OFFICIAL I70 BITCH THREAD....

[hatchgreenchile]

pretty much rtd lied about their light rail projects, the costs, and the actual design it was the biggest bunch of bullshit ever given to the citizens, so now your asking people to trust cdot with billions of dollars in more tax revenues, why should anyone trust them to actually do what they say they will do, cdot will hire lots of more managers and very few workers, the managers will justify their jobs, by making more rules and more paper work for them to push around instead of actually putting the money into paving projects and worker bees

rtd fucked up massively by trying out some new road crossing gate technology that was never proven, now rtd is wasting millions by posting guards and police 24 hrs a day at all street crossings, they have been building railroad crossing gates for how many years and rtd can't seem to get it right? Who is paying the bill for that screw up, they'll tell you someone else, but it's tax dollars

rtd knew from day one that a line would never be built to boulder, but they needed boulder county tax dollars to help subsidize the metro denver construction

I'll bet it still won't get built in 2042

The crossing guards do suck, but I think the rest of your rant is typical "inefficient gubment cant do der jobz" bullshit.

Yeah, there have been some hurdles, some justifiable, some questionable, with Fastracks, but overall, most tracks were built and highways got rebuilt, as they were originally planned too. Pretty easy to find public works fuckups that make Fastracks look like a godsend.

Either way, statewide prioritization of infrastructure maintenance and upgrades through new tax revenue (argue among friends on how to do that) will be crucial as Colorado grows.

[fastfred]

The crossing guards do suck, but I think the rest of your rant is typical "inefficient gubment cant do der jobz" bullshit.

Yeah, there have been some hurdles, some justifiable, some questionable, with Fastracks, but overall, most tracks were built and highways got rebuilt, as they were originally planned too. Pretty easy to find public works fuckups that make Fastracks look like a godsend.

Either way, statewide prioritization of infrastructure maintenance and upgrades through new tax revenue (argue among friends on how to do that) will be crucial as Colorado grows.

I'm sitting here in my underware on a monday afternoon screwing around texting some chick back and forth hoping to hook up with her later I'd go skiing but my legs are sore as shit and on top of it I'm wondering where my gov't check is cause their a month late. figures. the feds take 90 days to pay, state takes 30 - 60 but you roll with that shit. goverment isn't that bad but when they start trying to pull shit out of their ass that is unproven or not typical then there is a problem, they shouldn't be in the R&D business or taking big chances on things that may or may not work. I've got four guys out there unsupervised playing with themselves right now and they better be making me money, payroll is due on wed and I have to make sure it's there, I can't just ask the tax payers for money and dole it out and then ask for more because I made a bunch of piss poor decisions, gov't gets to do that without any repercussions. But for some reason alot of incompetent politicians and gov't workers are allowed to do that day after day and that bothers me.

[summit]

Low hanging fruit would help during busy periods:
-Actual enforcement of chain/traction laws so pileups don't happen as much.
-Big fines for those who disregard them.
-No semis Friday night, Sat AM, Sunday PM
-Fix the fucking potholes.

Not expensive compared to expansion or train, but these would help.

I don't even mind when I70 is rolling at like 30-40 mph the whole way from Floyd Hill to Georgetown HIll during busy periods. It's the dead stop crawls for an hour plus that kill ya.

This plus mandate snow tires and enforce aggressively. Works in other states/countries

Why pay for 100x for 2x capacity via new lanes/transit solutions when it costs 1% to make what we have 2x more efficient?

[hatchgreenchile]

I'm sitting here in my underware on a monday afternoon screwing around texting some chick back and forth hoping to hook up with her later I'd go skiing but my legs are sore as shit and on top of it I'm wondering where my gov't check is cause their a month late. figures. the feds take 90 days to pay, state takes 30 - 60 but you roll with that shit. goverment isn't that bad but when they start trying to pull shit out of their ass that is unproven or not typical then there is a problem, they shouldn't be in the R&D business or taking big chances on things that may or may not work. I've got four guys out there unsupervised playing with themselves right now and they better be making me money, payroll is due on wed and I have to make sure it's there, I can't just ask the tax payers for money and dole it out and then ask for more because I made a bunch of piss poor decisions, gov't gets to do that without any repercussions. But for some reason alot of incompetent politicians and gov't workers are allowed to do that day after day and that bothers me.

