the hair of the dog and beat everybody down dead mans. But you won't because you're just some loser bitching on the internet.

I'm pretty sure nobody in my age group can beat me down Dead Man's -- but that's a function of the group size and not my skill. Keep after it though. I bet you're almost fast in your own way. Premature ejac, etc.

If that Hair of the RoooR is anything like the old Jedzilla it could be fun. Maybe I could show up and prove how fucking slow and clueless and lazy and never-done-anything-in-Missoula-for-MTBs I am.

You don't help clear trails, you don't race, you don't volunteer. You have no involvement.

I'm sure you ride on trails I built. When did you get to zoolieville? Or are you just Wendell, who visited here 1x and was angry I wouldn't come ride with his arrogant douche self?

Anyway clearly you're right. I've never done a damned thing in Missoula for MTBs. You know this because you asked stuckathuntermountain, who knows everything. You didn't ask anyone else. In fact, I've never even been to Missoula!

[yeahman]

Wow, that's some serious croakin', croaky.



Wanna grab a beer before the Jon Krakauer/Missoula community forum? Might be a good idea to compare notes on corruption. Did you ever uncover the real story behind Luke's closing?

[RoooR]

I don't know man, maybe I have a soft spot since its our local trail, but I love Sheep Mountain. Mile to Sheep is "probably" a better ride, but I still put Sheep ahead of just about every must-do epic out there. Maybe the White Clouds (if you love dust.) Great thing about Sheep is how it stays tacky like all year. Real BC style shit back there.

And as far as the hair of the dog, put up or shut up pussy. Nobody cares about online bragging. Strap on a number or you're just a liar. Your age group? 40+ masters? GTFO, you ain't gonna win that shit, I bet you fucking walk down Mineral anyway. I've got my results and know where I stand.

If you actually lived here as long as you pretend to, then you would remember when the Backcountry Horsemen were responsible for clearing the backcountry trails and would get to it like the first week of September. And o Wow, you built trails? BS. I basically assume every thing you say is a lie and you're an angry teenager in his mom's basement. Either that or your "sunny demeanor" excluded you from the local community and you're now left to bitch online.

And jeeze, all those guesses about who I am. WTF man, you wanna start sexting me or something? No-offence, but I don't swing that way.

[senior researcher]

Shove your mechanical bits up your ass and start cranking, the less of any, Fucks , Any where ,the Better! Happy Earth DAY!

[kidwoo]

I'm guessing this is the ghosts that haunt my head or Wendell Stam as RoooooR.

No one is as obsessed with me as you are.


I'm everywhere! Even where I isn't!

[ikswoldar]

Now, if only the energy put forth to generate the level of enlightened banter found in this thread would be directed toward the Bitterroot Forest Supervisor Julie King and her crew. Imagine the possibilities.

[toast2266]

fwiw, I heard sheep is clear most of the way to the top. No down trees. Top, and presumably backside, are still snowy.

[hick]

Rode Blodgett last Sunday, such a rad little out and back close to town, what a loss that will be. FYI- It was dry and in great shape besides some brush and a couple of down trees out about 5+ miles. Didn't go all the way to the W boundary though, but it seemed like it would be dry to it. Oh, saw 2 hikers on the way back within the first 1/2 mile, oh the conflicts we had! eye roll.

[stuckathuntermtn]

That's cool. I thought the closures were in effect this summer?
Other than Blodgett, I really don't see how they can enforce it.
"hey, you there!"
"blow me"

[jamal]

fwiw, I heard sheep is clear most of the way to the top. No down trees. Top, and presumably backside, are still snowy.

We tried to ride to blue point in june last year and didn't even get that far. Walked through snow about a half mile to the junction and decided to turn around. A friend of mine went up to about the same spot Saturday, said there were patches of snow but he could have kept going.

