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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by DropCliffsNotBombs View Post

    P.S.-Last year my buddy was buried for over 45 minutes... calmly waiting and breathing through his Avalung until he was found and dug out. It saved his life.
    Thank you for sharing this!
    www.freeridesystems.com
    ski & ride jackets made in colorado
    maggot discount code TGR20
    ok we'll come up with a solution by then makers....

  2. #27
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    You are incorrect. According to AAA 25% of avalanche victims die from trauma while 75% die from asphyxiation. This is taught in all avalanches classes and companion rescue clinics.

    Quote Originally Posted by systemoverblow'd View Post
    Well if you do survive the trauma (most avalanche fatalities) I would feel lucky to have either option. I would prefer not to be buried, but if I was I would prefer to have an avalung than not.

    So no it isn't a joke. Frankly for not understanding this simple fact you are the joke OP.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    The best solution is to get both and duct tape and ziptie the Avalung to your airbag pack.
    I found my old Avalung sling the other day and am planning on doing this to float30 bag.

    Sounds like you've tried this. Any particular recommendations?
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by ski_faster View Post
    You are incorrect. According to AAA 25% of avalanche victims die from trauma while 75% die from asphyxiation. This is taught in all avalanches classes and companion rescue clinics.
    You obviously responded without reading the rest of the thread. Kudos to you!

  5. #30
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    Yes I read it, but as Dropcliffsnotbombs said you are not going to be able to move due to being trapped in the snow. Even if you didn't have a broken back.

    Quote Originally Posted by systemoverblow'd View Post
    You obviously responded without reading the rest of the thread. Kudos to you!

  6. #31
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    If your back wasn't broke maybe you could swim to the top if the slide.

    We all understand that most people who die in avy's die of suffocation. We already know that. But if you're knocked out or injured of course you are going to get buried. My point is, most people get trauma during avalanches that could prohibit them from saving their own life.

    And if you look at my first post in this thread I said I would wish I had both options available to me in the event of a slide. But if you're unconscious from hitting a rock a fat lot of good either option is going to be for you.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    I found my old Avalung sling the other day and am planning on doing this to float30 bag.

    Sounds like you've tried this. Any particular recommendations?
    I recall seeing a video of this but could not find it after searching. In short, attach mouthpiece to lower shoulder trap and route under your arm/armpit. Make sure exhaust is on the back of pack as far away from mouthpiece as possible.

  8. #33
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    systemoverblow'd = icelanticskier ?
    off your knees Louie

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFD View Post
    systemoverblow'd = icelanticskier ?
    I don't think so.

    But he's doing an equally good job of cunting up this avy thread as Rog normally does.
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    I found my old Avalung sling the other day and am planning on doing this to float30 bag.

    Sounds like you've tried this. Any particular recommendations?
    This guy did it:
    http://www.skiingthebackcountry.com/...alung_Backpack

    (old story, probably been up here before)
    Cold water stoke

  11. #36
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    On the subject of the cause of death in avalanches:

    There are more than one set of statistics to go off of but I've never heard a figure higher than the mid 30s for percentage. A quarter is the stat I usually quote.

    The argument of "what if disabling injuries contributed to asphyxiation " is somewhat specious in THIS context. I would say that it contributes, but no more so than making the argument that reducing chances of asphyxiation might increase the trauma deaths because some people die of asphyxiation before they have a chance to die of their traumatic injuries! I think the latter situation is much more likely!

    That said, we can make arguments that both safety devices help in both departments.

    A person with an Avalung in will have a protected airway and thus has a better chance of escaping the avalanche or at least avoiding some trauma or deeper burials. People tend to panic when they cannot breath through mouthfulls of snow. Obviously, the Avalung protects most against suffocation.

    Similarly, airbags aim to reduce asphyxiation by preventing burials. However, they may also reduce trauma by providing a bumper from certain impacts and keep a person on the surface of the slide where they are less likely to be ground against rocks/logs on the bed surface. On the other hand, and I'm not aware of any evidence for or against this conjecture: certain people argue that an airbag can lead to higher victim speeds and longer carry distances resulting in a higher chance with higher consequences of encountering trees and boulders.

