Thread: Kenda BBG tire review

Originally Posted by phatfreeheeler

Ok, gotta ask...what's the reasoning behind going UST tires if you have to lose volume to do so? The weight increase for the UST isn't much, so at least there isn't a big hit there...

Didn't try the tubeless thing until moving out east, but here, regular tires converted over don't last. They get the sidewalls chewed up and poked ful of holes. I get much, much more life out of a real UST tire due to the extra beef of the walls. Particularly the rear tires, where I'm not being as smooth getting it over/around things as the front. Hell, I even have two ADvantage LUST tires with nice big gashes in them now.

YMMV - that's just my experience.

Run my pressures now around 30psi. in skinnier tires overall than before. Love it. Most of my rides have 2.2-2.3 tires, with a couple 2.1 and 2.5 meats in for good measure. The little amount of volume lost isn't even an issue.

Haven't tried a BBG - not sure how well it'd work on the wierd mix of tech/smooth/fast/chunk on my trails, but may have to pick one up just to try.

Biggest problem I have with this tire is it is sort of a one trick pony. If you ride somewhere that never sees a change in weather and conditions suit it, go for it. Otherwise, I really (really) don't want to repeat trying to ride after a torrential downpour in full on Mt. Snow style grease on a legit DH trail with these tires. Just not worth it! It's like getting stuck in the snow with race slicks on your STi.

Originally Posted by JeffreyJim

If you ride somewhere that never sees a change in weather and conditions suit it, go for it.

Tahoe!

Just ordered a 2.35 from Pricepoint for $40. It'll replace my 2.25 Ardent rear trail bike tire later this year.

AK, I predict you will love this tire compared to the Ardent in the rear. This tire hooks up while the Ardent is a drifter.

Ok, I get it, basically some of you just need a thicker stronger tire but still want it to be fast rolling. I would actually love if they would add 100g of extra rubber to thicken the sidewalls just a bit on the 2.35. Not sure if I'd like this tread to be any tighter though, unless it's only affecting the large gap from side knobs to center tread. That area has a little room to be made smaller I guess. I actually wish they would take the side knob design (don't touch that) and build another tire around it with a slightly more open and wider thicker center knob pattern. Not as open as a Minion, but somewhere in-between that and the BBG. That would be my ideal front tire.

Marshal, for your weight (including bike), you're actually running a touch less pressure than me. So you have a slightly larger tire patch and maybe a more exposed sidewall. I haven't had the tearing issue yet at my pressures, but I'm lighter and likely a bit slower

Woo, not sure I totally buy your pressure thesus, but I have always asserted that LOW pressures are stupid if you want to ride fast cause the bead is not properly held in place and you just cut the sidewall of the tire or pinch flat anyways. How many DH race runs have ended in a flat tire cause the rider wanted to run <20psi. When I say reduced pressures I'm talking small changes. That said, I've seen a lot of standard (non-tubeless) ties blow right of the rim even while just riding a straight line due to too much pressure (>45psi). You've probably written books about this, but the way I see it, the tire is much more stiff than the tube, so both tube and tubeless setups see about the same force trying to pull them out of the bead socket (due to the radial force), but the tube does also supply a bit of direct pressure on the bead that helps keep it seated. So a tubed tire should stay seated slightly better than the same tire tubeless at the same pressure. UST tires are stiffer and stronger casings so of course they are fine with the MORE pressure concept just like running a wire bead. I'm sure that's great for heavier or FAST riders, but if a mere mortal like I can wear a tread out before I tear the tire, I need another good reason to run a 200g heavier tire than the equivalent sized standard tire. I've actually always ran 5-10% less pressure when I run a tires tubeless and have been really happy with them. I honestly can't say I feel the tire is that much more supple tubeless if the pressure is equal. Maybe I need to work on my sensitivity training. I run tubeless cause I could never get more than 10 miles out of a tube at any reasonable pressure unless I was running dual ply tires. That was the early 2000's though. I will say that when I run more pressure than I do already I find the tires are great while riding fast, but hate them riding super slow (which I also enjoy doing once in a while). Thanks for the perspective though.

So Kenda, the BBG was a successful tire experiment, I'm sure the Happy Medium is too, now take it the other way, but keep those big tight side knobs. You would sell a lot of them to mortals like me. Oh, and make them in both DTC and DTC/UST.

