Revelstoke Avy fatality - heli guide operation

[newbreak]

http://www.revelstoketimesreview.com...252079441.html

CMH Revelstoke was the outfit

[Shadam]

so a bunch of proffessional guides designated a heli pick up point a safety, but they were wrong ...

how many other pick up points and safteys need to be re-examined ???

[hortence]

so a bunch of proffessional guides designated a heli pick up point a safety, but they were wrong ...

how many other pick up points and safteys need to be re-examined ???

If global warming is driving increased percolation at this time of year, maybe most of them? Maybe some of the old assumptions no longer hold up.

RIP to the victim.

[Single Track]

Sounds like they were lucky it was only one. RIP.

[PNWbrit]

Wow.

Looks like it's too late to be too early for anyone to leap to ridiculous conclusions.

[AlexC]

This has been a bad year for avalanches in the B.C. Interior, with slides happening in places you wouldn't expect and going much bigger than expected.

Earlier this winter a helicopter was sitting at a pick up spot when the air blast from an avalanche caused it to flip over. The pilot and one passenger were both sitting inside. Fortunately, nobody was seriously injured, but it could have been much worse. Could you imagine if it was running and there was a group of guests crouching next to it waiting to get on?

[spook]

that would be crazy sitting at the pickup spot, probably all totally jacked and then probably unbelievably watch an avalanche come down on them. amazing it only got one.

[spook]

well yeah. i was just thinking about how at that point your guard is probably down from your run and all that adrenaline and then bam.

[concretejungle]

Alpha angle?

[theshredder]

Vibes to family and RIP

If global warming is driving increased percolation at this time of year, maybe most of them? Maybe some of the old assumptions no longer hold up.

The avalache guru here has been warning us about if things are gonna slide then they're gonna slide big. It's still the case. Its because of the prolonged dry spell earlier in the year followed by a relatively cold/dry winter.

Its been relatively cool lately so I doubt this slide would be due to increased melt, although I do feel that the wilder extremes we've been experiencing is contributing to larger avalanches. A lot of areas with old growth forest (400+ year old trees) getting wiped out... Obviously proving that scientifically will be extremely difficult, and therefore the idea should be completely disregarded.

[LeeLau]

Cmh Adamants is very conservative. What Shadam said. Rethink safe routes and zones this year. I'm convinced this will happen in the Coast

[whipski]

Low probability high consequence is the word at my local ski patrol

[Shadam]

I started playing this crazy game in Fernie. every year we were faced with the same story. "worst avy conditions for years" ok so it was usually a result of wet warm snowpack down there.

but do you remember the young lady that worked for island lake who died in a avy when she went to check the snow study plot one morning. obviously it wasn't a safe place for a snow study plot and certainly not a task that should have been performed solo.

everyone underestimates "safetys" and trimlines ...

[grinch]

human nature too. people feel safer going to repeat spots or like that girl going to the study plot. you let your guard down. we all look for those signs. new loading, sun/direct heat, wind but I think the most overlooked is weather system change. this yr in particular its been a major factor. if you skier trigger something you may just rip out a pocket. with a huge weather system and subsequent rapid temp elevation the potential for a huge area to rip out exists this yr. we all make our decisions early and are aware of the factors of daytime heat because of the sun but its not quite as apparent if the vis is the same but temp rockets up with a system. it seems like a lot of fluctuations this yr with the jet stream ripping down from the north cooling some areas more than normal. it'd almost be useful to have some sort of warning alarm indicating rapid temp spike. just a thought. by the way 45 is much ot young. vibes.

[LeeLau]

I started playing this crazy game in Fernie. every year we were faced with the same story. "worst avy conditions for years" ok so it was usually a result of wet warm snowpack down there.

but do you remember the young lady that worked for island lake who died in a avy when she went to check the snow study plot one morning. obviously it wasn't a safe place for a snow study plot and certainly not a task that should have been performed solo.

everyone underestimates "safetys" and trimlines ...

