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02-16-2012, 02:28 AM #676Registered User
- Join Date
- Oct 2009
- back to WY, for GOOD.
this is probably why I saw a heli fly through teton pass from Idaho around 4:30p today, thinking 'where is that coming from and going to?' fuck, no bueno.
condolences to all our dedicated SAR personnel, friends and family of Ray. I have the utmost for rescuers, who sacrifice so much for the rest of us.
As a side note, I hope there's a few anonymous donations coming in to help re-tool our SAR team with a new copter. It's the ride nobody wants to take, but we are blessed to have on call.mmmm, snow
02-16-2012, 06:20 AM #677
02-16-2012, 06:53 AM #678
Jan / Feb Trip
Just got back from two different trips to Jackson, one during the huge late-January storm cycle and one from the first week of February. Tons of great snow and awesome conditions at Targhee and Teton Pass. I was very impressed with the pass being it my first time there - so many good opportunities to get after it. Got to rent a few sleds for a day and took them to Togwotee which was incredible. For my first time doing backcountry with sleds it was f-in awesome. Made an edit from all of the GP footage we took...enjoy.
02-16-2012, 09:55 AM #679
++vibes++ to the SAR team and all involved with the incident last night. So so sad. Hopefully this lets us take a serious look at our willingness to fly at the drop of a hat in this valley. So many times I've wondered if the risk was worth it...
JHMR is very serious about wanting to put a lift up to the crags. They've been talking about it for quite awhile. They want to cut a swath in the trees and put the top terminal on the ridge inbetween Sheridan Bowl and the Upper Moran Faces. I'm all for the new Casper lift, but I think this would be a terrible idea on so many levels.
Save the Crags!!!!
Afterall, if there was lift access up there, it would almost never ski as well as it did yesterday. Nothing like finding the pockets that havn't been skied all week, and then getting waist deep on a 6" day.Skiing, whether you're in Wisconsin or the Alps, is a dumbass hick country sport that takes place in the middle of winter on a mountain at the end of a dirt road.
02-16-2012, 10:01 AM #680
So utterly sad for all those involved in the SAR incident. Tragic, and tough for everyone in the community.
There will be an air medical rescue helicopter in Riverton, WY starting soon. Another possible resource for the valley and surrounding areas when necessary."Ah, beer, my one weakness. My Achille's heel, if you will." -Homer Simpson
02-16-2012, 10:09 AM #681
Vibes to the SAR guys, tough day for sure.
Shifting gears, I keep hearing the argument against putting a lift up the crags. I dont get it. That place isnt an untouched powder playground pretty much ever. Better snow, sure, but if it means I can do 10 laps a day there opposed to 2 or 3 on some of the best in bounds terrain Ill take that. Granite is what it is, I know of very few people who head back there that don't know what the deal is, and thats not because of a 10 minute hike up Pepis. People made that argument before the open gate policy as well. Clearly that worked out terrible.Live Free or Die
02-16-2012, 10:21 AM #682
I'm just very opposed to making it that easy to get into Granite. I understand that it is really none of the ski area's business [officially]. And that the gate system has been working, and that much of the terrain south of the resort is already very easy to get to. But Rock Springs and Granite are completely different places. You can get away with dropping Rock Springs on a storm day with no gear (terrible idea, but people do all the time), but giving that same opportunity in Granite? Currently, they have the ability to effectively "close" most of that terrain on big days when they close the Headwall/Casper/Crags. But with a lift that could operate daily, providing access at critical (read: dangerous) times...
And while you may not think that the Crags and surrounding inbounds terrain is an "untouched powder playground", that pretty much sums up Granite in my personal view, especially the terrain directly below the top terminal of the proposed lift. To think of Casper/AV skiers getting dropped off on top of that...
I like that terrain much better like it was on Tuesday, when I had to break trail to it from the AV gate, meaning the snow was completely untouched the whole way to the valley floor.
Last edited by powder_prophet; 02-16-2012 at 10:38 AM.Skiing, whether you're in Wisconsin or the Alps, is a dumbass hick country sport that takes place in the middle of winter on a mountain at the end of a dirt road.
02-16-2012, 10:40 AM #683
02-16-2012, 10:53 AM #684
Sad day for SAR. Vibes to friends and family.
02-16-2012, 10:57 AM #685
Look, you can play the fear card all you want, but I dont think it really applies. You can access granite pretty much right of the top of AV as well with a 2 minute sidestep. Clearly that is leading to massive problems.Live Free or Die
02-16-2012, 11:29 AM #686
you can access boring granite haha..same with ducking a rope in toga to get to mario world... yes dangerous but not to the extent of the ABCs or endless and ML... the resort has permits to put lifts up all the way to jenson canyon... i bet they head south before they head west (hope)
but Irregardless no matter what the resort wants to do it has to be approved by the USFS who they obtain the lease from. Their perspective is what really matters and I dont think they want lift accessed 3000ft granite right below winter wildlife closures. just sayin
02-16-2012, 11:33 AM #687
They also have winter wildlife closures leading up to peoples backyards in town over by Cache Creek. Again, no issues.
If that argument was true, they wouldnt have gates accessing Granite in the first place.
Just be honest about this here people, you want to keep it more to yourselves. Thats fine and all, but just admit it, not bullshit excuses about permiting, winter closures, and gapers.Live Free or Die
02-16-2012, 11:53 AM #688
Not trying to keep it for myself, just trying to keep the total numbers down. Anyone can go there right now. Gapers can still get there and ski it if they want. I just think that area has already reached its carrying capacity, as it were. Its already pretty easy to access, considering the quality of the terrain back there.Skiing, whether you're in Wisconsin or the Alps, is a dumbass hick country sport that takes place in the middle of winter on a mountain at the end of a dirt road.
