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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Chamonix
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    1,012

    Light-ish 100-110mm Euro-touring/steep ski options

    I'm hunting down a new ski to pair with Plums and Vulcans for Euro touring and steeps so I've been geeking out on my options this week during some down-time.

    The ski will replace my CoreUpt Assentions (AKA Coiriers) and join Katanas, Bent Chetlers, Explosivs and OG Fujas in the quiver. Me: 6ft4 and 80kg, strong skier. Looking for a 100-110mm waist, mellow tip rocker, minimal tail rocker, minimal twintip tail, camber underfoot, 25m+ radius and under 2200g per ski in a 190-195cm length. Needs a good grip and firm flex for steeps and variable snow so sub-2kg isn't too realistic. So yeah, I know what I want but just not sure of all the options out there. Obviously compromises will need to be made within these parameters and ultimately price will be a factor, but I'm rounding up my options for now.

    The skis below look to fit the bill, any comments on these or any others that should be on my radar? Boutique US-based brands will be hard to come by at a good price but feel free to suggest them anyway.

    193 Nordica Vagabond (108mm), ~2326g (soft, heavier than ideal)
    193 Blizzard Scout (108mm), ~2222g (flat camber, otherwise good)
    188 Kastle BMX 108 (108mm), 2317g (short, but reportedly chargy)
    190 G3 Manhattan (108mm), ~2150g (one unfavourable review from a friend but need to look into it more)
    190 Dynafit Stoke (108mm), 1780g (too light for me in variable snow?)
    190 Dynastar Cham 107 HM (107mm), 2000g
    190 Kastle TX107 (107mm), 1790g (too light?)
    188 Rossi Soul 7 (106mm), 2027g (short, more rocker than I'd like)
    190 Fischer Watea 106 (106mm), ~2337g
    188 Black Diamond Convert (105mm), 1750g (too light?)
    188 Salomon Q105 (105mm), ~2250g (I generally dislike Salomon skis, including the Rocker 108 which I spent one resort day on last winter)
    190 Atomic Ritual (103mm), ~2100g (I skied these one day last winter in variable resort conditions, felt like not enough ski)
    192 Armada TST (102mm), 2035g (more tip rocker than I'd like, full twin tail)
    186 4FRNT Cody (102mm), 2100g (short)

    Thanks for any input.
    Last edited by LC; 11-24-2013 at 05:19 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    1,037
    Quote Originally Posted by LC View Post
    100-110mm waist, mellow tip rocker, minimal tail rocker, minimal twintip tail, camber underfoot, 25m+ radius and under 2200g per ski in a 190-195cm length.
    The skis below look to fit the bill, any comments on these or any others that should be on my radar? Boutique US-based brands will be hard to come by at a good price but feel free to suggest them anyway.
    Check out the Backcountry and the Freedride. Price is good for another week
    http://www.praxisskis.com/

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    30,881
    the stoke is discontinued so you might find it cheap but ime its a soft ski so you need to go long
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    253
    But it can't ride variable snow, so cut that out... I would check out the scout :-)

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    CH
    Posts
    1,871
    LC we have 3 options in that weight/length metic. Contact us anytime with questions. www.downskis.com
    #1 goal this year......stay alive +
    DOWN SKIS

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    4,286
    DPS Wailer 99 or W105 Pure 3 construction - this coming season's version. I prefer the W105 - minimal rocker and longer turn raidius. I ski an older version of the 188cm length at 6'2" and 195lbs and never felt needed longer. Smoothest most responsive ski I have skied but that is mho and weighs in at around 1800g per ski. Enjoy.

    Edit: looks like the W105 is no longer in production. Bummer for me.

