Thread: Is it still terrorism, if the US is the one doing the killing?

http://news.yahoo.com/bomb-kills-ira...122304552.html

"Instead of actually fighting a conventional war, Western powers and their allies appear to be relying on covert war tactics to try to delay and degrade Iran's nuclear advancement," said Theodore Karasik, a security expert at the Dubai-based Institute for Near East and Gulf Military Analysis.

How is this not an act of war?

Again, I say, a vote for Obama or Romney (Obamney) is a vote for war. This time with Iran.

Originally Posted by Pillsbury

http://news.yahoo.com/bomb-kills-ira...122304552.html



How is this not an act of war?

Again, I say, a vote for Obama or Romney (Obamney) is a vote for war. This time with Iran.

Yes, this shit's been going on for years and years...USA world cop...

Originally Posted by Pillsbury

a vote for Obama or Romney (Obamney) is a vote for war. This time with Iran.

I think that's what most people want.

Originally Posted by Tuckerman

I think that's what most people want.

Really? Most people want another war? Could have fooled me.

Originally Posted by Chugachjed

Really? Most people want another war? Could have fooled me.

They want the result without the payment, its just like the stan...How can we get the most out of that shithole while doing the least ?

Originally Posted by Tuckerman

I think that's what most people want.

Support for the Iraq war was at an all time low in 2008. A small percentage of people supported the effort. Now the country is evenly split 50:50 about whether Iraq was a good idea. If 50% of the country thinks war with Iraq was not half bad then... I don't know. Even in this forum, some of the people beating the drum the loudest for war with Muslims are now the biggest non-interventionists so it doesn't take much to flip public opinion.

Ever see Bourne Supremacy?

I don't think the US did the bombing

I think Israel did it.

And given what Iran has done to Israel ans said about Israel I would say its fair game.

If every covert action taken by any country against another country constitutes an act of war, then we're pretty much in a perpetual world war. It seems the whole point of covert actions is to avoid war - targeted covert actions seek to accomplish a goal without widespread military intervention. Now whether you agree or disagree with the goal of those actions is another question entirely, but I don't think they constitute war, or are even a provocation of war.

Agreed, however, that many people do ultimately want to see a war with Iran, and given the political landscape, it seems increasingly inevitable that they will get their wish.

Also, not sure what this has to do with terrorism. Targeted covert actions are pretty much the exact opposite of terrorism despite what Tehran may say to the contrary.

Originally Posted by toast2266

If every covert action taken by any country against another country constitutes an act of war, then we're pretty much in a perpetual world war. It seems the whole point of covert actions is to avoid war - targeted covert actions seek to accomplish a goal without widespread military intervention. Now whether you agree or disagree with the goal of those actions is another question entirely, but I don't think they constitute war, or are even a provocation of war.

Agreed, however, that many people do ultimately want to see a war with Iran, and given the political landscape, it seems increasingly inevitable that they will get their wish.

Also, not sure what this has to do with terrorism. Targeted covert actions are pretty much the exact opposite of terrorism despite what Tehran may say to the contrary.

Sad but true. The Guberment and the media really seem to want to whip everybody up for a War with Iran, and as Ron Paul says, they have never attacked us.

I gotta say the guberment (Mulla's)? seem kinda fucked up, but Iranians as a people are really pretty cool. They are (More like Us) than any other people from that region that I have meet.

Originally Posted by MTT

and as Ron Paul says, they have never attacked us.

I gotta say the guberment (Mulla's)? seem kinda fucked up, but Iranians as a people are really pretty cool. They are (More like Us) than any other people from that region that I have meet.

Ummmmmm, US embassy in '79, old history, but still...

Your second statement is correct. There is not an issue with Islam, but with theocracy, and it's leaders. People are people, and most of them are pretty cool, Iran is no exception.

F Iran and another war. I'm on the RP bandwagon on this issue if ya hadn't noticed. This propaganda piece has some interesting points.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJZzephC82k

Originally Posted by hutash

Ummmmmm, US embassy in '79, old history, but still...

Your second statement is correct. There is not an issue with Islam, but with theocracy, and it's leaders. People are people, and most of them are pretty cool, Iran is no exception.

No I was singling out Iran, of course most of the Iranians I have meet, fled Iran to escape thier Guberment, But in General Iranians are more progressive (Less backwards ass fucked up) then the general population in that part of the world.

Originally Posted by toast2266

If every covert action taken by any country against another country constitutes an act of war, then we're pretty much in a perpetual world war.

There were several people calling the foiled and (somewhat bogus) Saudi embassy bomb plot of Manssor Arbabsiar an act of war.

Also, not sure what this has to do with terrorism. Targeted covert actions are pretty much the exact opposite of terrorism despite what Tehran may say to the contrary.

Depends on what side of the hair splitting you stand?

Originally Posted by Chugachjed

Really? Most people want another war? Could have fooled me.

Maybe not war, but force into submission. A majority of people voted for Obama. Obama could pull troops out of all foreign theaters when ever yet fails to do so.

Originally Posted by Tuckerman

Maybe not war, but force into submission. A majority of people voted for Obama. Obama could pull troops out of all foreign theaters when ever yet fails to do so.

So could every president since......

It hardly makes it something uniquely despotic or war mongering to pin on him.

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

There were several people calling the foiled and (somewhat bogus) Saudi embassy bomb plot of Manssor Arbabsiar an act of war.

maybe I'm splitting hairs again, but I differentiate between an actual act of war from an act that ultimately could be used as a justification for war. Potential justifications for war happen every day, but very few of them are (imo) acts of war. I think an act of war has to come from the top down, which doesn't appear to have been the case in your example. Pearl harbor is a good example of an act of war.

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

Depends on what side of the hair splitting you stand?

Terrorism is an act where the primary purpose is to terrorize the general populace. The primary goal of assassinating some nuclear physicist does not appear to be widespread terror.

Strictly speaking, "terrorism" is the use of violence to acheive a political end. So clipping a few Iranian scientists to prevent Iran's nuclear bomb-making would not be terrorism, since the goal is not political, but rather military.

If you're going to cite to the 1979 Iranian take-over of the American Embassy, you also need to go further back to when the US and British governments deposed Iran's first democratically elected president Dr. Mohammed Mossadegh. There is a much stronger case that that coup was terrorism.

http://www.mohammadmossadegh.com/

Globally speaking, anybody making more then ~$20,000 a year is in the top 1%. A lot of our wealth is predicated on violence. For example, just look at the "conflict minerals" we use to construct our nifty electronic gadgets. When cellphones exploded in the mid-90s, Central Africa ( a source for many of these so-called rare earths) had the international mining conglomerates come a-knocking and it's been nothing but rape and pillage ever since.

^^^why do you hate America?

Generally I don't take Bill O'Reilly questions, but what the heck!

I love America! Fuck yeah!

But I'm not afraid to own the blood on my hands. We're an empire, pure and simple.

Originally Posted by BrianH

Strictly speaking, "terrorism" is the use of violence to acheive a political end. So clipping a few Iranian scientists to prevent Iran's nuclear bomb-making would not be terrorism, since the goal is not political

Of course it's political.

Originally Posted by toast2266

Terrorism is an act where the primary purpose is to terrorize the general populace.

No, no it's not.

You need to define your terms.

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

No, no it's not.

Then what's your definition?

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

No, no it's not.

To my knowledge it is.

"the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion" Seems about right.

For instance it would be terrorism to bomb Planned Parenthood offices or mosques, .... neither act would necessarily

terrorize the general populace.

Equally it would be possible to

terrorize the general populace.

without it being terrorism.... the Beltway Sniper, Jack the Ripper......