Thread: S7, DPS Wailer, Billy Goats, Bent Chetler?????? WHICH ONE?

I have been seriously looking at buying the 188 S7s or the 190 DPS wailers. Through further research I have come across the Billy Goats and the Bent Chetlers as other formidable options.

I ski west coast as I am from Vancouver BC. I am 6'1, 185lbs and an aggressive skier. I like steep lines, going fast, big powder turns, tight tress runs, 8 foot drops but don't care too much for the park. I ski a lot of days at Whistler Blackcomb and some at Mt Baker and I might hit the interior also. There is a fair share of resort skiing and slack country with a few back country trips in there.

I plan to put on some fritschi's, as I already have those, on the pair of skis I acquire. What I am asking is for peoples thoughts on the skis mentioned above as I have only really researched the first two and any other skis that are in this class of do it all powder ski that can rock it in the resort.

Let me know your thoughts and I will try to answer any further questions or info required to make a solid recommendation.

I've only skied S7's and Wailer 112's, but I would say the 112's would be your best bet if you are planning on touring with them, even if it is resort side country. They are lighter than all the others even in the heavier Hybrid version. I liked the S7's as much in powder, but the 112's were more versatile in most other conditions. I think that would be true of them against the other two you mention as well. The Bent Chetler would probably be the best powder ski of the bunch but the least versatile. I can't say much about the Billy Goat's as I have the least knowledge of them, but have heard reviews from friends who have skied them who liked them, but weren't blown away the way I felt when I skied the 112's. I demoed the Hybrid 112's with Freerides and did a day's tour on them and the combo was great. After skiing the Pures I decided to go that route as they were lighter and a bit more precise and powerful feeling. I'll be mounting them with Dynafit Radical FT's for mixed resort and backcountry use.

Originally Posted by jvaughan9

I have been seriously looking at buying the 188 S7s or the 190 DPS wailers.

just a quick note: the 188 rossi s7 measures an actual 185cm. the DPS skis measure true to length... so comparing a 184cm dps wailer 112 to a rossi s7 is your best best, and comparing the 195cm super 7 (192cm actual) to the 190 wailer 112 is again, a closer comparison.

xctly', I skied the Benny's last season and agree on the comments. I skied the 112's for a day in over a foot of some pretty heavy junk and had no issues, The benny at 183 meaures pretty true but just felt a little short at times ( It hink the benny @ 193 would be too much for me) where the 112, @ 190 felt perfect with the same manueverability and fun factor but the extra length just smoothed irregular terrain that much better. For more versitility, go 112 pure or hybrid. Got the $? go pure. (BTW- not knocking the ON3P, just have not tried)

Originally Posted by Wetdog;3367178[B

]I've only skied S7's and Wailer 112's, but I would say the 112's would be your best bet if you are planning on touring with them, even if it is resort side country. They are lighter than all the others even in the heavier Hybrid version. I liked the S7's as much in powder, but the 112's were more versatile in most other conditions. I think that would be true of them against the other two you mention as well. The Bent Chetler would probably be the best powder ski of the bunch but the least versatile. I can't say much about the Billy Goat's as I have the least of them, but have heard reviews from friends who have skied them who liked them, but weren't blown away the way I felt when I skied the 112's[/B]. I demoed the Hybrid 112's with Freerides and did a day's tour on them and the combo was great. After skiing the Pures I decided to go that route as they were lighter and a bit more precise and powerful feeling. I'll be mounting them with Dynafit Radical FT's for mixed resort and backcountry use.

Originally Posted by BoatBound

The benny at 183 meaures pretty true but just felt a little short at times ( It hink the benny @ 193 would be too much for me) where the 112, @ 190 felt perfect with the same manueverability and fun factor but the extra length just smoothed irregular terrain that much better.

BoatBound - what's your height & weight? Thanks.

6' 170-175 depending on # of stouts, quads and porters

In all honesty, I don't think you can go wrong with any of these choices. The DPS will be the lightest of the bunch and you'll pay for that, but otherwise I'd just go for what you can get for the best price.

DC- not to start a pissing match but the DPS offers a better product on steeps, hiking and leftovers. the cost for any of these new is very comparable. at his size he really needs to sizeup on the benny to the 193.

Originally Posted by BoatBound

DC- not to start a pissing match but the DPS offers a better product on steeps, hiking and leftovers. the cost for any of these new is very comparable. at his size he really needs to sizeup on the benny to the 193.

