Do Full Tilts still run a size small?

[ImSearchingforPowder]

I normally wear a 27.5. With the intuition liners in the FTs I'm guessing a 28.5 would be the right move?

[mntlion]

not usually...

best to try on and see? 5-15mm shell fit

FT shape has not changed in 20 years, same as the raichle of days gone by

[shafty85]

I can't figure out if you are the most elaborate troll ever, building up 1100+ posts before unleashing your brilliance upon us...

[ImSearchingforPowder]

I can't figure out if you are the most elaborate troll ever, building up 1100+ posts before unleashing your brilliance upon us...

I sold my Kryptons for $280 on ebay today

[auvgeek]

I think they run about a half size small. The bsl of most 27s is around 315-320; the bsl of the 27 FT is 310, which is ~3 mm larger than many 26s. For instance, the 26.5 Dalbello Scorpion is probably 3/4-1 size smaller than the 27 Full Tilt with a 307 mm bsl. OTOH, the 26.5 Kr2 with a similar bsl is probably closer to 1/3-1/2 size smaller.

As mntlion advises, try both sizes on and see how they fit.

[axebiker]

I didn't find them to be any smaller than my Kryps. Coming from Kryps though, my affair with FT's was VERY short. I preferred the Kryps quite a bit more. YMMV.

[Altaholic]

I have had both krypton & FT boots, they are very similar. I also have the Dalbello Virus AT boot for my Dynafit setup. 28.5 in both no problems, if you have the foot. I have the First Chair boot (10 flex), I enjoy it.

First Chair & Morrison boots have replaceable toes/heels, that rubber is key when you climbing up something like Cody Peak at Jackson Hole Mountain Resort. You change the wires out to be smaller if you have a really narrow foot like myself.

[ImSearchingforPowder]

Looking at First Chairs. I've got a fairly normal foot, just flat. What's the stiffness like in the first chairs compared to the kryotons?

[adrenalated]

I have the same size First Chair as I did in Kryptons and agree with auvgeek that they fit about 1/2 size shorter, and are considerably narrower. Flex is a hair softer than krypton pro imo.

[glademaster]

I think they run about a half size small. The bsl of most 27s is around 315-320; the bsl of the 27 FT is 310, which is ~3 mm larger than many 26s. For instance, the 26.5 Dalbello Scorpion is probably 3/4-1 size smaller than the 27 Full Tilt with a 307 mm bsl. OTOH, the 26.5 Kr2 with a similar bsl is probably closer to 1/3-1/2 size smaller.

As mntlion advises, try both sizes on and see how they fit.

There is not a direct correlation between BSL and interior shell length/volume. The interior length of my Vulcans is only 1 or 2 mm shorter than my Langes, but there is a 12mm difference in BSL (same mondo size).

[auvgeek]

There is not a direct correlation between BSL and interior shell length/volume. The interior length of my Vulcans is only 1 or 2 mm shorter than my Langes, but there is a 12mm difference in BSL (same mondo size).

Short answer: I mostly agree.

Long answer: First, my post wasn't based solely around bsl, but also around internal length. In fact, I kinda proved your point by saying that two different boots (the Kr2 and the Scorpion) in the same size from the same boot manufacturer with approximately the same bsl (Kr2 is actually 1mm shorter) have significantly different internal lengths. Secondly, touring boots run notoriously short (especially the TLT series) and generally aren't comparable to alpine boots (except the sidecountry overlap boots). But I still think the internal and external lengths are loosely correlated, though perhaps there are so many exceptions that such a statement has little use to the average person. To address the OPs question: do you think Full Tilt and Lange have the same internal length in the same mondo size? I don't think I could wear a 26.5 Full Tilt, but I fit a 26.5 in most other boots/brands, no problem. Just my $0.02 (and sorry if I'm a little cranky today).

OP: Toss a WC Booster Strap on the FT #10 tongue and you'll be pretty well off. But the Kr2 is a more anatomical last, IMO. I don't have particularly narrow heels, but the FT has almost no heel pocket. The nice thing about the Kr2 and the Full Tilt is that they seem to be (at least for my feet in a size 26/27) about 1/2 size off from one another.

Edit: I mistakenly wrote internal volume when I meant internal length. Just tired today.

[gregL]

Interior length and interior volume are not the same thing - and neither is necessarily tied to BSL. As for length, I'd say Full Tilt is pretty much in line with other major boot manufacturers (I wouldn't automatically size them up a shell size). As for volume, you're aware that FT has two distinct lasts, right? (Most manufacturers have 3 at least) The original is nominally 99mm but fits a bit narrower, the ROXA one (wider) is nominally 102mm but fits a bit wider. There isn't an average 100mm last. Also the ROXA-made boots (Booter, High Five) often have a rubber "bumper" attached to the toe of the bootboard, which when chopped off gives you another 5mm of length.

[mntlion]

http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...20#post2168120

old info, but might help

[auvgeek]

I do understand the difference between length and volume, and I edited my post accordingly. Sorry; it was just a typo I wasn't able to catch in the editing. I'm tired and cranky today. Shouldn't have even posted.

