The neoshell thread

[verbier61]

Some >30 winter days on my Rab, so far durability is OK. I've compared it for two days with a cotton klattermusen jacket. Breathability was pretty similar.

[Meathelmet]

Some >30 winter days on my Rab, so far durability is OK. I've compared it for two days with a cotton klattermusen jacket. Breathability was pretty similar.

Are you shitting us? I mean that would be quite a wowser!
And how about the water proofness? Is it like, water resistant or really waterproof? Like, skiing a full day in sleet/wet snowfall,still dry?

Interesting stuff.

[verbier61]

pep, I've skied several snowy days with the rab and it was waterproof... which of course is not the case with the cotton klattermusen.

So far I can say
1. it's waterproof
2. breathes better of any gore I've tried, and quite similar to cotton
3. durability has been ok for the winter

but -again - this is only after some 35 or so days, not long term :-\

[Southeast Maggot]

Thoughts on the Westcomb Switch LT Hoody, after time in a bunch of different conditions:

1. Most breathable shell jacket I've ever owned. Better than goretex, better than any proprietary fabric, etc etc. Unless its completely calm and sunny, I'm usually wearing it on the skintrack and its breathing well.

2. As waterproof as any Gore fabric, and I'm in the PNW. Truly waterproof, not softshell waterproof. No complaints in driving wet snow.

2. I have major concerns about the durability of this particular jacket. On my 5th day out, this happened while skinning:



This wasn't hitting a branch while skiing, this was just moving through low branches on the skinner.

Now I'm extremely careful while skinning, and even then the fabric has developed "bubbles" in spots where it's hit branches:



It appears to be cosmetic, but I've never had a fabric do this before.

And somehow I've gotten two discolored spots on the back of the jacket- these aren't wet stains, its almost like an oil stain, even though I've been really careful not to throw the jacket around in the car or house:



Finally, where my pack rubs my shoulder blade, this has happened:



This is all after 20 days or less in the shell.

Honestly, I've been pretty disappointed in the durability jacket, particularly for something that retails for $400+ I think Westcomb makes great products, has a great fit, and is a good company to support- I just can't recommend this particular product. Someone mentioned in another thread that the Neoshell durability varied greatly between manufacturers- maybe this is just the case for this specific jacket.

[XXX-er]

anybody ever try using NO base layer under their soft shell ?

At a recent all night rando event since I was going to be real close to a warm base lodge with extra gear I decided to try no jersey under a Patagonia Ascentionist soft shell since the merino wool base layers were getting wet anyhow

I found NO jersey in a soft shell more comfortable than wearing a wet jersey under a soft shell

[Ted Striker]

Thoughts on the Westcomb Switch LT Hoody...

Wow, that's disappointing - especially for one of the spendier brands. You going to make a warranty claim?


In other Neoshell news, apparently North Face will have one out next year that competes with the Westcomb and Rab shells.

[Southeast Maggot]

Wow, that's disappointing - especially for one of the spendier brands. You going to make a warranty claim?


In other Neoshell news, apparently North Face will have one out next year that competes with the Westcomb and Rab shells.

Ive gotten in touch with their customer service department- haven't heard back yet. I'm really curious to fondle some of the other Neoshell jackets on the market to see how the fabric feels vs. the Westcomb.

[Ted Striker]

The Rab feels just as thin/fragile. Maybe a little stretchier too. Don't know if that means anything though. FWIW Westcomb had some delam issues with some of their first eVent jackets, and AFAIK stood by their warranty and replaced them.

[butterscotch]

The switch LT is an ultra-light jacket, according to WildSnow., so you might not want to base your whole opinion of neoshell on that jacket.

FYI, the Westcomb Switch LT Hoody, made from a flyweight ripstop nylon version of Polartec NeoShell fabric, is the lightest, most minimalist adaptation. For comparison’s sake, the Apoc weighs 16.8 oz and the Switch LT Hoody weighs 15.5 oz.

the rest: http://www.wildsnow.com/5864/polarte...hell-clothing/

[GIJoePSA]

SE Maggot, I'm wondering if that was something specific to the run your jacket was in. After seeing your pics, I looked carefully on my apoc and didn't notice anything. I'm wondering if it has something with the outside material being a little bit more similar in texture to a soft-shell than a hardshell

[vanisle]

Same jacket as SE maggot with 30+ days and i havent seen and durability problems so far except for some wear on the inside of my hood where it rubs against my helmet goggle clip.That being said i cant see it holding up as long as a heavier event or gore shell but time will tell.

Truly has been as waterproof as i need here on the wet coast and breathes like no other.Was a little worried about how it would cut wind but its been storming lately and is as good or better than my last pro-shell jacket .

[llyon]

Im coming up on 100 days on my Rab Neo. Still amazed by the breathability, and very satisfied with the waterproofness.
Durability has been about what I expected - not great, not terrible. The jacket is showing wear on high abrasion spots (waist strap, shoulders, lower back where a pack rests), similar to what's in SE Maggot's last photo.
I also have damage around the wrist, like SE Maggot's first photo.
I really can only compare durability to jackets I've worn in the past: the Rab Neo is more durable than my Stoic Event Stash and Flylow Lab, but less durable than my Arcteryx Sidewinder SV.