Fair enough. I have not tried the DPS but have heard nothing but good things. I was on S7s for a season, demoed Bent Chetlers and liked them equally, and have tried other similar hybrid designs and have found them fun as well. My comment was more that they're all good skis and it comes down to preference if you were to pick, and nobody can guess the OP's preference. He should either demo or just buy what's easiest to purchase. You see a lot of most of these skis around Whistler.

Also, agreed that Hybrid 112RPs are similar in cost to skis from major brands, but you will never find them at any sort of discount like you would with some other skis.

Can't say enough about the billy goats as a daily driver Whistler ski. I've got a pair of last year's with Barons and they just kill it in the typical W/B pow. I think the added burly-ness really helps when things are deep but not total blower.

Sweet guys, thanks for the info thus far. The DPS is my ski of choice as most of you also seem to be leaning towards. I will be checking out the turkey sale up in Whistler with the possibility of buying a used pair or those (which i doubt too many people will be selling) or the S7's with the Billy Goats as my third choice. If I can't find a used pair I will look into buying new.

Do you guys have any other recommendations on skis to look for??

Originally Posted by jvaughan9

Sweet guys, thanks for the info thus far. The DPS is my ski of choice as most of you also seem to be leaning towards. I will be checking out the turkey sale up in Whistler with the possibility of buying a used pair or those (which i doubt too many people will be selling) or the S7's with the Billy Goats as my third choice. If I can't find a used pair I will look into buying new.

Do you guys have any other recommendations on skis to look for??

Good choice... Especially since you mentioned AT stuff. The 112 rp rips everywhere. Im sure you wont regret it. I think the 110-115 waist skis are the best all around skis right now.

At your size I think you'd over power the 188 S7. Super 7 is different (and I haven't skied it so I can't comment). Honestly I don't like the regular S7 too much. Great in the soft stuff but I don't find it can handle crud all that all and it's too soft to really charge on (unless you're light). I totally understand why 90% of skiers out there would love them, but if you are a bigger guy and/or you like going fast/charging, I wouldn't even consider the 188 S7.

I love my Billy Goats. They do pretty much everything as well or better than the S7. The S7 turns a bit faster on groomers and when there is less fresh snow. I like big turns so I don't really care about that. Also, the 191 Billy Goat is amazing. If you're considering the 195 Super 7 the 191 BG is about the same size (around a 193/194 by most others measure).

I've only heard good things about the Wailer 112. You'll pay more for them, but they're awesome. As others have mentioned even the hybrid is lighter than the others and obviously you'll appreciate this if you're touring. From what I have heard (I haven't skied them myself) if you want to use the ski as a daily driver (especially at Whistler with our heavier snow) stay away from the pure as it can get knocked around a bit due to its low weight. Because you said you want to put fritschis on them, I would say the 190 Wailer 112 should be far and away your first choice. If it were a Duke or alpine binding, it would be a more difficult decision.

Good points....

Originally Posted by D(C)

Fair enough. I have not tried the DPS but have heard nothing but good things. I was on S7s for a season, demoed Bent Chetlers and liked them equally, and have tried other similar hybrid designs and have found them fun as well. My comment was more that they're all good skis and it comes down to preference if you were to pick, and nobody can guess the OP's preference. He should either demo or just buy what's easiest to purchase. You see a lot of most of these skis around Whistler.

Also, agreed that Hybrid 112RPs are similar in cost to skis from major brands, but you will never find them at any sort of discount like you would with some other skis.

I am 6 ft 175 lbs and have the S7's. I love them in untouched pow/trees. I am not a big fan of how it handles in crud and at speed. I am currently looking into BG's to solve the stability/speed issues that my S7's have. I am pissed that I didn't pull the trigger a few months ago when they were on sale! FAIL!

Based on how you say you ski, I think you'll regret the Fritschis. Get a pair of Dukes and Billy Goats. None of the other skis can handle high speed like the BGs, based on what I've heard first-hand from friends who have tried the Wailers. During a summer ski this year, I took the BGs right into summer-hardened runnels and suncups at 40+mph coming out of a steep corned couloir and they held their own (ask KillingCokes or see the TR). If you're going to be touring a lot, then the Wailers (and Fritschis) make more sense, but it sounds like you're more of a resort/sidecountry guy. The S7s are floppy noodles to a guy that wants to charge, as are the Bents - I've seen it mentioned a couple of times that they're even less confidence-inspiring than the S7s.