    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    I found my old Avalung sling the other day and am planning on doing this to float30 bag.

    Sounds like you've tried this. Any particular recommendations?
    Nothing special, just common sense. Trim the straps if you aren't going to sling it again. Don't wrap where it interferes with fit and adjustment.
    Last edited by Summit; 01-30-2012 at 04:22 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by spencea View Post
    Use scuba mixes for shallow water, still breathable, but less flammable.
    I am pretty sure shallow dive mix is just compressed air. Don't the abs bag filling places use compressed air also?. That gives a 21% oxygen blend with 78% nitrogen

  13. #38
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    He meant a EAN so a common mix might be 36% O2... not a lot of gain.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by DropCliffsNotBombs View Post
    P.S.-Last year my buddy was buried for over 45 minutes... calmly waiting and breathing through his Avalung until he was found and dug out. It saved his life.
    thanks for sharing. your bud was pretty lucky, how affected (if at all) by hypothermia? not much snow in his clothing?

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    I found my old Avalung sling the other day and am planning on doing this to float30 bag.

    Sounds like you've tried this. Any particular recommendations?
    Cut off all the straps and leave ~4" of material above the mouth piece.

    Locate ideal position for avalung on top of pack strap. Put yer pack on and hold it in place so you get the mouth piece in the right spot.

    I like to use a speedy stitcher to sew the top piece of material (by mouth piece) to the pack strap.

    I don't like zip ties but use tape to secure avalung to pack strap in 1-2 additional places.

    There is a bit of webbing on the tail of the avalung that you can thread some p-cord through and attach loosely to the straps that secure your waist belt. Keeps tail of avalung from flopping around.

    Center punch big lines while chanting avalung and airbag will keep me safe while i crush it.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by covert View Post
    Cut off all the straps and leave ~4" of material above the mouth piece.

    Locate ideal position for avalung on top of pack strap. Put yer pack on and hold it in place so you get the mouth piece in the right spot.

    I like to use a speedy stitcher to sew the top piece of material (by mouth piece) to the pack strap.

    I don't like zip ties but use tape to secure avalung to pack strap in 1-2 additional places.

    There is a bit of webbing on the tail of the avalung that you can thread some p-cord through and attach loosely to the straps that secure your waist belt. Keeps tail of avalung from flopping around.

    Center punch big lines while chanting avalung and airbag will keep me safe while i crush it.
    Gracias.

    I Saw a bunch of your guys had them rigged up on Dakine packs last time I was there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    Gracias.

    I Saw a bunch of your guys had them rigged up on Dakine packs last time I was there.
    We used to get them for free until BD decided they wanted to spend their money on pro skiers instead of skiing professionals.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long Duck Dong View Post
    Also, use of both products is not mutually exclusive if you have a non pack integrated Avalung unit. Considering how cheap and available Avalungs are, I don't see the harm in using one regardless of one's opinions on the efficacy of airbag packs.
    EXACTLY !! I've always been sitting on the fence when it comes to Avalung use, but the massive back to back snow dumps of this year has decided it for me. I'm getting one on order post haste. There are many other snow immersions which it might by a little more time besides avalanches. Treewells, like someone here mentioned. I've been in tree-wells but never been inverted in one where there was a suffocation danger.....but who's to say that next time, I WON'T be inverted and stuck down there like some sort of cheap party trick. I want one. Icefields....I travel them occasionaly....always with trepidation and wariness, but always butt-puckered about going through and ending up in a crevasse. More snow means the signs of potential crevasses are more hidden. I want a avalung for that reason too. ANYTHING that can give you just a bit more time. (usually, though with a crevasse, the danger is not so much suffocation, but that you're fucking jammed in down there in BLUE ice, it's going to get very cold and you are going to DIE....I think a 44 would be more useful in that case....crevasses have ALWAYS been my absoulute worst, most vile nightmare!!!...and is why I no longer do solo icefield traverses...only with at least a party of 3 now!).

    That they're not seen to be statistically effective might reflect more upon testing procedures and sample populations than anything concrete.

    They're fairly small, and don't add incredible weight, so I'll take a gamble on them.