I've never understood why so many people assume the #1 benefit of tubeless is the ability to run low psi. My take on it is that tubeless (when I say tubeless I mean true UST, not some lower end rim that has been hillbillied with duct tape or a kids tube) is that it gives the rider more freedom to run whatever pressure they want, but usually you end up running more psi because the tire is better able to conform to the trail with the absence of the tube. That, and the fact a good UST setup can make getting flats about as infrequent as you would expect with your automobile (depending where you ride, I guess.)

Freeheeler, personally I have never seen a tire just blow off a rim because it was inflated to 45psi. Here is a bike check of Eric Carter's GT Fury from Fontanta last spring. That's a dry, rocky course. He's running Happy Mediums front and rear at 60psi. I know, I know, EC is way old and obsolete and everyone on tgr is now faster than him, but I did find it interesting...
http://www.vitalmtb.com/photos/featu...6502/sspomer,2

Originally Posted by Finstah

I've never understood why so many people assume the #1 benefit of tubeless is the ability to run low psi.

Mountain Bike Action has been preaching tubeless = lower psi for years?

Originally Posted by Finstah

I've never understood why so many people assume the #1 benefit of tubeless is the ability to run low psi.

Me neither. I heard all that blather about how the tire is more supple, etc., etc., so I tried it when I first tried out tubeless. It sucked. Squirmy, scary handling. I have to run higher pressures with tubeless than with tubes.

I got tired (heh) of tubeless setup hassles with Stan's goo, leaky sidewalls, difficulty seating beads (even with shop compressor), and have gone back to using tubes on all bikes. A couple flats per year, no big deal...

Originally Posted by Dickeymotto

Mountain Bike Action has been preaching tubeless = lower psi for years?

Someone reads that?

See phat? It ain't just me

Originally Posted by El Chupacabra

I tried it when I first tried out tubeless. It sucked. Squirmy, scary handling. I have to run higher pressures with tubeless than with tubes.

When I say burp I don't mean rip the tire off the wheel. When a bead pulls away from a sidewall with a tube nothing happens, it just goes back. When it happens tubeless, air goes away and you get a deflated tire. But that's why a good tire that works tubeless and some good solid UST rims are the only combos i use.


I've run so many of the exact same tire (literally the same tire) tubed and then tubeless that I don't need to convince anyone else, I was sold years and years ago. A tire without a tube rolls faster (you can feel this climbing, and I'm far from alone on this), and grips better. Why do you think cars and motos don't use tubes? Fuel efficiency.


And yeah I'm not talking about running a tire from 35psi to 60 once you take the tube out. But other than some smallish xc tires, I pretty much always run more pressure tubeless than I would with the same tire tubed.

Originally Posted by phatfreeheeler

AK, I predict you will love this tire compared to the Ardent in the rear. This tire hooks up while the Ardent is a drifter.

I don't mind drifty tires as long as they are consistent and predictable. The Specialized Purgatory Controls that the Ardents replaced felt unpredictable to me--they'd suddenly slide out. But it'll be interesting to try the BBGs in the back and perhaps a 2.4 Ardent in the front (or a 2.5 Exo Minion).

Originally Posted by scrublover

Didn't try the tubeless thing until moving out east, but here, regular tires converted over don't last. They get the sidewalls chewed up and poked ful of holes. I get much, much more life out of a real UST tire due to the extra beef of the walls. Particularly the rear tires, where I'm not being as smooth getting it over/around things as the front. Hell, I even have two ADvantage LUST tires with nice big gashes in them now.

YMMV - that's just my experience.

Run my pressures now around 30psi. in skinnier tires overall than before. Love it. Most of my rides have 2.2-2.3 tires, with a couple 2.1 and 2.5 meats in for good measure. The little amount of volume lost isn't even an issue.

Haven't tried a BBG - not sure how well it'd work on the wierd mix of tech/smooth/fast/chunk on my trails, but may have to pick one up just to try.

Thread hijack:

I have a new stans Flow front wheel and an existing 819 UST rear wheel. I've liked the 2.25 Advantage front for xc and may run the 2.1 Advanatage UST in the rear on a 5" bike. I like my folding 2.35 Minion DHF as a front tire, but it is far too loose on the Flow to run tubeless. Can anyone recommend a similar front tire that will mount securely to the Flow rim? I ride northwest trails which aren't quite as rocky as the northeast.

The idea of UST seems cool, but it seems like it's really easy to mess up and it adds a lot of rotating weight.
What am I missing?

Originally Posted by Dromond

...and an existing 821 UST rear wheel.