[stuckathuntermtn]

The Ten Lakes Scenic Area East of Eureka provides some of the best true backcountry alpine riding in the state. This type of trail access is becoming increasingly endangered with recent closures in Montana and Idaho. The Ten Lakes Travel Management Proposed Action recommends reducing trails open to mountain biking from 85.9 miles to 16.4 miles.Mountain bikes are already an established use in the Ten Lakes area and should continue to be allowed. Banning them disenfranchises a significant user group creating conflict among users that are otherwise very supportive of preserving natural spaces and enjoying the outdoors in a non-motorized environment.
Mountain biking is growing and has a postive impact on local Montana economies without major impact on natural resources.
We also encourage more research on the impact of mountain bikes in the Ten Lakes area in relation to other user groups before banning them.
__________________
The Forest Service is accepting comments on the plan until May 14th. Please take the time to comment on the plan before then to preserve mountain biking in this unique part of our state.
Send all comments to:
comments-northern-kootenai-fortine@fs.fed.us
Please include "Ten Lakes Travel Management" in the subject line.
More Information:


http://www.fs.usda.gov/project/?project=46784

Fuck the forest service. Seriously.

[hick]

Yes, the agency is on a tear lately in Montana. Change seems to be only for the worse in this state.

[ikswoldar]

The pisser of all of these closures is that the Forest Service is not required to exclude bikes per the section of the FSM 2300 regarding management of wilderness study areas, which states: “Mountain bikes may be allowed on trails that had established motor-bike use in 1977, or on non-motorized trails as longs as the aggregate amount of mountain bike and motorcycle use maintains the wilderness character of the WSA as it existed in 1977 and the area’s potential for inclusion in the National Wilderness Preservation System”

So, with that in mind, they are making a deliberate decision to exclude a human powered user group as a way of making Wilderness designation easier by removing users who would be inclined to oppose Wilderness if it meant they would lose access. According to Forest Supervisor King in her ROD for the Bitterroot Travel Plan: "allowing uses that do not conform to wilderness character creates a constituency that will have a strong propensity to oppose recommendation and any subsequent designation legislation. Management actions that create this operating environment will complicate the decision process for Forest Service managers and members of Congress. It is important that when the wilderness recommendations are made to Congress that they be unencumbered with issues that are exclusive to the wilderness allocation decision." In other words, lets kick out all the bikers so we can move toward Wilderness designation without a fight. The Forest Service has decided to create "de facto" wilderness without congressional approval. Rat-fuckers!

[kidwoo]

"allowing uses that do not conform to wilderness character creates a constituency that will have a strong propensity to oppose recommendation and any subsequent designation legislation. Management actions that create this operating environment will complicate the decision process for Forest Service managers and members of Congress. It is important that when the wilderness recommendations are made to Congress that they be unencumbered with issues that are exclusive to the wilderness allocation decision."

Wow.



Maybe we just need more wilderness™


Have you ever thought of that?

[stuckathuntermtn]

weak sauce is an understatement.
Total first world problem, but what a bunch of cunts.
Where is that quote from? Do you have a link?

[evasive_MT]

weak sauce is an understatement.
Total first world problem, but what a bunch of cunts.
Where is that quote from? Do you have a link?

Page 20:

http://a123.g.akamai.net/7/123/11558...T3_2444335.pdf

[hick]

Nice rainy day, guess I will be writing my reps and 1 senator to bitch about the FS and the crazy Bitterroot forest sup. Reading that travel plan makes my blood boil. I guess I'll just sell my sled and bikes and take up bird watching since that will be all that allowed in Montana in 10 years or less.

[tone capone]

The hilarious thing to me in all this, is that most of you think you have a representative government. Don't get worked up about it, you don't matter, except when they need you to line up at the voting booth like a bunch of fools who think are getting what they're voting for. So just be a good sheeple, trust in the career beauracrats, and the fetid career politicians that feed them...

Just TRUST the government, don't question authority ya know, it's the new American way. Write your sweet and respectful little letters of discontent, but at the end of the day, just get down and worship our modern day royalty as the kings and queens they are. They are entitled ya know. Federal state, local, unelected alphabet soup agency doucheacrats and turdicans, they can do no wrong and always know what's best for you. Just keep knuckling under and ensuring they all live fat, happy, protected and enshrined for their impeccable and unchallengeable do gooderness. Trust them blindly in every matter of public policy. Just listen to the NPR, they will assure to keep the faith. The federal government, with it's million different unelected and unaccountable tentacle alphabet agencies especially, is really good at fixing stuff and knowing whats best for you dammit!

[hick]

Godamnit Tone! Just let me live in my fairy-tale world thinking my little working man ass will get results by bitching to my elected official scum bag. Ya fucking buzz kill

[stuckathuntermtn]

I didn't see that quote in that citation?