02-16-2012, 12:00 PM #689
i would rather see a poma style surface lift OUT of granite than one to get you in.
/end snowboarder granite traverse rage
time is the only thing that will tell. But i bet at minimum there is at least 8-10 years b4 this happens
02-16-2012, 12:21 PM #690
They should just run lifts all the way over China Wall and on to the backside of Table, and then on to Targhee. Maybe a spur over to Housetops for fun, and maybe a Michelin 4 star lodge...
02-16-2012, 01:01 PM #691
Thanks for the suggestions on JHMR, guys. I'll leave it up to my buddy to decide. I like extra wiggle room/ Bedrooms, but I can crash in a hotel bed for 2 days, too. Whatever.
Let it Snow!
02-16-2012, 01:26 PM #692
02-16-2012, 01:35 PM #693
With a funicular up to the middle. And a Poma up and over the Belly Roll.
02-16-2012, 01:43 PM #694
And a magic carpet across Jackson Lake
And maybe one of those skier tunnels through Fossil.
02-16-2012, 01:59 PM #695
i heard the old casper chair is gonna be used to get people from the casper restaurant back to the gondola restaurant.... gotta spend that money!
02-16-2012, 04:15 PM #696Registered User
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
OK, this is where you guys need to wake up and think a little more bigger picture and also outside of North America. (Re lift to Crags and Granite comments).
Saying that putting a lift there is going to encourage more people to try and kill themselves is laughable when you consider that in Europe you can ski ANYWHERE you want from lifts that access terrain that dewarfs Granite. Dont get me wrong, I'm one of the biggest JHMR fans and the neighouring side / back country, however it's a joke to listen to this bull shit hype so often. People really dont go killing themselves in Europe or getting free helicopter rides out of places that much, yet EVERY year fcking idiots with no idea go into Granite...Maybe it's because the terrain in the Alps is just more plentiful and therefore people dont feel the need. BUt if they place a lift there you will get more traffic and really that is just down to stupid American arse holes with no experience and crucially no respect for the mountains. This just doesn't happen in Europe... and if it does you get hit with a massive $20,000 bill... why on earth they do these rescues for free in the US (of all places) I have no idea.... like that silly women that set off that avalanche in Pinedale this year skiing solo with her beacon in her pack.... rescued for free and treated for free at the hospital... Makes me mad....
Build the lift, but people get a flippin brain and some ability....
02-16-2012, 04:47 PM #697
^^ sounds like you just dont want to hike
seems like lazy out of towners are for it
locals against it
too bad its the lazy out of towners who spend all the $$ at the resort.
guess you will get your lift someday.
just expect USFS to get bribed first!
02-16-2012, 04:53 PM #698Registered User
- Join Date
- Sep 2004
New lifts change how the mountain skis. Sure it may cause Granite to pass its "capacity" but the pressure will be released from other zones. Remember when the tram was going in? Some areas got hit harder, others got hit less. How the mountain skied changed, but the total skier impact was the same. The same thing will happen with the proposed lifts.
What you need to fear is the resorts effort to increase visitation, not how they direct the current traffic levels.
02-16-2012, 05:09 PM #699Registered User
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
You got me all wrong.... I'll walk / climb / skin etc and love it and I'm certainly no lazy out of town gaper and can keep up with the best of them.
I'm making the point that in NA and in particular Jackson there seems to be this unique issue of people getting lost when it just doesn't happen in places that are far more hardcore... So the argument that you don't build a lift because there are loads of crap skiers is a lame argument. Christ you have signs all over the place and gates yet these losers get into trouble every year... Do you see people dropping off the back side of the Grande Motte in Europe? No... not unless they know what they are doing... do people go over the back of Brevant in Chamonix? Nope... But people turn right out of the gates at Cody bowl all the time and end up in Granite...
What about that guy that went out of bounds at Targhee 2 years ago and died... and the family blame resort / rescue service....yet the place was closeed and the signs were clear.... the issue is brain dead skiers that are way out of their depth...yeah not having a lift keeps more tracks for people who like to hike (me included) but for places to move on new lift get built... They may as well lose the Tram on the basis of that argument and make everyone hike....
02-16-2012, 05:28 PM #700
Waa waa cry me a river.....sounds like rich people problems. Frankly, you guys are sorta whining despite your luck considering how the Village ownership has a plan and big money to spend keeping things up to date and in working order. Yet somehow your pass prices go down 30% despite massive infrastructure upgrades. Gee, a new tram and lift for $600 less than 2008. That's got to really hurt.
Come over to the west side where our prices have gone up 100% over the last ten years and we get NOTHING to show for it. Just a petulant rich kid for an owner, who I have been told has expressed resentment at being forced to "run a charity" for local skiers after his plans to fall ass backwards into a few hundred million real estate bucks flopped miserably. It would be nice if someone with a little vision for ski operations instead of real estate flips and some cash like the Kemmerers took over soon (persistent rumor is the owner is waiting for values to rebound before selling out to the Huntsman family). The lifts are creaky as fuck and can't handle heavy storms anymore, the overnight lodging is falling apart and grooming has been cut back 50% over the last two seasons. There are no plans to upgrade anything over here and it's no secret that the resort can't even pay all its bills on time. Sure seems like things are on hold til the place can be sold off. Attracting destination skiers is a necessary evil if you want a modern, functioning resort and weekenders subsidizing the local's season passes. Seems like the Village and the ghee are going in opposite directions, so count your blessings, such as they are.
Last edited by neckdeep; 02-16-2012 at 06:30 PM.I have come for you my child and the gift I bring is murder.
God won't hear your prayer, he's listening to SLAYER!