And Dukes aren't the end of the world when it comes to backcountry skiing, and for slackcountry, they're a no-brainer. I've spent the spring/summer touring relatively long distances in Dukes and Alpine boots, which, while it sort of sucked on the up, it wasn't terrible, and it was well worth it to have them on the way down. These days, Fristschis are kind of stuck in no-mans-land, IMO. And you definitely don't sound like a candidate for dynafits/plums.

^^ Lindahl, you put a smile on my face given that I have a fresh pair of BG's to be mounted with Dukes for this year. I'm also considering using inserts and adding mounting provisions for my newly acquired Plum Guides.

Be careful what you wish for. Sold my BG's (1st gen) as they didnt do it for me. Originally bought the BGs for the same reasons you are considering them. The flex & design was just all wrong for me. If you can demo 1st that would be ideal, but BG's arent readily available for demo.

Originally Posted by MJbumper1121

I am 6 ft 175 lbs and have the S7's. I love them in untouched pow/trees. I am not a big fan of how it handles in crud and at speed. I am currently looking into BG's to solve the stability/speed issues that my S7's have. I am pissed that I didn't pull the trigger a few months ago when they were on sale! FAIL!

Have you tried the new 191's? I agree, it is unfortunate they aren't easily available to demo. I have also heard that you really need to ski them multiple times to be able to get used to the way they ski, thus demoing them for one day might not actually do them justice.

Originally Posted by wizard604

Be careful what you wish for. Sold my BG's (1st gen) as they didnt do it for me. Originally bought the BGs for the same reasons you are considering them. The flex & design was just all wrong for me. If you can demo 1st that would be ideal, but BG's arent readily available for demo.

Originally Posted by Lindahl

The S7s are floppy noodles to a guy that wants to charge, as are the Bents - I've seen it mentioned a couple of times that they're even less confidence-inspiring than the S7s.

Just for the records and FWIW the 192 Bennys are significantly stiffer than the 183s - no comparison between these two.

Originally Posted by wizard604

Be careful what you wish for. Sold my BG's (1st gen) as they didnt do it for me. Originally bought the BGs for the same reasons you are considering them. The flex & design was just all wrong for me. If you can demo 1st that would be ideal, but BG's arent readily available for demo.

You really can't compare the 1st gen with the newer ones.

Honestly if the 191 is as good as people say it is I might end up back on BG's.

Sweet guys. I have also now been looking at the Armada JJ, Atomic Blog and the Line Sir Francis Bacon. These skis are a better price point but my main concern with them is how stiff they are. Are they like 'floppy noodles' like some have mentioned the S7 to be? I am also concerned about the length as they are all about 185cm. With the tip and tail rocker it would seem to me that that doesn't give lots of edge on the groomers.

Let me know your experiences with these. I am still leaning towards the wailer but if these skis are comparable at a better price point with some minor differences that don't really make that big of a difference to a nonpro skier such as myself I am inclined to purchase one of them.

Originally Posted by Lindahl

Based on how you say you ski, I think you'll regret the Fritschis. Get a pair of Dukes.....

I'll second this. jvaughan9, you're talking about subtle differences between several quality skis, but you're planning to install bindings that will absorb those differences. It's like taking the stock tires off your Camry and putting them on your Ferrari.

Here is a good article on binding stiffness over at Wildsnow.com

If you can afford to consider DPS skis, pick up a pair of Dukes.

I will also add a vote to fritschis being a debatable call. The flex is despicable and the din range deplorable. The only thing worse than pre-releasing is having a sloppy boot to ski interface. The fritschi is both of those horrible characteristics. I have mine on a dedicated touring setup and I still hate their face. Hate them so much.... Especially if it's resort-primary, or even an equal split resort/backcountry, don't do it. The only way you won't regret it is if you don't know any better, but even then... do yourself a favor and get something else. Like a Duke or a Baron.

My choice: sollyfit plates. In my experience, dukes suck for any sort of touring, but that is a separate discussion.

Originally Posted by nickel

I will also add a vote to fritschis being a debatable call. The flex is despicable and the din range deplorable. The only thing worse than pre-releasing is having a sloppy boot to ski interface. The fritschi is both of those horrible characteristics. I have mine on a dedicated touring setup and I still hate their face. Hate them so much.... Especially if it's resort-primary, or even an equal split resort/backcountry, don't do it. The only way you won't regret it is if you don't know any better, but even then... do yourself a favor and get something else. Like a Duke or a Baron.