Thread: Green Mountain Freeride AT Binding

Originally Posted by Lindahl

Sounds interesting.
Wondering about possible slop and fatigue (aluminum) on these pieces over time. Can you/they address these concerns?

I don't know how many days they have on each system. Probably not more than 30 or so, since they have been through a few iterations of this system. They each had a pair for the month they were in South America, and they had not developed play. I would be surprised if they did; the aluminum plate is thick enough and the interface tight enough that it should not develop play. Fatigue is another question, and I have no engineering to back this up, but the toe plate is not much larger than the actual binding toe, and is held into the track by an overlap on three sides. Flex of the toe plate should be negligible.

@thedrew55 - you sound like someone who realistically wants a trekker (or maybe a better trekker?). I'm sure this system would fit your needs, but this is really designed for someone who does a significant amount of touring and wants zero compromise in downhill performance. It is designed as a competitor to the Duke, Salomon, Dynafit, and MFD more than a trekker.

Bump for this fantastic idea:
proto order details.

As far as the toe plate goes, it would be nice if it could be ordered for the customers binding of choice. Also, have you seen any wearing of the hex screws? The parallel hole sides might not contact the dynafit pinchers uniformly enough to stop some wear. I am assuming the Dynafit parts are significantly harder than the screws.

Click the link above, binding is now being made as a "touring add-on" for Look, Sally, Tyrolia, and available for much less $$$.

The screw heads do wear, pretty much just until they're round where they exit the boot. If they get sloppy, you can get new ones at the hardware store!

Stoked on the proto program for this year!

I don't know much about tech bindings but as I understand it the plum guide is the newest, potentially burliest and most expensive binding on the market... seeing as the tech portion of the binding is only being used for the ascent (limited stress) would it not make more sense to go with a less capable yet cheaper toe piece? there may be distribution politics behind the scenes I am unaware of but I imagine running this with a cheaper dynafit model toe piece wouldn't deter any customers and could lower the price, increase the profit margin or both.

question: Could I remove the Plum toepiece easily numerous times from the toe plate? ie:quiver killer style? Machined threaded inserts? Could I have my full tech binding setup with inserts and move the Plum toepiece to the plates on my burlier skis when I'm in the mood for sending it on the descents?

I don't see why not; they're machined inserts. I bet they'd be happy to send you a pair w/o the Plum part.

There were some politics involved, Dynafit wasn't into the idea of supplying their (sort of) competition. I think a simpler tech toepiece might be involved at a later date, I have an idea I'll be building this fall to hopefully test on the plate this winter.

^^^cool. I emailed the guy to hopefully get in on the prototype program

FWIW, I know Spark R/D sells Dynafiddle toe pieces for their hard booting customers. Read a rumor over on splitboard.com that they´d only cost $100/pair this season. Could be wrong, though, and the webshop´s not open quite yet. Exciting days!

Bump this!

any idea on when we would hear back from an email? or when they plan to get protos out? just trying to plan my quiver sooner this year

Originally Posted by Gone Skiing

@thedrew55 - you sound like someone who realistically wants a trekker (or maybe a better trekker?). I'm sure this system would fit your needs, but this is really designed for someone who does a significant amount of touring and wants zero compromise in downhill performance. It is designed as a competitor to the Duke, Salomon, Dynafit, and MFD more than a trekker.

Why would anyone who does a "significant amount of touring" want to tour in Alpine Boots? I realize I'm a totally different demographic, but are there really people clamoring to go touring in Alpine Boots?

Check w/ dyna/salsas USA, I think they sold dyna toes separately in the past.

Don't know if this is really an issue but getting the allen screws to be the perfect width
might be tough. If it is a problem, the plum race toes have adjustable pins
(pictured here- http://skitheory.blogspot.com/2010/1...-bindings.html). I don't know if the Plums are still made this way. Probably worth a check. Another benefit of a lot of the race toes for this setup is that they lock into tour mode when you step in.

This looks awesome!

I'd like to see an updated Trekker that uses a tech toe instead of the current platform with toe and heel bails.

D(C).. Why?

I´m envisioning you wanting those to chuck into tech toes, alpine heel, then I´m envisioning your backpack. Heh.

Very interesting. I think my biggest concern would be the very thin metal clip holding the pins in place. If one breaks, you're fucked. It would be good to have the pin attachment integrated into the binding in a way that negated the use for a clip - I'm thinking Spark R&D's splitboard binding pin setup. Not quite sure how that would work with a ski boot but something to think about.

Originally Posted by arild

D(C).. Why?

I´m envisioning you wanting those to chuck into tech toes, alpine heel, then I´m envisioning your backpack. Heh.

I'm not sure I understand. What I have in mind would be less bulky than the current trekker. I'm thinking of a dummy sole with a tech toe mounted on it, that would clip into your alpine binding a-la trekker.

