Squaw Valley CEO Andy Wirth's Negative Letter About Incorporation

**FriendsofSV** · 11-13-2014, 11:54 PM

Incorporate Olympic Valley will need to complete an EIR

http://www.tahoedailytribune.com/nor...onmental-lafco

Update on the Incorporation Process

http://moonshineink.com/news/paddling-upstream

**old goat** · 11-14-2014, 12:29 PM

Do we really need two threads on exactly the same topic on the front page? FOSV--please let one of them die.

**bodywhomper** · 11-15-2014, 03:29 PM

I only skimmed the moonshine article now while eating lunch with my grubs - slightly distracted, I do not understand why the LAFCO went straight to an EIR. Legal defensibility, sure. But they could go the less expensive route of preparing a negative declaration for CEQA compliance and have a few extra opportunities for public input as a part of CEQA compliance and likely be fine. I wonder if this was discussed internally before pursuing the expensive full Monty route.

**The Dad** · 11-19-2014, 12:36 PM

Originally Posted by bodywhomper

I do not understand why the LAFCO went straight to an EIR. Legal defensibility, sure. But they could go the less expensive route of preparing a negative declaration for CEQA compliance and have a few extra opportunities for public input as a part of CEQA compliance and likely be fine. I wonder if this was discussed internally before pursuing the expensive full Monty route.

Indulging in a little cynical game theory....

Posit that you, the decision-maker, have two equally supportable options, each of which are equally subject to challenge, but by different constituencies. Any challenge will involve expense, borne both by the challenger and by you. One of the constituencies has relatively scarce resources, while the other's resources are effectively limitless.

If your decision adversely affects the resource-full constituency, they will almost challenge your decision. By contrast, if your decision adversely affects the resource-constrained constituency, they are fairly likely not to challenge the decision, to conserve their scarce resources.

If you're the decision-maker in that context, you'd be pretty tempted to put a thumb on the scale.

I'm obviously not saying that that's what happened. I have no idea what actually went on. But who knows?

**tahoe420** · 11-19-2014, 04:10 PM

LAFCO knows they will be sued by KSL if one duck is out of line,
or if they don't get 100% go ahead. I'm sure the lawyers have been
working the board members on every level in a legal, sort of, way.
I think they are scared to death of big ol' KSL. We shall see, eh?
What is Andy Wirth's definition of community anyway?

**The Dad** · 11-19-2014, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by tahoe420

What is Andy Wirth's definition of community anyway?

Duh.

**bodywhomper** · 11-20-2014, 06:55 PM

it's true, increased legal defensibility is a strategy for preparation of an EIR.. there are defined ways to limit the scope and focus of the EIR, which should save some cash for the applicants. it'll be interesting to see what happens.

**FriendsofSV** · 11-21-2014, 12:59 AM

Save Olympic Valley is pushing a half million in spending

http://www.tahoedailytribune.com/new...-contributions

Sierra Watch has a new Facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/KeepSquawTrue

**FriendsofSV** · 12-12-2014, 01:58 PM

(Left to Right) Jamie Schectman, Bev Wilson, Lizzie Day, Lisa Cardin, Suerte, Dr Fred Ilfeld, Nancy Elrod, Tom Day

**old goat** · 12-13-2014, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by FriendsofSV

(Left to Right) Jamie Schectman, Bev Wilson, Lizzie Day, Lisa Cardin, Suerte, Dr Fred Ilfeld, Nancy Elrod, Tom Day

Maybe a picture in ski clothes so we recognize y'all on the slopes. Hope KSL doesn't sue you for their property being in the background, since I know you're using that pic in your ad.

**LightRanger** · 12-13-2014, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by old goat

Maybe a picture in ski clothes so we recognize y'all on the slopes. Hope KSL doesn't sue you for their property being in the background, since I know you're using that pic in your ad.

I wouldn't put it past them to call a lawyer and ask, but AFAIK there's no cause of action.

**old goat** · 12-13-2014, 09:42 PM

Originally Posted by LightRanger

I wouldn't put it past them to call a lawyer and ask, but AFAIK there's no cause of action.

I'm sure you're right but there's no cause for an EIR either.

**LightRanger** · 12-13-2014, 09:45 PM

Heh. Not that tough/expensive to win a demurrer on a simple tort like whatever KSL would try to claim for the photo. Would be quite expensive for LAFCo to defend a challenge to not doing an EIR, even though they'd be on good legal ground. Different procedures.

**FriendsofSV** · 05-24-2015, 11:25 AM

The preliminary draft CFA has been released, followed by a response by Squaw Valley CEO Andy Wirth.

Squaw CEO Andy Wirth kicks off summer by sharting all over Olympic Valley community

**splat** · 05-24-2015, 04:23 PM

I think Andy is officially losing his mind now.
Next!

**TahoeJ** · 05-24-2015, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by splat

I think Andy is officially losing his mind now.
Next!