Aidan.

I know 4 people in the last 4 years who haven't come home. That year 2006 was a bad year too

[Arno]

This has been a bad year for avalanches in the B.C. Interior, with slides happening in places you wouldn't expect and going much bigger than expected.

Earlier this winter a helicopter was sitting at a pick up spot when the air blast from an avalanche caused it to flip over. The pilot and one passenger were both sitting inside. Fortunately, nobody was seriously injured, but it could have been much worse. Could you imagine if it was running and there was a group of guests crouching next to it waiting to get on?

The reason you crouch REALLY close to the heli is exactly this - in theory it can tip over and you still stay under the blades. I have never tested this in practise.

Anyway, this is very sad news. Vibes to family and friends

[powtario]

Vibes....for one person to be under 3m and the others relatively OK, when it sounds like they were all there waiting, sounds terrifying.

If it came down and took out a couple hundred meters of old growth at that elevation, that would be ~1/150 year event at least? As much as can be said about bad decision making, risk assessment, etc, it kinda sounds more like really shitty luck.

And Lee, wow. That's rough.

[neufox47]

An hour to dig him out, I can only imagine the physical and psychological exhaustion that must have set in. 3 meters down through mixed debris including trees...

Sent from my VS980 4G using TGR Forums

[Silly Euro]

The victim was Jannik Inselkammer, head of Augustiner Brewery in Munich. RIP.

[hortence]

Vibes to family and RIP



The avalache guru here has been warning us about if things are gonna slide then they're gonna slide big. It's still the case. Its because of the prolonged dry spell earlier in the year followed by a relatively cold/dry winter.

Its been relatively cool lately so I doubt this slide would be due to increased melt, although I do feel that the wilder extremes we've been experiencing is contributing to larger avalanches. A lot of areas with old growth forest (400+ year old trees) getting wiped out... Obviously proving that scientifically will be extremely difficult, and therefore the idea should be completely disregarded.

But decision making also relies on intuition and other non-scientific factors. It may just be a matter of realizing that the current data to date may not be as informative as it was in years past and to try and adjust accordingly.

[jamesp]

Avy went 150 metres through a mature tree stand. Obviously the trees is not that safety spot this year. Shit.

Most, if not all, people would consider themselves in a safe spot if the hazard was Mod/Con & they were behind a 150m x 250m patch of big trees. Have to put this down to WTF / bad luck.

[newbreak]

In a year like this with deep slabs ripping out New paths, you have to consider the" forest thru the trees" and determine where the avalanche will run, regardless of the trees that are already there. We saw this example on the Iron Mask slide path in February 2014 outside of Copper Mountain... just ripped the mountain a new one.

Concretejungle brings up this exact point: alpha angle. A year like this, you can't really rely on past history to dictate your safe zones. It requires new thought and tools each time you go out. Think about alpha angles and be prepare for the worst.

http://www.avalanche-center.org/Educ...lpha-angle.php

[whipski]

Pretty sure you'll be safe on the couch...unless you're in Missoula

[beer30]

The victim was Jannik Inselkammer, head of Augustiner Brewery in Munich. RIP.

Jesus, this compounds the tragedy ten fold! RIP, ill drink an auggie in your memory

[bodywhomper]

In a year like this with deep slabs ripping out New paths, you have to consider the" forest thru the trees" and determine where the avalanche will run, regardless of the trees that are already there. We saw this example on the Iron Mask slide path in February 2014 outside of Copper Mountain... just ripped the mountain a new one.

Concretejungle brings up this exact point: alpha angle. A year like this, you can't really rely on past history to dictate your safe zones. It requires new thought and tools each time you go out. Think about alpha angles and be prepare for the worst.

http://www.avalanche-center.org/Educ...lpha-angle.php

if indeed this was a greater-than 100-yr event, then perhaps it ran beyond the alpha angle, per the article....

it'll be interesting if the incident report discusses this specific subject.

rip