Nice humble brag. You got it so good you have to mention it left and right. #livingthedream

R&D business? Light rail, HOV lanes and expanded parking are hardly groundbreaking. Now, the scale of the project may be unique for a city of Denver's size, but it's not uncharted territory. They were aggressive about light rail and new lanes all over the metro, and that's better than slow rolling it. Cost overruns do happen and it be nice if there were some repercussions, but what else is new? Colorado got spoiled by T-Rex, we're seeing the other side of the coin now.

[The SnowShow]

This plus mandate snow tires and enforce aggressively. Works in other states/countries

Why pay for 100x for 2x capacity via new lanes/transit solutions when it costs 1% to make what we have 2x more efficient?

Yep. Most of the shitshow is volume but that volume moves as long as there aren't trucks going 30 in the right lane that everyone has to go around, or the many idiots who drive with bald tires during a traction law restriction and either can't get up a hill or cause a 3 hour shutdown.

[summit]

Yep. Most of the shitshow is volume but that volume moves as long as there aren't trucks going 30 in the right lane that everyone has to go around, or the many idiots who drive with bald tires during a traction law restriction and either can't get up a hill or cause a 3 hour shutdown.

Exactly... not sure how it will help in the summer except maybe the semi restriction (which would apply to towing boats and RVs?)

[grskier]

This plus mandate snow tires and enforce aggressively. Works in other states/countries

Why pay for 100x for 2x capacity via new lanes/transit solutions when it costs 1% to make what we have 2x more efficient?

On 30-45 days a year? I agree about those days, but what % of the time does I 70 sit snow/ice packed? It's low enough that it doesn't even register on the Highway Safety Improvement Plan.

[The SnowShow]

Exactly... not sure how it will help in the summer except maybe the semi restriction (which would apply to towing boats and RVs?)

Yes! It's always the parade of trailers and Winnebagos that makes the traffic insufferable during rush hours. Make them hold for those times.

[summit]

On 30-45 days a year? I agree about those days, but what % of the time does I 70 sit snow/ice packed? It's low enough that it doesn't even register on the Highway Safety Improvement Plan.

How about an aggregate amount of delay caused by weather related slowdown/closures/wrecks vs summer volume? I'd bet the winter stacks up pretty darn high because the aggregate delay from one 3 hour closure for jacknifed semis or multiple spinouts is way higher than a few days of high volume traffic... because a closure means nobody moves vs simply delaying. What percent of accidents are weather related vs volume?

Now what percent would aggressive enforcement and a snow tire requirement ameliorate? And what is the cost? Vs enforcement cost, I bet there is a significant savings between economic losses prevented by less slowdowns, preventing closures, reducing accidents/injuries... combined with fines. So whether it fully cures the problem is besides the point... net economic benefit and some improvement! Why aren't we doing this now? Some rural landowner in Montrose yells at his rep about "Muh Rught for summer tires when I drive muh farm truck on the I70 2x per winter!" and further traction/enforcement push/laws dies behind the scenes.

Clearly CSP doesn't have the resources to enforce sufficiently and/or the fines are light enough that people are willing to take the risk.

Clearly I'm not the one writing the HSIP.

Yes! It's always the parade of trailers and Winnebagos that makes the traffic insufferable during rush hours. Make them hold for those times.

Not enough we tell commerce to stay off the interstate at certain hours... but how are we going to respond to lots of "Muh Trailur!" types who have deep enough pockets for $75K+ F350s towing a $75K+ second home or boat? They got lobbying money just like commerce and their chain skipping semis.

Remember, everyone who is driving slow because their vehicle is incapable of going faster are the same people who do not think that the clogged roads are slowing them down... cuz they aren't... so whats the problem? "MUH BOAT!"

[rmnpsplitter]

It's on a monthly repeat.

I was gonna say weekly, typical peak on Sunday night to Monday morning

[stfu&gbtw]

Letting in? I'm talking about population control like forced castration and limits on children. Not some BS "too many people here" complaining. The earth has too many people not just Colorado.

