Fuck off, TSA: The Penn way.

[wooley12]

Put this up elsewhere but the action seems to be here:

Michael Chertoff was the head of homeland security when airport screening began. He now leads The Chertoff Group, a security consulting firm that is pushing the new body scanners. Oh, by the way, his firm also lists Rapiscan, the manufacturer of the devices.

Not sure, but this may be a picture of him advising the TSA on how to properly inspect your boys if you opt for the pat down / grope.

[Kevo]

I think at a certain point, it went from pretending to ensure "safety" to seeing how much control and manipulation people are willing to put up with. What is being found...people are very, very willing to be controlled and manipulated. Things like this have certainly happened in the past, but there was never such a pervasive system of mass media to lull the populous into anesthetized sleep.

Corporations are the only entities that win out here- not liberty, not freedom and certainly not humans...not citizens.

...but it's ok, so long as Dancing with the Stars comes on tonight.

[bennymac]

People probably whined and cried bullshit when they first put in metal detectors and started xraying your luggage. I want my FREEDUM GODDAMMIT!

The TSA and their rent-a-cops know they just have to weather the hate for awhile until it dies down and these xray scanners become the norm.

Is this really an erosion of your freedom? Freedom to not have some fat chick in another room see your ballsack? Is that what you rally around the flag for?

Fuck the radiation dose - quit being pussies, you probably get more radiation from inside your home then you would walking though one of these a couple times a year. And the radiation dose is the only argument put forth that has even the tiniest bit of merit. Don't want a pat down? Walk through the scanner pussy. Or go home, I prefer having the seat next to me empty anyways.

You guys need more bran in your diet.

[bennymac]

I think at a certain point, it went from pretending to ensure "safety" to seeing how much control and manipulation people are willing to put up with. What is being found...people are very, very willing to be controlled and manipulated. Things like this have certainly happened in the past, but there was never such a pervasive system of mass media to lull the populous into anesthetized sleep.

Corporations are the only entities that win out here- not liberty, not freedom and certainly not humans...not citizens.

...but it's ok, so long as Dancing with the Stars comes on tonight.

Holy paranoid schizophrenia batman!

The xray scanners are a mass social experiment in cahoots with mass media to see how much fear it takes to lull us into complacency? Thats their motivation?

Maybe these corporations hired the stupid terrorists to light themselves or their shoes on fire...yeah...it all makes sense now.

Funny how those arguing against these scanners use fear instead of facts yet accuse the government of the same tactics.

[grubbers]

The TSA and their rent-a-cops know they just have to weather the hate for awhile until it dies down and these xray scanners become the norm.

when that day comes, what's going to be the extra security measure that they take with "suspicious" passengers? i'd probably just refuse the scanner at that point so i'd at least get a reach-around when they check my prostate for c4.

[Kevo]

Where in the constitution does it say that you should be allowed to ride a bike? Riding a bike is a privilege, not a right. After all, you are often times riding in public places- on public roads, sidewalks and trails.

If you want to ride a bike, you should be subject to pat downs by the police or any other government agent. It's not a right to ride a bike.

The constitution says something about unreasonable searches, but it doesn't expressly say "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized WHILE RIDING A BIKE."

You pussy's should stop whining and get with the program- riding a bike ISN'T A RIGHT. Fucking consent to the front-bottom pat down search. It isn't a problem if you've got nothing to hide! Quit your pussy "my rights are being infringe upon" bullshit!

[powpig]

it'd be sweet to get a flashmob-style group of 40-50 people to head through security seemingly randomly, then when taking off shoes, belt, etc. just keep stripping down to nothing and walk calmly through the metal detectors.

Dare I say it'd probably "go viral"...

Yeah I've thought that too. I'm not shy, they wanna see me nude, I got no problem droppin' trow.
Then the inevitable backlash and outrage from the puritans about "indecent exposure" would prove they care more about "decency", whatever the hell that means, than safety.

[bennymac]

"when that day comes, what's going to be the extra security measure that they take with "suspicious" passengers? i'd probably just refuse the scanner at that point so i'd at least get a reach-around when they check my prostate for c4."

