legal question regarding neighbors filled lot failing

[L7]

Seller's disclosure as mentioned above which to some extent should be universal. Then there is your sellers line of 'take it or leave it'. I'll take 'b' alex...'leave it' for $0. No disclosure and the seller offered the leave it option. The seller should be dealing with this first beforehand or disclosing the issue, ignoring both is not an option. Walk away, don't fall for buying something you got an emotional attachment to even though all reason says run away.

[Bobby Finstock]

why would you want to move in next to an asshole?

Spookie every middle class wage slave dreams of owning a money pit. Why do hate America?

[hutash]

Stop reading Internet law and hire a real attorney. The person you sell to in the future will, if they have any sense, and you could get screwed because of your neighbor.

Again, get everything in writing before purchasing such a lot. How will do the work, when, who will certify it was done properly, who will pay for it, what happens and who is responsible if it slides again,(which it will if not done right which it obviously wasn't), et cetera.

It sounds like your use for this property is unique, but it could easily end up in a legal quagmire in the future, especially when you go to sell.

[philth]

run the other fucking way, dude.

I have to agree with Spook the Kook on this one.

[stfu&gbtw]

Just like everyone else has said, buying a house that is in the likely path of a mudslide with the idea that you'll just sue your neighbor (who has already indicated they won't be inclined to help) when it happens, is a really, really, REALLY bad idea. Really. Bad.

Really.

But obviously, that's not getting through... Have fun.

Anyone want to start a pool on the ETA of the "mudslide from asshole neighbor's property cracked foundation and destroyed boat - HELP!" thread?

[GeezerSteve]

Seller's disclosure as mentioned above which to some extent should be universal.

. . . "to some extent should be universal" is an oxymoron, no?

Written seller disclosures are not required in some states. They are creatures of state statutes. I have no clue whether or not AK has such a statute nor anything about AK's applicable common law principles. Nor have I looked at BFD's contract.

BFD, ignore all advice on this thread and get an attorney, fer chrissakes. This is bread and butter stuff for a journeyman AK attorney with residential RE experience.

[XXX-er]

It looks to me like you are in process of buying land with geo tech issues that ocurred you are not sure when, if you can stop giving them the money until you get some clarity thats what I would do

If I was you (which you seem to be asking) I would get a real lawyer who knows AK law and stick to surveying

[hutash]

Do not go any further with the purchase until you spend some money with a good land use attorney. This has "potential for disaster" written all over it. You, the past owner, and the neighbor need to have everything in writing before anything gets done.

Stop reading Internet law and hire a real attorney.

BFD, ignore all advice on this thread and get an attorney, fer chrissakes. This is bread and butter stuff for a journeyman AK attorney with residential RE experience.

well, maybe not ignore all the advice

[I Am Mr. Ed]

Send a PM to I Fvckd Mrs. ngle! He can rant on the Internet about your neighbor like the tough guy he is.

[BFD]

I spoke with an attorney today. Since I am buying the place with the existing dirt I will be stuck with that cleanup. Any claim against the neighbor would have to be initiated by the present owners and transferred with the property. I think they will not do this.
I have received a price of $1700 to clean up the mess on the lot.
Once I own the property the neighbor will be responsible to me for any further dirt that comes down on my property.
I am not too worried about damage from any more dirt coming down.
I think my neighbor wants and needs to stabilize the hill. He may lose his parking area and part of his driveway. I have no obligation to help him stabilize the slope. My neighbor should of done what was right in the first place. The issue should not of been put on me. I am telling him I will be happy to let him use my property for access to make repairs. I expect to be compensated for the $1700.
It is a shame you have to involve lawyers to get someone to do what is right.

[RootSkier]

This has all the makings of an epic shitshow, even after your lawyer provided a bunch of advice.

Just to clarify...you are going to buy this damaged property and clean it up. Yet when the neighbor finally decides he wants to fix his shit, you are going to extort your costs out of him before you allow him to actually fix it?

Here's a hypothetical for you: you clean it up. Next year, he comes in and wants to fix it. You say "Give me $1700 or pound sand." He tells you he just wants to fix it now, and won't give you the $1700. You say no. He says no again. Then there is a major failure.

What now, champ? You are going to go after him for something you wouldn't let him fix with paying you for something you knowingly bought?

Can't wait to hear the updates in volume 2.0.