[bodywhomper]

bump.

any more details about durability?

i have a warranty claim of a gtx jacket with marmot. i am deciding on the spire (1lbs9oz, 3L GTX, 4.9 oz/yd outer fabric), speed light (12oz, GTX pro, 3.1 oz/yd outer fabric), and the zion (1lbs8oz, neoshell [M1]l). The M1 is claimed as water repellent, so that might kill the deal for me, but neoshell is claimed as waterproof. this will be an all around wet weather shell for me from skiing when it's soggy to working outside in the rain (e.g. field work and working around the house) to bike rides to knocking around town. i'd also use it as a shell for multiday ski, climbing, and hiking trips.

i wouldn't be especially ginger in use of the jacket. i had multiple patches on my other jacket before the seam tape gave out and i got some delamination on a sleeve. should i be concerned about the neoshell durability? i'm not going to easily find any of those jackets to check out before deciding and input would be appreciated. tia!

i would call those bubbles that some have noted above as "delamination".

cheers

[sar13]

Still would like to see pit zips in a Neoshell Jkt. Looks like TNF might be doing that with the Jammu jkt. No matter how well a shell breaths nothing breaths as well as nothing at all (open vents). I'd also prefer a drop hood but maybe I'm the only one since they are so hard to find.

[verbier61]

After one year and about 50 days of use, my neoshell rab is ok. No evidence of delamination.

[MrSmith]

I have a Westcomb Apoc that shipped today. Guess I'll see how it holds up...

[fool]

After one year and about 50 days of use, my neoshell rab is ok. No evidence of delamination.

Good to hear. Sounds like the Rab is a pretty solid jacket.

Mr. Smith - what do you think of the Apoc so far? I'm curious how the Apoc, Rab Neo, and Mammut's Gipfelgrat stack up: anyone checkout the Mammut yet?

[Tutuko]

How is the Apoc fit? a little longer and more suited to skiing/ hiking than climbing? I tried on the Rab and was very impressed, but the fit was geared towards technical climbing/ mountaineering imo

[whyturn]

Curious about Rab stretch Neoshell
1. How is the fit? Does it compare to westcomb or even tighter?
2. Does it have a powder skirt? I think no, just want to confirm
3. Waterproof and durability comments?

Overall, thinking I might try it, but have had great previous luck with Westcomb event. If it ain't broke..........

Thanks for your info

[verbier61]

No powder skirt. It's designed like a climbing (not baggy) jacket, but cannot compare with westcomb which i never saw. Mine is ok after some 55 days of use.

[Hypnotoad]

With respect to fit, my experience with 2 Rab shells over the past year says size up.
I'm 6'2" 215 so pretty much a textbook XL. The XL Rab shells were too tight in the shoulders and arm pits (non fat places). XXL fits perfect.

[TG]

I went shopping for the rab stretch neo based on this thread. Campsaver.com has it in their outlet, and by chance I had a 20% off outlet coupon in my email. the jacket ends up being around $200-220 depending on color. http://www.campsaver.com/outlet/stre...o-jacket-men-s

use code 35KX-OUT @checkout

I've no affiliation with the store. Use the link above because when searching by brand or keyword their search engine doesn't bring it up for some reason. It's visible on the main page but then you cant use the 20%off outlet coupon. I don't even remember how I got to it in the outlet.

[Micol]

If anybody wants to test a Polartec Neoshell jacket I have one in XL in a rental program. This fabric was purchased straight out of the sample room in Lawrence, Mass. This particular neoshell garment has high loft velour polyester interior (polar fleece) as lining. The fabric is a laminate meaning the polar fleece is fused to the exterior shell material. This is not a tricot backed shell. I have that material too in Neoshell but have not sewn it into a jacket yet.

Jacket is hoodless, has 2 way front separating ykk zipper, pit zips, and high collar. You pay both ways of shipping and $25 a week.

I have a couple other variations. One in Large with hood (also high loft velour), One in a 2 layer non neoshell Polartec windbloc, and one proprietary ptfe fabric.

Pm me for details

[MrSmith]

Mr. Smith - what do you think of the Apoc so far? I'm curious how the Apoc, Rab Neo, and Mammut's Gipfelgrat stack up: anyone checkout the Mammut yet?

Sorry for the no reply; didn't have subscription turned on and this thread dropped off my radar. Anyways, I currently have both an Apoc and Gipfelgrat hanging in my closet (yes, I have a problem). I'm 6'1" 190, slightly pudgy, typically a size large.

Apoc is a nice comfortable, not too technical yet not too steezy fit, good for skiing. Really feels similar to any typical hard shell to me, only a bit of extra stretch. Weight seems decent. It's definitely not a burly fabric, so I'm a bit worried by the reports of poor durability. I'll probably limit its use a bit because of that. Other than that, it just feels good to wear. Hood is plenty big for a helmet.

Gipfelgrat is really an entirely different beast all together. Fabric is super duper burly and very stretchy, but the thing is pretty heavy. Sizing does run small -- if you check Mammut's size charts their XL chest measurement is ~42-45 inches while Patagonia, for example, is 42-45 inches in their size L. So you probably want to go a size up. I went XL and it fits pretty ok with some room for layering, but the arms are pretty long and baggy. Plenty of torso length. Definitely geared for climbing more than skiing. Climbing helmet fits fine under the hood but ski helmet is a tight fit with the zipper all the way up. Due to the burly fabric it's not as comfortable as the Apoc or something like a Gamma MX, but there's probably nothing I'd rather be wearing high up in nasty weather. It's a beast of a jacket, but really designed more for climbing. I definitely won't be throwing it in the pack on tours just in case, too heavy for that.

Unfortunately, performance wise I can't say much. I'm currently restocking goodwill with the wife and coworkers so I can get out and ski once the season really gets rolling. I should throw these things on and climb some hills in the rain, but haven't done so yet.

And stock seems to be fairly limited on both the Apoc and Gipfelgrat, so don't ponder too long.

Can't say anything about the Rab, except that Rab jackets fit me a bit tight in the armpits. Rab is known to present fit issues for some.

[dcpnz]

How does the Marmot Zion compare to these other neoshell jackets form Rab, Westcomb etc??
Was able to try it on the other day and fit well so I'm tempted.