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Thread: School me on fishing rafts
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03-21-2012, 08:21 PM #26
Rafts are sweet, get one, make sure its big enough for a few people, those pontoon boat/watermasters are great, untill you want to actually fish... you cant fish and row at the same time.
Its not that I suck at spelling, its that I just don't care
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03-22-2012, 09:21 AM #27
[QUOTE=NMmatt;3585694] Nothing more pathetic in my view than some dude anchored in his drift boat in the river fishing by himself. QUOTE]
Oh, I disagree with that statement. Finding a shiny new boat crushed against a rock and gear'n'beer strewn across a mile of backeddies is a far more pathetic sight to behold. Finders keepers.
A number of experienced rafters commented on the narrow beam of the Superpuma series and that is correct. Those rafts are favored by local fishing guides because they are used exclusively for day trips and are light, manuverable in narrow spots and very tough. This combination of attributes allows them to keep running trips later into the season when water levels are low. The high volume whitewater stability isn't an issue so much because the fishing during peak runoff is poor; doing low water trips during better fishing conditions is more important. That's somethin to consider, bro. Is this purchase oriented to multiday trips on high volume rivers or is this craft dedicated to access for fishing? If it's for fishing skinny rivers and extending the float season, then the superpumas have a design advantage. But, yeah, you could find a much more stable raft to run the Kern river or one more spacious and gear hauling for that week long bassin' trip down the John Day.Last edited by neckdeep; 03-22-2012 at 10:01 AM.
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03-22-2012, 09:36 AM #28"When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
"I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
"THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -ski on in eternal peace
"I have posted in here but haven't read it carefully with my trusty PoliAsshat antenna on."-DipshitDanno
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03-22-2012, 09:39 AM #29
This is true. Which is, of course, why the watermaster is designed to be controlled with fins and works very well hands free, even in relatively swift moving water, provided you have enough depth to vigorously kick. Which is why I do not recommend the watermaster for whitewater that is continuosly swift and shallow. Watermasters work so well hands free that floating water too shallow to use fins sort of defeats the whole purpose of owning one.
Last edited by neckdeep; 03-22-2012 at 10:12 AM.
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03-22-2012, 09:50 AM #30
Ah, I stand corrected! That may be more in the humbling and painful category, but I take your point. I try to think "If I'm not careful, or I'm drunk or just flat unlucky, that could be me" when I see shit like that. Although 95% of the time those guys are dumbasses, that ain't always the case.
Lots of drift boat and raft love in this thread. Of course the answer is to get both, and while you're at it win the lottery so you can afford traveling all over using them. I'm thinking we need to plan a flotilla camping trip - the Green, Colorado, North Platte?? I will drive anywhere for fishing.
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03-22-2012, 09:51 AM #31
the a section of the green is full of dipshits in their one man wreckin machines trying to kick and fish and doin a piss poor job of both
"When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
"I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
"THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -ski on in eternal peace
"I have posted in here but haven't read it carefully with my trusty PoliAsshat antenna on."-DipshitDanno
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03-22-2012, 10:24 AM #32
Yeah, trying to fin a one man cat is pretty much hopeless. Even with the watermaster's excellent tracking, you definitely must have the leg strength and endurance proportionate to the speed of the water because sometimes you must kick very, very hard to pull it off. But if you can ski fast all day then you have what it takes. Most people are piss poor at skiing simply because they lack leg strength and endurance. And like skiing, you will discover a few muscles you didn't know you had. Its certainly not instinctive, as I believe Schwerty can confirm in adjusting to his new purchase. You have to learn to use your feet independently, sometimes even counter rotating your feet just like waterfowl. Think like a duck and you'll be fine, I guess.
Last edited by neckdeep; 03-22-2012 at 10:44 AM.
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03-22-2012, 11:11 AM #33the a section of the green is full of dipshitsWell maybe I'm the faggot America
I'm not a part of a redneck agenda
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03-22-2012, 11:41 AM #34
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03-22-2012, 11:49 AM #35
I certainly agree with ND that handling a Watermaster is not instinctive. Still a sweet craft .
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03-22-2012, 03:33 PM #36
Things that scare the shit out of me:
-Foot entrampent
-Trying to wade with fins on
that being said, finning a boat in big class I water seems reasonable, the hardest thing about fishing while rowing is keeping good position, ie not spinning circles while fishing. Fins and oars used together could achieve fishability.Its not that I suck at spelling, its that I just don't care
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03-22-2012, 03:58 PM #37
or just fuck things up for those who who enjoy rowing people into fish or have friends or old ladies that can row. So if you can't fish and kick or row in the main river channel well you can just run your one man right down the shore and through the fish while your bro does the same on the other bank
tons of great sticks out there really good oarsmen not so much and I sure aint really good more like decent. and the hog is far from the most manuverable boat out there but I really dig rowing especially for dudes who can cast"When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
"I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
"THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -ski on in eternal peace
"I have posted in here but haven't read it carefully with my trusty PoliAsshat antenna on."-DipshitDanno
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03-22-2012, 04:47 PM #38
I think I am approaching decent on the oars as well. That means I can get it done but it ain't always pretty! Haven't sank anything yet. One learning moment was when I somehow got sucked hard left on the A section until my front man was looking at kissing Little Steamboat rock head on! Pucker factor was on 11. Pretty stupid considering how easy that rapid is really. It's true that you can stop those golf-ball hulls even in fast water and back away - just don't give up! My buddy calmly turned around to me while I'm pulling on the oars like a crazy man and said "you see that rock, right?" Hah! Adrenaline baby...