[BFD]

If it happens it happens. I do not think rich people like to get sued. People should accept their responsibilities. He has a major failure his house will be worthless. I cab scoop up the dirt and fill a corner of my lot. I will gladly let him fix the problem. I am just not willing to pay for a problem he created nor should I be expected to,

[stfu&gbtw]

If it happens it happens. I do not think rich people like to get sued. People should accept their responsibilities. He has a major failure his house will be worthless. I cab scoop up the dirt and fill a corner of my lot. I will gladly let him fix the problem. I am just not willing to pay for a problem he created nor should I be expected to,

You must have way too much free time. Won't for long though... Enjoy your lawsuit.

[L7]

. . . "to some extent should be universal" is an oxymoron, no?

Universal as in should exist everywhere 'to some extent'. But maybe not, I still can't wrap my head around the lack of banking regs you guys have down (or up) there and where that got you. To some extent as in maybe cover structure, maybe basement leakage, maybe land stability issues. Lots of different things that may or may not be covered as in 'to some extent'. Again, we regulate a lot of this stuff, you guys maybe not so much. I stand by run the hell away. Probably spend more on a lawyer, time and aggravation then the deposit is worth depending on how much deposit is down. If it's unstable it will just keep coming and costing money.

[astralboy15]

Fixed it for you:

...I really couldn't care less about the house...

[Snow Dog]

This takes me back to engineering classes and Geology 101 long ago. The hill saturates with water and then you get mud flow. If you and your neighbour are willing to do some drainage and water management it might work. If the property is a deal -- because you have to factor in engineering and earth moving costs -- then I might go for it. You need a geo-technical engineer to give a report and estimate. Split the cost with you future neighbour.

The best real estate deals always come with issues.

[Hugh Conway]

I do not think rich people like to get sued. People should accept their responsibilities.

This is the US. The quickest way to get rich is to make everything someone else's responsibility.

[iscariot]

This is the US. The quickest way to get rich is to make everything someone else's responsibility.

Exactly. The neighbour and the previous owner are just externalizing all possible costs to increase profit for shareholders...its the American way. Why does everyone hate teh freedoms?

[OFF!lax]

Do not go any further with the purchase until you spend some money with a good land use attorney. This has "potential for disaster" written all over it. You, the past owner, and the neighbor need to have everything in writing before anything gets done.

What are you going to do the next time the lot slides in a year, or ten years?

Really $500 an hour to tell you DA DIRT HAS DONE SLID?-give me a break. Dont buy it. Move on.

[OFF!lax]

it is really hard to find a level lot in this town or a place this new. I am the town surveyor I see everything that sells and every lot. I know what else is available and what has sold in the last 10 years. I was doing an asbuilt on another property these people were buying for their daughter and son in law, previous inhabitants of the place I want to buy. I did some quick math and realized even if I do not live here I can make $500 a month on a $35,000 investment. As for the boat it is insured and the house above me would have to come down with the dirt to hit the boat.

this is the funneeez-guess you didn't "Survey" this one too good eh chief? How anybody could look at that bank and that landslide and not just walk away is why human nature is so baffling.

[Cosmic Suncloud]

hey man, by all accounts, you're a great dude .. but.....

Since I am buying the place with the existing dirt I will be stuck with that cleanup.

Or said another way, "I will forego any potential future action against the neighbor as my removal of material at the toe of the slope will be blamed by my neighbor for any future instability." Doesn't matter what your goetech says, his will say the opposite.

Any claim against the neighbor would have to be initiated by the present owners and transferred with the property.

Bullshit. If a neighbor's actions, or previous actions, have caused a threat to, or have damaged, adjacent property, then transfer of title doesn't obviate shit. However, if the situation is determined to be attributable to natural causes (which a certain court might find it to be), then you get what you get - in this case rocks and mud. Looks like there's a lot of wet soil in the area; could be that the slope would have become unstable whether or not he built a driveway.

I have received a price of $1700 to clean up the mess on the lot.

Nice. How much will it cost when your neighbor's house ends up in your yard? Will your neighbor still think its his house?

Once I own the property the neighbor will be responsible to me for any further dirt that comes down on my property.

Normally in the mountains if you are downhill, your uphill neighbor is not responsible for, by way of an example, a rock rolling downhill. If the neighbor makes a rock roll faster, or starts a rock intentionally, then its the neighbor's fault. Again, proving that some actions taken place 30 years ago are solely responsible for the current situation might be a little tough to prove.

I am not too worried about damage from any more dirt coming down.

Then don't remove the existing pile. Plant a nature garden on it. Plus, trees suck, and in few years most of them will be gone on the hillside.

I think my neighbor wants and needs to stabilize the hill. He may lose his parking area and part of his driveway.