No kidding. So... uh, he agrees that an incorporation is a bad idea because it's based on the revenue from one source that is weather dependent... but spending hundreds of millions on real estate for the same purpose in the same exact location is a slam dunk? You've gotta be shitting me.

**old goat** · 05-26-2015, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by FriendsofSV

The preliminary draft CFA has been released, followed by a response by Squaw Valley CEO Andy Wirth.

Squaw CEO Andy Wirth kicks off summer by sharting all over Olympic Valley community

The article you link to is basically unreadable, the link to the fiscal analysis goes to something else, and there is no link to Mr. Worth's full statement. However, all that is irrelevant. What is relevant is the fiscal analysis, which does in fact say that incorporation is unfeasible, with the disclaimer that the feasibility is subject to the negotiation of the terms of revenue neutrality between OV and the County. Since it would seem that Placer County would be unlikely to negotiate terms that are any more favorable than LAFCO'S assumption, it would appear that the deck is stacked against incorporation unless IOV wants to sue. So my question to IOV is--what's next? Which is a highly relevant question, since the opponents of the village development need to know whether they will be dealing with Placer County or the Town of Olympic Valley.

As far as environmental opposition--http://www.moonshineink.com/news/love-them-or-hate-them-transfer-fees-abound
Seems like the environmental groups likely to bankroll legal opposition to the village can generally be bought off by transfer fees paid each time a property is sold with the funds going to said environmental groups for their projects. And KSL doesn't have to pay the fees--the purchasers of village units pay the fees.
I don't know why we pay so much attention to what Mr Wirth says. He's just a paid mouthpiece. My guess is that his spewings are mainly for the purpose of mollifying the investors who are wondering when they will see a return on their investment. Public opinion will have little if any effect on the outcome. All the action is behind the scenes and Wirth has nothing to do with that.

**TahoeJ** · 05-26-2015, 10:43 AM

So here's a question: do we have any idea where the Placer county planning commission stands on the issue? An EIR can demonstrate substantial negative impacts and they can still just approve the project as long as it meets CEQA requirements. Aside from the lawsuit option (which seems inevitable just like Homewood / west shore proposal), the best course of action at this point may be to overwhelm them with negative responses to the project.

**LightRanger** · 05-26-2015, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by TahoeJ

So here's a question: do we have any idea where the Placer county planning commission stands on the issue? An EIR can demonstrate substantial negative impacts and they can still just approve the project as long as it meets CEQA requirements. Aside from the lawsuit option (which seems inevitable just like Homewood / west shore proposal), the best course of action at this point may be to overwhelm them with negative responses to the project.

Based on past observations of Placer County's positions on various projects, I'll give you a hint: somewhere between positive approval and active cheerleading of developers. Unless something has changed recently.

**FriendsofSV** · 05-26-2015, 12:33 PM

A couple new articles

Unofficial Alpine

Wirth Delivers his latest proclamation

Sierra Sun

Andy Wirth, Olympic Valley group disagree on fiscal report

**The Dad** · 05-29-2015, 03:49 PM

Originally Posted by old goat

The article you link to is basically unreadable, the link to the fiscal analysis goes to something else, and there is no link to Mr. Worth's full statement. However, all that is irrelevant. What is relevant is the fiscal analysis, which does in fact say that incorporation is unfeasible, with the disclaimer that the feasibility is subject to the negotiation of the terms of revenue neutrality between OV and the County. Since it would seem that Placer County would be unlikely to negotiate terms that are any more favorable than LAFCO'S assumption, it would appear that the deck is stacked against incorporation unless IOV wants to sue.

Extremely well said. With the caveat that this is not anywhere close to an area in which I have expertise.

**old goat** · 05-30-2015, 08:27 AM

Originally Posted by The Dad

Extremely well said. With the caveat that this is not anywhere close to an area in which I have expertise.

Nor I.

A link to Fred Ilfeld's well reasoned rebuttal to the fiscal report.
http://edition.pagesuite-professiona...a-da9138ad31aa

Edit--bad link. See below.

**The Dad** · 05-31-2015, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by old goat

A link to Fred Ilfeld's well reasoned rebuttal to the fiscal report.
http://edition.pagesuite-professiona...a-da9138ad31aa

Link isn't working for me. Is this what you're trying to connect to? http://www.tahoedailytribune.com/new...gree-on-fiscal

In any event, with all respect, I'm not sure that Fred Ilfeld has any more expertise in this area than you or I.

**old goat** · 06-01-2015, 05:39 AM

Originally Posted by The Dad

Link isn't working for me. Is this what you're trying to connect to? http://www.tahoedailytribune.com/new...gree-on-fiscal

In any event, with all respect, I'm not sure that Fred Ilfeld has any more expertise in this area than you or I.

That's what I was looking for. They hadn't put that up when I was looking for it. And yes--I wonder who the IOV folks are getting advice from. I doubt they have the money to hire someone who can effectively take on the LAFCO and their analyst.