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03-22-2012, 04:56 PM #39
Although I gotta say when it comes to the fishing part of rowing I'm not half bad... The oarsman is doing a large part of the fishing and I know what I would want up front.
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03-22-2012, 06:11 PM #40
I sank and 18 foot lowe once... Funny story, the welds on 20 year old guide boats suck ass, I barely hit that rock.
Its not that I suck at spelling, its that I just don't care
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11-21-2013, 03:19 PM #41
Reviving this thread for some help and didn't want to start another thread. I posted in the inflatable drift boat thread a couple months ago with some questions and it looks like my friend and I finally got the wives on board to purchase a fishing raft. As far as it being a bad idea to share a boat, have known eachother since first grade, moved to CO together, and pretty much share every hobby, so too late. He owns half of the gear and I own the other half for hunting, etc. Budget is obviously the first thing on the list. $6,000 MAX for raft, frame, trailer, oars, cooler, dry boxes, pfds, ropes, rod holders....pretty much everything all in.
New, used or combo? Was thinking new frame, used raft?
Can you buy thing piecemeal or is that a risk for not being able to fit everything together? I was thinking of watching craiglist for a trailer, dry box, cooler, oars, pfds, etc. Over the next 4 months, and then purchase the raft and frame at the same time...assuming raft before frame?
14' or 13'? Primary use will be day trips with 2 or 3 people fishing, or booze cruises with 2 couples, 2 person multi-day trips, and maybe 2 couple 2 day, 1 night trips. Colorado, Blue, Gunnison, Yampa, N. Platte, Green, Roaring Fork, yada yada.
I am thinking 14' with a setup similar to the Down River Colorado Double Rail with a rear seat with anchor. Cooler under rower, big dry box up front with a bench that the two girls can sit on together if we are all on the boat. Frame company suggestions? I am in Denver. I was thinking no on the stripping basket and casting platforms. Is this what you guys with rafts have? I fished out of Lexi-bells raft, and didn't any if I remember right. Does that change the raft models I should be looking at as far as floor stiffness?
How wide of a raft?
Specific model suggestions? Can I go with a cheaper raft like a Vanguard or Down River Adventure in the new market, or should I look for an Otter, Super Puma, 143D, etc. on the used market?
This is gonna be fun and I have already started mentally building boats and looking at stuff on Craigslist. Thinking if we buy a trailer, dry boxes, etc. now, the wives can't back out! Thank you for the help.Last edited by gretch6364; 11-21-2013 at 03:44 PM.
"We had nice 3 days in your autonomous mountain realm last weekend." - Tom from Austria (the Rax ski guy)
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11-22-2013, 10:17 AM #42
Will I be able to find a used Aire 143D or NRS Otter 140 for $3K or less? Obviously, the Otter is much more likely, but would consider and older 143D compared to the Otter.
"We had nice 3 days in your autonomous mountain realm last weekend." - Tom from Austria (the Rax ski guy)
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11-22-2013, 10:55 AM #43
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11-22-2013, 11:11 AM #44
If you are willing to look around and drive i would say absolutely. Colorado, Wyoming, Montana and Idaho would be the areas I would look.
Samuel L. Jackson as Jules Winnfield: Oh, I'm sorry. Did I break your concentration?
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11-22-2013, 11:18 AM #45"When the child was a child it waited patiently for the first snow and it still does"- Van "The Man" Morrison
"I find I have already had my reward, in the doing of the thing" - Buzz Holmstrom
"THIS IS WHAT WE DO"-AML -ski on in eternal peace
"I have posted in here but haven't read it carefully with my trusty PoliAsshat antenna on."-DipshitDanno
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11-22-2013, 11:25 AM #46
Thanks. Been reading alot of Mountainbuzz and trying to decide if I look for a used American made boat, or buy a new cheaper boat like Vanguard, RMR, or a Tributary. Wondering how much tube size really effects things on a fishing raft as the Tributary has larger tubes. Heard RMR is doing drop stitched floors for 2014, but I don't know anything about floors really.
What about this for the raft?
http://www.aaainflatables.com/14-Sel...-rmr-sb140.htm
Seem like a good deal.Last edited by gretch6364; 11-22-2013 at 01:49 PM.