What I find funny is that you ran away from the overly crowded, traffic ensnared, hostile east coast. They never figured out how to get the infrastructure to work to support the people there. They just allowed for sprawl and the economics just worked out who has to sit in a car for hours. So you think with you enlightened brain that I70 is going to be a different story? You fall right back into that sad feeling that it is already too late. It can't be fixed. You claim it is because of a lack of trying but you should just admit that it was too small a cooridor to begin with. It's over man. Admit it and deal with it like the rest of the people here.

I lol'd. Especially the part about how NYC's infrastructure doesn't work and the city has just relied on sprawl. Says the guy from Colorado... The corridor is too small? Manhattan island is 11 miles long and a little over two miles wide and sees the better part of three times the population of the state of Colorado every day.

If Denver were an island, it would be deserted.. I mean, you'd have to like... build a bridge... or a tunnel.. and who's got time for that shit man?

[Danno]

Truthfully, New York WAS good at building infrastructure, amazingly good. But I don't think anyone is good at it now. How many years have they been working on the 2nd avenue subway line? What other big infrastructure projects have they done in the last twenty-five years?

Anywhere else? Everything I hear about the Big Dig in Boston is that it was a fiasco.

So acting like East Coast folks know how to do this is wrong, they KNEW how to do this. But I'd love to hear of recent examples of monster infrastructure projects anywhere that taxpayers willingly funded.

[Foggy_Goggles]

Please explain to me how you are going to justify no semis during busy tourist traffic. You do understand that every mountain community would literally run out of food if they were not resupplied during the weekends.

Oh...and for all you Europhiles that think that they've got it figured out, you did not witness what I witnesses on the Col Du Laterlet a couple weeks ago. It took American style driving retardation to the next level.

[fastfred]

Nice humble brag. You got it so good you have to mention it left and right. #livingthedream

R&D business? Light rail, HOV lanes and expanded parking are hardly groundbreaking. Now, the scale of the project may be unique for a city of Denver's size, but it's not uncharted territory. They were aggressive about light rail and new lanes all over the metro, and that's better than slow rolling it. Cost overruns do happen and it be nice if there were some repercussions, but what else is new? Colorado got spoiled by T-Rex, we're seeing the other side of the coin now.

you bet bro

for someone who barely got out of high school with a diploma a D average and taking lots of classes over in summer school every year I've done ok at least I was ahead of my brother who took the ged 7 times before passing

[simple]

NYC infrastructure doesn't work. Every line in and out off that city is plugged with cars, trucks, and people crammed into tubes. They haven't built anything new in decades. They just fix aging asphalt, concrete, and steel with union labor that takes forever to complete. The only smart thing they came up with was night crews. They can't even replace a deteriorating bridge correctly. Sad.

[fastfred]

Truthfully, New York WAS good at building infrastructure, amazingly good. But I don't think anyone is good at it now. How many years have they been working on the 2nd avenue subway line? What other big infrastructure projects have they done in the last twenty-five years?

Anywhere else? Everything I hear about the Big Dig in Boston is that it was a fiasco.

So acting like East Coast folks know how to do this is wrong, they KNEW how to do this. But I'd love to hear of recent examples of monster infrastructure projects anywhere that taxpayers willingly funded.

the problem is a bunch of gov't workers and politicians get together and dream up some project, they put a price tag on it and sell it to the public. Two things happen either it's design build which is a cost over run nightmare or it goes out to engineering before it's actually built. The idiot poltiicians and gov't workers assign a cost of 5 million to a project, but once people who know what they are doing get their hands on it they actually realize the cost is going to be 10 million but no one saw that comming right?

For fun I've been following the work spec's on the confluence park project in downtown denver. What a mess the cost is now 5 times more than originally estimated. Because no one considered doing a test well to look for toxic waste? what kind of idiots are in charge? that's gov't workers for you? It has gotten even better now because a denver water line broke and flooded the work site a month ago, so now they are rebidding the remediation for that mess, cost over run for the fourth time now. So all these people who fucked up just stand around and ask the politicians to come up with more money to fix their screw ups with no reprecussions for bad decision making on their part.