As for length, I'd say Full Tilt is pretty much in line with other major boot manufacturers (I wouldn't automatically size them up a shell size).

Interesting. I don't think they run a full size shorter and wouldn't recommend sizing up either, but (like I said) I think they fall about a 1/2 size larger/smaller than many other boots/brands: Lange, Dalbello Krypton/Kr2, Sally, Tecnica, etc. Not all, but some. It's nice if you're between sizes in a different brand (specifically the Kr2, which I think the natural competitor). Maybe I'm wrong, tho. You're the expert, and I would defer to your opinion.

[glademaster]

Short answer: I mostly agree.

Long answer: First, my post wasn't based solely around bsl, but also around internal length. In fact, I kinda proved your point by saying that two different boots (the Kr2 and the Scorpion) in the same size from the same boot manufacturer with approximately the same bsl (Kr2 is actually 1mm shorter) have significantly different internal lengths. Secondly, touring boots run notoriously short (especially the TLT series) and generally aren't comparable to alpine boots (except the sidecountry overlap boots). But I still think the internal and external lengths are loosely correlated, though perhaps there are so many exceptions that such a statement has little use to the average person. To address the OPs question: do you think Full Tilt and Lange have the same internal length in the same mondo size? I don't think I could wear a 26.5 Full Tilt, but I fit a 26.5 in most other boots/brands, no problem. Just my $0.02 (and sorry if I'm a little cranky today).

OP: Toss a WC Booster Strap on the FT #10 tongue and you'll be pretty well off. But the Kr2 is a more anatomical last, IMO. I don't have particularly narrow heels, but the FT has almost no heel pocket. The nice thing about the Kr2 and the Full Tilt is that they seem to be (at least for my feet in a size 26/27) about 1/2 size off from one another.

Edit: I mistakenly wrote internal volume when I meant internal length. Just tired today.

No worries, not trying to start a pissing match, just giving an example of how BSL and internal length are not directly correlated. Ultimately the answer is the same as it is for every boot question: go stick you feet in a bunch of them until the heavens open up and angels sing.

[gregL]

It's pretty common for people to think a narrower boot is shorter if their forefoot shape doesn't match up well with the shape of the toebox even though the length is actually OK (If he's in a 100mm last now and tries on the First Chair, this could happen). If you do go short in a Full Tilt and need extra length, it's a pain to punch them because the sole and tongue connection area deform easily. Sounds like the answer for ImSearchingforPowder is to shell fit both sizes.

[LC]

Full Tilt/etc have always been made to shoe sizes (1/3" jumps) instead of mondo sizes (10mm jumps), but then they attach a mondo size to them anyway and the sole length jumps are just plain weird. So some sizes have shorter sole lengths than you'd expect and some larger. Internal lengths' relation? I'm not sure, I've only ever tried on 27.5s and they felt like a normal 27.5 in length. Reference only the sole length stamped on FT heels to avoid any confusion with your shop guy.

22/22.5: 268mm (other brands ~265mm, FT +3mm)
23/23.5: 277mm (other brands ~275mm, FT +2mm)
24/24.5: 282mm (other brands ~285mm, FT -3mm)
25/25.5: 293mm (other brands ~295mm, FT -2mm)
26/26.5: 301mm (other brands ~305mm, FT -4mm)
27/27.5: 310mm (other brands ~315mm, FT -5mm)
28/28.5: 318mm (other brands ~325mm, FT -7mm)
29/29.5: 326mm (other brands ~335mm, FT -9mm)
30/30.5: 335mm (other brands ~345mm, FT -10mm)
31/31.5: 342mm (other brands ~355mm, FT -13mm)

[coldfeet]

... To address the OPs question: do you think Full Tilt and Lange have the same internal length in the same mondo size? I don't think I could wear a 26.5 Full Tilt, but I fit a 26.5 in most other boots/brands, no problem. Just my $0.02 (and sorry if I'm a little cranky today).

I have a Raichle Flexon size 11, same as a size 29 FT original last, and a size 29 Krypton, and they fit me similar-ish, don't feel a size off, although the BSLs are 326 and 336mm respectively. I also used a size 12 Lange (340mm), and while I have got my foot into a size 11 Lange, could barely get it back out. For reference I have a pretty narrow foot and I think a high instep. Other people with different feet might fit differently.

Also, wrt to the OP's question, I don't think you should size up on getting an Intuition or other thermo-mold liner. If anything you might be able to go down a shell size, depending on shell fit of course.

[bendtheski]

I tried a 25.5 FT Classic and a 25.5 Dalbello KR 2 Core ID side by side this Spring, and without molding the liner, thought they felt very similar as far as length and volume. What cinched it for me was the more anatomic feel of the KR 2's heel pocket. Then I remembered how much I hated the ratcheting buckles and snapping cables on my old flexons.

I've broken one insole cable in 5 or 6 years in the Krypton, and now have a pretty good inventory of spare parts, only some of which will transfer to the new KR 2 fusions I picked up this Spring.

If anyone needs tongues or boot boards (med or stiff, firm or shock absorbing) for a 25.5 Krypton, let me know.