    In theory, they should work fairly well...I guess I'll have to wait until it ships to find out the practicality aspect.

    Anybody here ever have NEEDED to use one, had one on hand and then USED it?? Tell your story.

    --
    "The reason death sticks so closely to life isn't biological necessity - it's envy. Life is so beautiful that death has fallen in love with it; a jealous, possesive love that grabs at what it can." by Yann Martel from Life of Pi



    Posted by DJSapp:
    "Squirrels are rats with good PR."

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    Proper use of an Avalung is key to making the reliability near 100%. Skiing without the mouthpiece in is like driving your car with the seatbelt unbuckled. You don't wait until you see the oncoming semi to buckle up. Have it in and breath around it.
    Do any of you actually ski with it in? I might put it in, if I cut the top or the entrance is really sketch, but I never ski the actual run with it in my mouth.

  20. #45
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    Has the Avalung become a joke?
    Only when mentioned as being possibly useful in a crevasse?
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    Only when mentioned as being possibly useful in a crevasse?
    Didn't I just get done saying that the suffocation aspect of a crevasse is not that great??? I coulda sworn I did....that thing in parentheses () ??? Please READ fully before commenting. But there are other immersion and suffocation aspects in icefields and snowfields besides falling into deep crevasses. There are various undulations and holes that one can get pitched into..and end up inverted like a cork, especially when wearing a heavy pack. You ever slip off a stomp-trail when wearing a large pack and pitch head first into a lower pack of deep and light snow from a dump?? I have...NOT fun. Can't move. Luckily people right behind me....but what if they were on the next ridge? That avalung might bide some extra minutes until someone either notices you're missing or sees your legs sticking out.

    Do you perhaps write political ads, PNWBrit? The people that do are REALLY good at taking a sentence or even just a word in this case, and then taking it so fundementally OUT OF CONTEXT that the original intent was fully obfuscated by the spinner's own rendition. You'd be really good at that....there is still time left before November.

    --

    EDIT: Doesn't matter. Right NOW what I'm trying to figure out is WHY, with these simple sneakers I'd just bought, do they give you fricking laces as long as tree-climber's boots????? Answer me that.
    Last edited by Alaskan Rover; 02-01-2012 at 12:24 PM.
    "The reason death sticks so closely to life isn't biological necessity - it's envy. Life is so beautiful that death has fallen in love with it; a jealous, possesive love that grabs at what it can." by Yann Martel from Life of Pi



    Posted by DJSapp:
    "Squirrels are rats with good PR."

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskan Rover View Post
    Didn't I just get done saying that the suffocation aspect of a crevasse is not that great??? I coulda sworn I did...

    --
    More snow means the signs of potential crevasses are more hidden. I want a avalung for that reason too
    You could use an airbag in the crevasse too maybe? To wedge yourself in?

    Edit: or fill it with helium and just float out. We'll probably need Rog to give a second opinion though..
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    You could use an airbag in the crevasse too maybe? To wedge yourself in?

    Edit: or fill it with helium and just float out. We'll probably need Rog to give a second opinion though..
    I was thinking it would be better to fill the airbag with nitrous oxide, so that at least one could spend their last few moments wedged in against the cold blue ice wals in some state of euphoria. make that last whippit a great one!!

    What about those damn shoelaces, though? What's up with that?

    --
    "The reason death sticks so closely to life isn't biological necessity - it's envy. Life is so beautiful that death has fallen in love with it; a jealous, possesive love that grabs at what it can." by Yann Martel from Life of Pi



    Posted by DJSapp:
    "Squirrels are rats with good PR."

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by covert View Post
    Center punch big lines while chanting avalung and airbag will keep me safe while i crush it.
    I laughed.
    "Buy the Fucking Plane Tickets!"
    -- Jack Tackle

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shredhead View Post
    Do any of you actually ski with it in? I might put it in, if I cut the top or the entrance is really sketch, but I never ski the actual run with it in my mouth.
    I'm curious about this as well. For me, I'll usually leave the mouthpiece positioned near my mouth, but I haven't once skied a run with the mouthpiece in. And never having been in a slide, I'm not sure how difficult it would be to actually chomp down on the mouthpiece while going for a ride.

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