    Looks like I will need to revisit the W99 for future consideration.
    Note: have not skied the W99 in a 192 length and have not tried the Pure 3 construction but I never had a problem with the earlier version and loved the liveliness and feel of the skis while some felt it was not damp enough. Have not heard that complaint with the Pure 3 from others.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using TGR Forums
    Last edited by lynchdogger; 08-25-2013 at 01:33 PM.
    The Passion is in the Risk

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    47
    Dynafit Huascaran and Grand Teton match the desired shape pretty closely. 112ish / 105ish. Right amount of tip rocker that does not extend too far into the ski. Tail rocker is minimal.Both really light. 1780gr at 177 for the Huascaran. It'll come down to whether they are enough ski for you. I just got myself a Huascaran for a similar euro purpose. Stupid light with Dynafit speeds and nicely stiff in the mid section.

    Other skis I was considering were Praxis BC and Voile Charger. Both have more tail rocker. Weights are similar.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    833
    Cmon : You know that after assessing all options (for many hours) you will just end up getting some K2 Hardside / Sidestash off conrad for 200 euroz

    Movement Jackal always looked like a nice ski to me. Blizzard and Elan are also meant to be be very good these days (along with usual suggestion of dyna, volkl etc).

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Squamish BC.
    Posts
    707
    Prior Husume and Overlord with XTC carbon option.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    30,881
    Quote Originally Posted by Moralkaka View Post
    But it can't ride variable snow
    well OP did put it on the list, mostly I am skiing it in soft conditions but I have had to deal with variable conditions the Stoke can get kicked around a little at that weight but IMO its a good BC ski if you are not too heavy

    At 155 lbs I like the 191 stoke just fine I think optimal weight for the 191 is 160-170 lbs and probably 140lbs for a 181 stoke

    I bet if the OP is looking at a 190 in all those other skis he is too heavy for the Stoke
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Crested Butte, CO
    Posts
    757
    Scouts are pretty damn awesome skis for any and all conditions. I found them to be about 95% as capable as the Cochise, which is up there for most capable ski going. Personally I'd be hesitant to do much ski mountaineering on a 193 anything, but I'm nowhere near 6'4" either.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Whistler, BC
    Posts
    1,495
    Quote Originally Posted by Wetdog View Post
    Prior Husume and Overlord with XTC carbon option.
    Lorne, you will like these options I think. Skied em for a few days last year and I'm gonna get some 188cm Husume's for touring this winter-stable, fun, light and predictable. The overlords were AWESOME in a 193 but a bit too turny/loose in a 188.

    Miss ya, no homo.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
    Posts
    4,638
    get the bonafide, awesome ski and at your weight target, and put dynafits on it.

    forget about light skis, they get deflected all over the place

    Sent from my SCH-I500 using TGR Forums

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Not Brooklyn
    Posts
    8,319
    Last year my ski mountaineering ski was the Countdown 4. It is excellent. I'm 5'10" 180. I also used the 185 Cochise for a week of couloir skiing in the Dolomites where there is often less skinning and climbing involved. While the stability of the Cochise in all conditions is excellent, there is no pop in the tail of those skis. Despite having a similar profile, the Down skis offer some useable rebound out of the sort of turns one makes skiing narrow steeps, while keeping a loose, yet stable feel. I think it was this, rather than the weight difference, that make the CD4's so much less tiring. For your size, the CD3 Carbon looks spot on, although perhaps a bit wide. On the other hand, while it is my go to resort ski because it is utterly predictable and "easier" than other charger-type skis, the Cochise (and I'm assuming the Scout as well) isn't ideal for linking slower turns on steeps when conditions call for caution. If you're insanely fit, or you never ski slowly, you may not care.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    verbier, milan, isla de pascua
    Posts
    4,806
    The scout will be your friend.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,289
    The 186 Llasa's that Splat's offering are superb & that's a cracking price. I've got a pair of brand new 191 Llasa Fats in stock but they're 117 underfoot a bit wider than your brief.

    What does match your requirements is the new Whitedot Ranger in either traditional construction or their carbonlite build. Their 186 would do it for your weight but you might also want to try the 195 Pro for your height.

    186cm: 310mm rocker, 108mm underfoot, 28m radius, 2mm camber, flat tail notched for skins, 1975g in traditional construction or 1840g in carbonlite construction.