"We had nice 3 days in your autonomous mountain realm last weekend." - Tom from Austria (the Rax ski guy)
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11-25-2013, 01:03 PM #47
I can't comment specifically on that RMR raft. In general, I'd say that quality is a high priority -- I like to keep my odds of puncture/blowout as low as possible. But I don't know anything about how RMR stacks up.
On that, though, it seems like Aire pretty much owns the category. Most of my raft-having friends have Super Pumas, and I can say that those things are exceptionally bomber. The material seems like it could withstand a serious encounter with jagged rocks. Also stealth and agile for negotiating rock gardens etc. But they have a lot less space "inside" than my 13.5' (?) NRS Otter. Super Pumas are pretty much three tapered torpedo tubes side by side, with the middle one dropped down a bit -- there's not a ton of "inside" space. But it seems to work fine, even for overnights (two dudes per raft, gear in back). I'm happy with the Otter, though, in terms of performance, space for camping crap, and durability. It's just more of a tank than the Aires.
I think you can go a bit more bare-bones on the frame than what you're talking about, if you want to save a few bucks. I have a basic NRS frame with rowing seat in middle, fishing person seats front and back (both are "up" -- bow is on a bent bar, stern is up on the stern of the rubber), and a leaning bar in front. I've been thinking maybe to pick up a deck for the front, and also a stripping basket or other improvements to keep the line non-snagged. When in front I probably stand about half the time, and it's OK on the raft floor. In the back, I sit pretty much always. The seat is high and swivels and is a pretty good spot. Oarsman definitely needs a proper seat. And a foot brace. You can always start simple and add stuff.
I put the cooler under the guy in front (the seat is raised up above the level of the tubes and the rest of the frame, such that the cooler can be opened easily, etc. If the cooler is under the oarsman then refreshing your beer is a more complicated procedure than it ought to be. I'm a fan of coolers with molded cup holders in the lid -- then the dude in front has a bomber beer spot.
I co-own with a buddy and it works great. In part because he has a garage and I don't. Scheduling is rarely an issue, but then again he doesn't use it a ton and ideally we get out together when possible anyway. Picked it up (raft, frame, oars, crappy pfds, enormous cooler that I've never used, etc) for 3300. Buddy had a trailer that we did a little work on. And we were good.
You want counter-balanced oars. I just have the cheap two-piece jobs with counter balance weights. They're fine, but fancy oars are nicer. And you want a spare oar hanging off the side of the raft.
Figure on some mesh gear/beer holders and stuff in the raft. I have a big one under/behind the oarsman and then a couple littler ones scattered around. They're not that much cash.
Need a big net w/ long handle.
Need a pump or two. You get what you pay for. I have a 12v electric with rechargeable motorcycle batt, and a decent hand pump (made by AAA inflatables out of pvc pipe etc).
Don't need a dry box. Those things are spendy. Just some dry bags will do. I did eventually pick up a smallish cheapish box from AAA in denver, the NRS Canyon Box (larger version of the two) for camping stuff.
You can definitely pull raft out of water and onto trailer with two dudes. Better with three. Our trailer is kind of tall (it's a low box trailer with carpet-covered boards on top) and it's still fine. A winch would be deluxe, and then you could do it solo. Be very sure that the raft will never droop down onto the wheels of the trailer. Some friends drove too far with a saggy raft on a fender-less trailer this summer and had to do some serious patch work when they arrived at the put-in.
Get a pfd with a high back so that it works with the seat backs. Mine is not like that, and it's annoying, and as a result I often end up taking it off. That, or maybe one of the slick-seeming self-inflating ones. But I'm not sure whether that's as likely to keep me alive when in need. Anybody got experience with them?
Anyway, having a raft is awesome, and you can surely get by with a lot of different variations. Long time between now and spring floating season… I'd be looking for used for sure. Drift boats are definitely more pleasant when they're the right boat, but they aren't always the right boat for the river...
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11-25-2013, 01:57 PM #48
Thanks Ignatius. I am certainly of the opinion of start simpler and then add as needed/wanted/have the money. Especially casting decks and dry boxes. I also think I could get away with not having a trailer for a summer, but it would be nice. We will see. My partner seems to be waivering a little on pulling the trigger on the RMR, and he seems to want to wait till Feb to see how his job goes.
When will I see most of the used rafts hitting the market? I think we are going to hold off on the RMR raft and watch over the next couple month to see if we can find something used, either cheaper, or a better raft. I think the Puma series is going to be too narrow for us. Hoping for something 6'6" to 7" wide, 14' long SB for $2K or less. If any mags come across something, please keep me in mind. I would prefer just a raft and want to have the frame built new how I want it laid out, but would be open to full outfits for the right price.Last edited by gretch6364; 11-25-2013 at 02:30 PM.
"We had nice 3 days in your autonomous mountain realm last weekend." - Tom from Austria (the Rax ski guy)
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11-26-2013, 09:42 AM #49
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11-26-2013, 09:54 AM #50"We had nice 3 days in your autonomous mountain realm last weekend." - Tom from Austria (the Rax ski guy)
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