For a sec there you had me thinking I had missed the product announcement of the holy grail of rims. Then I went on the Mavic site and realized this was just a typo. Thanks. Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by Arty50

For a sec there you had me thinking I had missed the product announcement of the holy grail of rims. Then I went on the Mavic site and realized this was just a typo. Thanks. Thanks a lot.

Sorry! I meant 819. I can see why you would think that was the holy grail of rims.

Originally Posted by stuckathuntermtn

The idea of UST seems cool, but it seems like it's really easy to mess up and it adds a lot of rotating weight.
What am I missing?

Mostly just the fact that it's not that hard to do correctly and that it doesn't add a lot of rotating weight.

touche
.....

Originally Posted by Dromond

Thread hijack:

I have a new stans Flow front wheel and an existing 819 UST rear wheel. I've liked the 2.25 Advantage front for xc and may run the 2.1 Advanatage UST in the rear on a 5" bike. I like my folding 2.35 Minion DHF as a front tire, but it is far too loose on the Flow to run tubeless. Can anyone recommend a similar front tire that will mount securely to the Flow rim? I ride northwest trails which aren't quite as rocky as the northeast.

Check out Specialized's Butcher- very Minion-esque. Think they also do a 2.5 version.

http://www.specialized.com/us/en/ftb...eeride-dhtires

Originally Posted by scrublover

Check out Specialized's Butcher- very Minion-esque. Think they also do a 2.5 version.

http://www.specialized.com/us/en/ftb...eeride-dhtires

Cool, I hadn't looked at those. They do look kind of large though, bigger than a 2.5 Minion. Th 2.35 minion is really narrow, but is nice because it still has such an aggressive tread.

Holy crap, the tubeless conversation went longer than I expected. I get it, you guys like your current setups. I'm pretty much the same. You are just some of the only people I know that actually use UST tires and/or rims, so I thought it might be worth digging deeper. If I had never had success without UST, I'd probably be in the same camp, but I started at the farthest end of the tubeless spectrum and just kept experimenting until I had a good compromise of weight, traction, tracking, & durability. I hope I don't jinx myself, but I don't remember what year it was when I last got a flat, I don't ever feel like my tires are not tracking well due to being soft, they grip better than my skills allow, and my tread wears out when the side knobs are torn off.

Butcher's have definitely been on my list to try next as I love the Minion DHF tread. (if only the EXO version would work with Stan's rims - Single ply Maxxis tires on Stan's rims are where I've seen tires just spontaneously blow off the rim even though they felt well seated) The Butcher's will have to wait cause my current rubber just seems to be lasting forever, probably cause my ride times have shrunk due to other commitments.

The cornrows rail.

I really really like the BBG as a front tire. Fire it aggressively into corners and lean hard on the bike and it rails.

The Happy Medium has been a big surprise in climbing and braking traction. It has not let me down on dry roots or rock.

The 2.1 BBG is slightly bigger volume to the HM. It's like a 2.35 Minnion size.

Really dig these right now as I have been climbing lots on gravel road to get the most constant mileage in for some training. Fast tires are fast eh.

^^^nice^^^

it bears repeating that these are dry condition tires. if its wet/raining, don't use them!

but yeah, bonkers fast tires are bonkers... and shirk, glad someone agrees with me that the happy medium actually works, its not a total xc-race geek tire.

A front tire... no kidding. Those knobs look really close together, but when it's dry a fast tire with real side knobs is pretty appealing.

Any opinion on how a 2.35 BBG would work in the rear in steep, loose (dust and pebbly rocks) climbs?

I'm thinking of replacing my 2.25 Ardents before the Downieville Classic. My rear was slipping quite a bit this last weekend. I don't remember slipping as much with 2.35 Fat Alberts last year or the year before. Looking at the tread, I can't imagine the BBGs being a much of an improvement, although the added volume might help.

Originally Posted by AKbruin

Any opinion on how a 2.35 BBG would work in the rear in steep, loose (dust and pebbly rocks) climbs?

I'm thinking of replacing my 2.25 Ardents before the Downieville Classic. My rear was slipping quite a bit this last weekend. I don't remember slipping as much with 2.35 Fat Alberts last year or the year before. Looking at the tread, I can't imagine the BBGs being a much of an improvement, although the added volume might help.

they will climb loose rocky significantly better than alberts or ardents IMO. like way better. (just my .02, YMMV)

Originally Posted by marshalolson

they will climb loose rocky significantly better than alberts or ardents IMO. like way better. (just my .02, YMMV)

Nice. Thanks, man.