Thread: Sidecountry Hailey, Id avy - snowboarder rides out

Starts around 1:30.

He isn't wearing a beacon. Nice job idiot

Interesting...

That was a big fucking avy! Dude is lucky to be alive. Riding into a terrain trap, on windblown snow, then he goes right over to his buddy afterwards, hey no chance that this slope is suspect right? I mean this one just slid, but this one surely wont...

Hopefully they both decide to get some gear and education after that.

That was gnarly! Better to be lucky than good.

Originally Posted by simple

He isn't wearing a beacon. Nice job idiot

And how do you know he isn't beeping? Can you see under his outer layer?

While it's hard to say for certain, It sort of looks to me like the guy caught has a shovel under his snowshoes and a probe on left side of pack.


With the camera flailing around like it was (felt like I was on a boat in big swells) it's hard to say if the slope they stopped on was well-anchored.

Do you and Neufox have some background on this incident the rest of us don't? If so, please share your knowledge.

With perfect hindsight, entering an obvious terrain trap wasn't too bright. But before I get all judgmental, I'd need to know more about conditions (danger rating, forecast, recent wind/snowfall, snow profile, aspect, time of day, etc) and what evaluation (instability testing) they did before dropping in.

Even when you do all the right things, avalanches can still bite you in the ass. Just ask StuntCok - http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...Emergency-Gear

^^^No, I don't have any more info. Yes avalanches can happen to even the most experienced people. Avalanche pros die in avalanches too. But judging from these guys reactions, terrain choice and travel methods, I don't think they made good choices. Maybe there is a beacon hidden under that sweatshirt, but it sure doesn't look like it. There definitely are not enough anchors on that slope they stop on to prevent it from sliding. Maybe it is less than 30 degrees, but it doesn't look it from the video. Guy didn't even yell avalanche when it happened.

Also, at the beginning of the video you can hear the camera man ask if this is the bowl they are skiing, the guy who gets caught says, "yeah this is the bowl I am talking about" which although I can't say for sure makes it seem like they just made the decision to ski it. This would indicate to me that they had not thought out or tested the slope. Also, it appears that the snow at the top of the ridge is hard, windblown snow but then when they drop in, it becomes soft windblown snow. I have always thought that soft windblown snow usually means instability. Enough that even if stability tests were good, i would stay away from terrain traps.

I could be wrong about all this, this is just like my opinion man.

I did post up a few questions on the youtube site, so maybe we can get some more info.

Originally Posted by neufox47

^^^No, I don't have any more info. Yes avalanches can happen to even the most experienced people. Avalanche pros die in avalanches too. But judging from these guys reactions, terrain choice and travel methods, I don't think they made good choices. Maybe there is a beacon hidden under that sweatshirt, but it sure doesn't look like it. There definitely are not enough anchors on that slope they stop on to prevent it from sliding. Maybe it is less than 30 degrees, but it doesn't look it from the video. Guy didn't even yell avalanche when it happened.

Also, at the beginning of the video you can hear the camera man ask if this is the bowl they are skiing, the guy who gets caught says, "yeah this is the bowl I am talking about" which although I can't say for sure makes it seem like they just made the decision to ski it. This would indicate to me that they had not thought out or tested the slope. Also, it appears that the snow at the top of the ridge is hard, windblown snow but then when they drop in, it becomes soft windblown snow. I have always thought that soft windblown snow usually means instability. Enough that even if stability tests were good, i would stay away from terrain traps.

I could be wrong about all this, this is just like my opinion man.

I did post up a few questions on the youtube site, so maybe we can get some more info.

It seems to me that you're making a helluva lot of assumptions and just trying to dog these guys without many legit reasons.

Unless more info comes to light, it's tough to say.

if you all really feel like qb'ing here: http://www.sawtoothavalanche.com/adv...e4.php?id=1064

found using this simple google search, "patterson peak idaho avalanche"

glad the dudes are ok.... close call.

Originally Posted by linvillegorge

It seems to me that you're making a helluva lot of assumptions and just trying to dog these guys without many legit reasons.