Here is the basic idea (please forgive the crappy rendering, crooked Dynafit toe and Marker bindings)

Not too dumb an idea, I´ll give you that. That would still require drilling into the alpine boots, or having dynafit compatible boots in the first place. And.. I´m pretty sold on the idea of the GMF freeride binding, although I can´t afford to go that route this year.

To explain my train of thought;

I figured you wanted a dummy tech toe instead of the dummy alpine toe (on the trekker). Then, mind was blown. I couldn´t figure out how that would be efficient in any way what so ever.

I´ve had a few thoughts on how to make the current trekkers a lot more stable, and wouldn´t necessarily cost too much to mock up.

Originally Posted by arild

Not too dumb an idea, I´ll give you that. That would still require drilling into the alpine boots, or having dynafit compatible boots in the first place. And.. I´m pretty sold on the idea of the GMF freeride binding, although I can´t afford to go that route this year.

To explain my train of thought;

I figured you wanted a dummy tech toe instead of the dummy alpine toe (on the trekker). Then, mind was blown. I couldn´t figure out how that would be efficient in any way what so ever.

I´ve had a few thoughts on how to make the current trekkers a lot more stable, and wouldn´t necessarily cost too much to mock up.

The way I see it, tech bindings are sturdy enough for the way down for everything but repeated resort bashing. If I'm going to tour all day, I'll use my Dynafits. But if I'm going to ski mostly inbounds with maybe one or 2 out of bounds laps, a Trekker done right would be a great solution, and Dukes would no longer be needed. With increasingly solid tech-compatible boots on the market (or modifying boots like what GMF has done here), integrating a tech toe to simplify/strengthen the trekker design is a solid option. Probably my biggest complaint with the current trekker is the annoyingness of stepping into that toe and heel bail in fluffy pow. A step-in trekker would make transitions a lot simpler.

Sending you a PM, D(C).

Originally Posted by panchosdad

Why would anyone who does a "significant amount of touring" want to tour in Alpine Boots? I realize I'm a totally different demographic, but are there really people clamoring to go touring in Alpine Boots?

I do a significant amount of touring, all in alpine boots. AT boots suck. My alpine boots tour awesome on everything but long flats, and I'm not willing to sacrifice skiing capability, ever, at all. Hence, the GMF AT system.

harpo - Dyna has sold just toes to GMF in the past, but will not do it for a competitor's offering.

deftfunk - the pin is pretty solid, its like 1/8" dia or so. They were still tweaking that part of the design last time I saw the system. Either way, you could always tour w/ an extra, or duct tape the plat in. Forward pressure of the binding should pretty well keep the toe piece in place anyway, so it would only be an issue touring.

DC - I've thought along those lines a lot. Haven't figured out a way to do it elegantly. Tech bindings are sturdy enough for most people in the backcountry, but not for everyone. I can't trust them, I've had a couple pretty solid failures of the tech system and would simply rather haul weight than try to trust something I just can't trust.

Lars is doing some last minute tweaking to the design, incorporating some of the ideas from here. It sounds like he's had more than enough interest in the proto program, and it is now closed. Production run scheduled for next fall.

Its looking good:
-available for Look Pivots, Salomons, and Tyrolias
-probably available w/ or w/o a tech toe included (we're also working on a design for a simpler toe, ie one that does not release. will see how that pans out cost-wise)
-alpine boot mod available for $30 via mail
-cost of plates and heel risers w/o tech toe ~$100-150

Originally Posted by Gone Skiing

deftfunk - the pin is pretty solid, its like 1/8" dia or so. They were still tweaking that part of the design last time I saw the system. Either way, you could always tour w/ an extra, or duct tape the plat in. Forward pressure of the binding should pretty well keep the toe piece in place anyway, so it would only be an issue touring.

What you say about pressure keeping the binding in place downhill makes sense. I wasn't concerned so much with the pin itself, just what looks like the flimsy wire spring holding it in place. It is a little hard to tell from the pictures what the attachment on the other side looks like, but the spring looks pretty close to the edge of the ski/in a spot where it might take a hit. If the spring is lost, the pin could conceivably just fall right out, no? Again, not quite sure the way to address this but losing the pin would be a pain in the ass if nothing else. Obviously I haven't spent time on these, just pointing out what I see as a possible weak point.

Baller idea though, I think a lot of us are more than willing to make a few sacrifices (drilling a boot, swopping toe pieces to tour/ski) in order to have BC access with a real alpine binding. Pretty cool to see three (MFD, Salomon, GMFATB (?)) upcoming AT options.

The spring you see is just the clip to keep the solid 1/8" pin in place. If you broke the clip, it could come out. Again, I will probably carry a spare for a while to make sure that won't happen.

I............want it?

I want it.