    195cm Pro (slightly burlier build than the shorter 168, 177 or 186 lengths): 300mm rocker, 110mm underfoot, 30.5m radius, 2mm camber, flat tail notched for skins, 2300g in traditional construction or 2150g in carbonlite construction.

    Available to demo in Cham. Think you can also purchase there but if not I can ship from the UK & I've got 'em on a pre-order deal until the end of August.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    833
    The ski will replace my CoreUpt Assentions (AKA Coiriers)
    BTW Lorne : A friend has some un-drilled 188cm Core-upt gathering dust in his garage in Aberdeen.
    He tried to sell them to me last winter (100 euros) - could put you in touch if you were interested.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    343
    Quote Originally Posted by Scottish_Skier View Post
    Cmon : You know that after assessing all options (for many hours) you will just end up getting some K2 Hardside / Sidestash off conrad for 200 euroz
    Hrhrhr that sounds too familiar...

    Been touring with 185cm g3 tonics for the last couple of years, and being roughly same size (bit heavier tho) find them a little short for big days out. Going to get my hands on some CD3 carbons (on the wider side of what you are looking for) from down this season after having very similar criteria for the skis that you seem to have. Might be worthwhile having a look at what they have on offer.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    somewhere friggin flat
    Posts
    57
    I'd say Whitedot Ranger 186 as well. I'm even considering shorter for touring But you'd better try if they are stiff enough for you. (they are not super stiff but they like a firm hand)

    I skied the Prototype/Demo in Cham last winter and they are reaaly nice. Swingweight is uncanny, flex just right. Forgot I had not ever skied these things after 5 minutes. It is just a boring ski on paper but a really good one in practice and quite good on piste as well.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    58
    Quote Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds! View Post
    Last year my ski mountaineering ski was the Countdown 4....the Down skis offer some useable rebound out of the sort of turns one makes skiing narrow steeps, while keeping a loose, yet stable feel.
    The 4 and 6 are all full reverse camber this year. Not sure how comparable they'll be.

    Quote Originally Posted by LC View Post
    Boutique US-based brands will be hard to come by at a good price but feel free to suggest them anyway.
    I have a couple of pairs of Praxis skis in presales, and they've both come in under 500 euros with carbon and postage (not including import duty though). Current sale prices plus TGR code will be a bit higher than that, but not too expensive. Freeride looks like it would suit you.
    Last edited by coldandwet; 08-27-2013 at 12:42 AM.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Bern, CH
    Posts
    346
    I use 187 Kabookie for what you describe and am similar specs. Plums and Cochise. Scout if you want extra width, but not for steep steeps... A bit of radius and a <100mm ski with flat tail will make thing simpler when it gets past 60

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    78° 41′ 0″ N, 16° 24′ 0″ E
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    1,522
    Quote Originally Posted by coldandwet View Post
    The 4 and 6 are all full reverse camber this year. Not sure how comparable they'll be.
    Here is a comparison between last years and this years profile of the Countdown 4. (Download to view in detail.)

    The continuous elliptical rocker is super low under foot and then gradually increases towards the tip and tail where it transitions into the tip and tail rise (also elliptical), and as you can see the tail is lower than last years. The idea has been to improve hard snow performance by increasing the useable effective edge of the ski, and all reports on the protos indicate that we´ve succeded in increasing hard snow performance without sacrificing anything in maneuverability and soft snow performance.
    Last edited by SiSt; 08-27-2013 at 02:02 AM. Reason: Updated pdf for clarity.
    simen@downskis.com DOWN SKIS

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Chamonix
    Posts
    1,012
    Thanks for the replies & suggestions everyone. I'll check out these new options too.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Whistler, BC
    Posts
    1,495
    New BD Convert would be worth a look too, Colin could get ya a deal.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Chamonix
    Posts
    1,012
    Quote Originally Posted by rob stokes View Post
    New BD Convert would be worth a look too, Colin could get ya a deal.
    Aye, it's listed above and Colin mentioned it too. I'm really not convinced that a sub-2kg ski will hold up to variable snow for me though.

    What was it you didn't like about your Trusts? Might be another option, fits the "light-ish" requirement.

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