Unless more info comes to light, it's tough to say.

Not trying to be adversarial here.

Which do you think are illogical conclusions though? Are you not supposed to yell "AVALANCHE" or do something to alert the vicinity?

If one guy is asking which bowl they are skiing, do you think they did any stability testing on this slope? They started well above this bowl, then rode down to the top before having this discussion. Although not hard evidence, I don't think you can dismiss it. If he was asking which line they were riding, shouldn't there have been discussion about line choice, islands of safety, travel methods?

In your opinion, does it look like the slope they stopped on was an island of safety? If it is greater than 33 degrees, then did the guy who was caught make the right choice by riding down right on top of his partner? I know that his adrenaline had to have been going at 100% and maybe I would do something stupid at that point too (never been there) but, is it not a mistake?

Yes I make some assumptions based on their behavior but I don't think they are unreasonble.

Report from the day of the slide (3.2.11) according to the below link, below link goes to 3.4.11 -
The avalanche danger is MODERATE on most slopes, but CONSIDERABLE hazard exists on steep, upper elevation slopes where southwesterly winds have formed shallow hard slabs on the lee sides of ridges and cross-loaded open slopes. Although the layer of sugary, faceted snow buried 16-24 inches deep no longer poses a widespread hazard, human-triggered avalanches remain possible on steep, mid-elevation, shaded and wind-sheltered slopes. The snowfall and gusty winds forecast for this afternoon and evening will likely combine to form fresh wind slabs, increasing the danger on steep slopes with new deposits of wind-drifted snow.

Selecte quotes from the discussion about the days forecast:
"The structure seems most delicate on slopes near the rainline - where the rain crust is thin but intact – which ranged from about 7500 feet elevation in the south valley to 8600 feet further north."

"The danger of triggering a slide is heightened where recent wind drifting has compounded the load on the weak layer, such as cross-loaded gullies, and on steep faces where lower-angled ridges and ribs drop into creek or valley bottoms."

Line from the post incident report - As you can see, this avalanche also occurred on a sub ridge that had been cross loaded by winds early in the week, and is very similar to the close call above Woodside last Saturday.

Judging by the picture, they rode exactly the slope that the forecast advised against. Probably could have been perfectly safe, had they simply stayed to the climbers left of where they rode. I'm open to any other thoughts, obviously we don't have all the facts, but I am not going to sit back and say, oh we can't make any observations about this slide because we don't know all the facts.

And in closing, I'm glad these guys made it out unharmed.

Originally Posted by telebobski

And how do you know he isn't beeping? Can you see under his outer layer?

What outer layer? He is wearing a skin tight sweater and you can tell there is no bump in it where a beacon would go. I guess he could have a beacon in his giant backpack but that would just make him a bigger idiot.

Originally Posted by simple

He is wearing a skin tight sweater and you can tell there is no bump in it where a beacon would go.

I really doubt that fleece sweater is the only thing between the air and his skin. People should always be wearing a beacon underneath at least one layer, not exposed to the outside, and the harness on my beacon is thin enough you wouldn't see it under a 100 weight fleece, tight or not . He could also be wearing the beacon on his left side that you never really see in the video - that's where I carry mine, just above the belly band of my pack.

Point is, you lack the information to judge "John" an idiot. By doing so you expose your own JONGishness.

Eat a dick Bob. I bet this is you. Mr. King of Knowledge and Observation.



Wow, I am just in awe of your maggothood. Douche.

^^^And another well thought out response from Simple, the avalanche expert who can pass judgment on someone's backcountry skills based on a few minutes of shaky pov

Yup, when you can't argue the facts, attack the person. You are really good at that Simple.

BTW I'm not a 'troller. I do tour with one, though. Otherwise, I'm just a guy who's spent a lot of time in the backcountry, and has had the Avy Dragon bite his partner's ass after taking all reasonable steps to manage the risk. The more time I spend out there, the less judgmental I am about others' wild rides - happy when they survive to share the experience/lesson, and sad when they don't.

But then, I lack Simple's madd observational, reasoning and persuasive skillz. I'm in awe.