Its entirely possible that the neighbor can't stabilize his land without permission to enter your property. Doubt he can assert a prescriptive easement claim to maintain his shit. When he asks for access, charge him out the ass.

I have no obligation to help him stabilize the slope.

Right, just make sure you don't make it worse.

My neighbor should of done what was right in the first place.

Yeah, 30 years ago in Alaska things were always done real tight and shit.

The issue should not of been put on me.

I think you've put it on yourself. Like by buying something when everything's covered in 5' of snow.
But hey, its not like it rains there very much. That erosion scar shouldn't get any bigger.


I guess what I'm trying to say is you better be getting this cheap, and be willing to lose on the whole bad neighbor thing. If it still makes sense, then do it.

[LightRanger]

Dunno why people are talking about seller's disclosures. There is an obvious slide on the property that is clearly within the diligent attention of the buyer. Whether the seller disclosed it or not is irrelevant since the buyer already knew about the issue prior to close of escrow.

Good luck dude. I wouldn't touch that place with a ten foot pole. I may or may not deal with real estate non-disclosure cases.

[TBS]

I spoke with an attorney today...
...Once I own the property the neighbor will be responsible to me for any further dirt that comes down on my property.
I have no obligation to help him stabilize the slope.
My neighbor should of done what was right in the first place. The issue should not of been put on me.
I am telling him I will be happy to let him use my property for access to make repairs.
I expect to be compensated for the $1700.
It is a shame you have to involve lawyers to get someone to do what is right.

Has your neighbor agreed with all of your attorney's learned opinions above? Thats what lawsuits are made of.

Example...another slide occurs and takes out your boat, and the house. That boat is a significant source of income for you, right?

So, what happens if your insurance company turns on you - sez you were negligent for parking the vessel in an obvious slide zone and didn't take reasonable precautions, or you failed to disclose something about the boats location. BS or not, can you survive without that boat for several years while you chase your shithead former insurance company from down below thru the courts?

This is what's going on with my former neighbors. Shitty situation all around, and they all have strong legal claims against various parties, but they still are in limbo after several years.

Is there really somebody standing there waving a wad of cash, ready to buy this place as-is if you require that hillside get stabilized before you buy? Or is the seller happy to sit back and wait for a bigger sucker?

Best of luck. I really hope this killer deal doesn't turn into a fustercluck.

STFU- I'll take the Under on April 15, 2015 for the V2.0 post. And I'll take the Over on 400 days for his insurance company to pay off. Let me know how you set up the wagers and odds, as I may take some more spots.

[GimpToo]

Just curious, what is standing at the top of the slide? . . . and, is that a drain pipe at the bottom? Not that it matters, just curious - well, except for the drain pipe - that could be a problem?

[AdironRider]

hey man, by all accounts, you're a great dude .. but.....


Or said another way, "I will forego any potential future action against the neighbor as my removal of material at the toe of the slope will be blamed by my neighbor for any future instability." Doesn't matter what your goetech says, his will say the opposite.

Bullshit. If a neighbor's actions, or previous actions, have caused a threat to, or have damaged, adjacent property, then transfer of title doesn't obviate shit. However, if the situation is determined to be attributable to natural causes (which a certain court might find it to be), then you get what you get - in this case rocks and mud. Looks like there's a lot of wet soil in the area; could be that the slope would have become unstable whether or not he built a driveway.


Nice. How much will it cost when your neighbor's house ends up in your yard? Will your neighbor still think its his house?

Normally in the mountains if you are downhill, your uphill neighbor is not responsible for, by way of an example, a rock rolling downhill. If the neighbor makes a rock roll faster, or starts a rock intentionally, then its the neighbor's fault. Again, proving that some actions taken place 30 years ago are solely responsible for the current situation might be a little tough to prove.


Then don't remove the existing pile. Plant a nature garden on it. Plus, trees suck, and in few years most of them will be gone on the hillside.

Its entirely possible that the neighbor can't stabilize his land without permission to enter your property. Doubt he can assert a prescriptive easement claim to maintain his shit. When he asks for access, charge him out the ass.


Right, just make sure you don't make it worse.


Yeah, 30 years ago in Alaska things were always done real tight and shit.


I think you've put it on yourself. Like by buying something when everything's covered in 5' of snow.
But hey, its not like it rains there very much. That erosion scar shouldn't get any bigger.


I guess what I'm trying to say is you better be getting this cheap, and be willing to lose on the whole bad neighbor thing. If it still makes sense, then do it.

BFD, if you can get owned on a skiing message board, just wait for a real court. Walk away dude.