[Name Redacted]

the problem is a bunch of gov't workers and politicians get together and dream up some project, they put a price tag on it and sell it to the public. Two things happen either it's design build which is a cost over run nightmare or it goes out to engineering before it's actually built. The idiot poltiicians and gov't workers assign a cost of 5 million to a project, but once people who know what they are doing get their hands on it they actually realize the cost is going to be 10 million but no one saw that comming right?
.

Or by the time the project is rolling, a whole new set of politicians is voted into office with different priorities and everything changes.

[summit]

Please explain to me how you are going to justify no semis during busy tourist traffic. You do understand that every mountain community would literally run out of food if they were not resupplied during the weekends.

I think it might be doable... only talking about 8-12 hours worth of restriction per week about 26 weeks per year. It would require some planning by commercial drivers who would know the schedule well ahead of time.

Hey... maybe CDOT should do a test to see how it works... like they tested their rolling CSP roadblock idea with the newspeak name.

Oh...and for all you Europhiles that think that they've got it figured out, you did not witness what I witnesses on the Col Du Laterlet a couple weeks ago. It took American style driving retardation to the next level.

Europe does work better over all on the roads, but it does so because of expensive-despite-massive-tax-subsidies-yet-still-less-convenient public transit (that only works due to higher population density) that keeps driver numbers lower combined with high taxes on cars, gas, and many tolls that also keep driver numbers lower. So you have fewer drivers who then have higher standards for drivers/more stringent testing/classes. There are still idiots.

[simple]

Yes...Bring on the expensive tolls....Better yet make your epic or super pass scannable on I-70 toll cooridor.

[stfu&gbtw]

NYC infrastructure doesn't work. Every line in and out off that city is plugged with cars, trucks, and people crammed into tubes. They haven't built anything new in decades. They just fix aging asphalt, concrete, and steel with union labor that takes forever to complete. The only smart thing they came up with was night crews. They can't even replace a deteriorating bridge correctly. Sad.

I lol'd again... That non-functional infrastructure brings nearly 2 million people into Manhattan every single weekday morning, and off again every single weekday evening. For reference, the picture shows the rough area of Manhattan (closer to 125%) superimposed over Denver. Every run of the mill weekday morning, there are about a million and a half people here to begin with, and between the hours of 6 and 9am, two million more people join them. And then between the hours of 4 and 7 pm, those two million people go home again. And every single one of them comes and goes via one of about 2 dozen exits.



So, not only does NYC infrastructure work, it works well beyond its intended capacity. And the reason it can do that is because people go out of their way to live within the confines of the system. People do not obstinately refuse to travel at off peak times. People do not refuse to fund their governments' transportation departments. People actively seek out opportunities to use public transportation, realizing it is both faster and cheaper than driving.

Infrastructure doesn't grow by itself. Denver's infrastructure challenges are SO much more simple than NYC's ever were, let alone as challenging as they are today. Is it hard to dig a tunnel? Try digging this tunnel, through granite, under water, 200' below ground:



Denver has no infrastructure because a majority of the population doesn't believe in it, simple as that. The population of Denver does very little to leverage the infrastructure they have, and won't even consider methods that are successfully implemented elsewhere all over the world. The only things in CO that make infrastructure less attainable than in other cities are the people who live there.

[doebedoe]

....The only things in CO that make infrastructure less attainable than in other cities are the people who live there.

I don't always agree with Mr. STFU...but this is spot the fuck on.

[simple]

I don't always agree with Mr. STFU...but this is spot the fuck on.

No it's not. We the people my ass. You guys are so clueless.

[stfu&gbtw]

No it's not. We the people my ass. You guys are so clueless.

Be sure to vote for the proposed tax increases/TABOR amendments... Either that or leave. That's one good way to reduce the state's population. I hear Jarbidge, NV has very little planned infrastructure improvement, and space to accommodate several other people.

[simple]

...And you just proved it...thanks

[stfu&gbtw]

...And you just proved it...thanks

Have you considered Butthurtistan? You'd fit right in.