The exact same argument could have been made when they started xraying luggage...yet no one today whines about that.

Like any issue worth discussing, this is not black or white. On one end of the spectrum is no security. Just let everyone on board and don't check anything.

The other end of the spectrum is full body cavity searches for everyone. Just because they xray random people now does not mean we're on a one way road towards that level of privacy invasion.

But if you -want- them to stick some fingers up your ass just tell them you put a bomb up there...no need to expose yourself to the xray to get your thrills

[bennymac]

Where in the constitution does it say that you should be allowed to ride a bike? Riding a bike is a privilege, not a right. After all, you are often times riding in public places- on public roads, sidewalks and trails.

If you want to ride a bike, you should be subject to pat downs by the police or any other government agent. It's not a right to ride a bike.

The constitution says something about unreasonable searches, but it doesn't expressly say "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized WHILE RIDING A BIKE."

You pussy's should stop whining and get with the program- riding a bike ISN'T A RIGHT. Fucking consent to the front-bottom pat down search. It isn't a problem if you've got nothing to hide! Quit your pussy "my rights are being infringe upon" bullshit!

If you wanted to sit down with the President for a chat in the oval office you'd probably be subjected to some pretty heavy security including background checks, criminal checks, interviews, xrays and pat downs. Makes sense right?

If you went to your kids elementary school for parent teacher night and they said you had to take off all your metal and have your jacket scanned and then have you walk through an xray scanner or have a pat down you'd find this unacceptable. As would anyone.

You follow where I'm going with this?

[grubbers]

[bennymac]

HAHAhahaha...fuck....that is funny. I give up, you win

[Pimpin Panda]

ha - nice!!!


People just need to STFU and get with the program....fucktards...yeah lets boycott and cause delays the day before thanksgiving.....stupid fucks..fine em all the $11K or whatever...

Fine him for what you anti american way taliban fuck? If you dont want to be assaulted, just leave. Now you want them to be fined $11,000?? Move to Afghanistan asshole

[Pimpin Panda]

People probably whined and cried bullshit when they first put in metal detectors and started xraying your luggage. I want my FREEDUM GODDAMMIT!

The TSA and their rent-a-cops know they just have to weather the hate for awhile until it dies down and these xray scanners become the norm.

Is this really an erosion of your freedom? Freedom to not have some fat chick in another room see your ballsack? Is that what you rally around the flag for?

I dont believe they really see your ballsack and cock. If they did I would be %100 against it. I suppose then that it is ok if I go up to your 18 year old hot daughter, and pull down her pants and panties to check out her snatch? It isnt. And if the x ray showed the same thing, it would be a violation of her rights. I do not believe the x ray shows that tho.

[Kevo]

If you wanted to sit down with the President for a chat in the oval office you'd probably be subjected to some pretty heavy security including background checks, criminal checks, interviews, xrays and pat downs. Makes sense right?

If you went to your kids elementary school for parent teacher night and they said you had to take off all your metal and have your jacket scanned and then have you walk through an xray scanner or have a pat down you'd find this unacceptable. As would anyone.

You follow where I'm going with this?

A bomb will not fly a plane into a building. Only a hijacker can. and these bullshit scanners will do nothing to stop knives from getting on planes. Locking cockpit doors, air marshals and a populous who now understands that hijackers want to fly planes into buildings prevent planes from being flown into buildings. Body scanners do not. We are not safer now than we were before.

I dont believe they really see your ballsack and cock. If they did I would be %100 against it. I suppose then that it is ok if I go up to your 18 year old hot daughter, and pull down her pants and panties to check out her snatch? It isnt. And if the x ray showed the same thing, it would be a violation of her rights. I do not believe the x ray shows that tho.

See the video summit posted, I believe on the last page.

[bennymac]

A bomb will not fly a plane into a building. Only a hijacker can. and these bullshit scanners will do nothing to stop knives from getting on planes. Locking cockpit doors, air marshals and a populous who now understands that hijackers want to fly planes into buildings prevent planes from being flown into buildings. Body scanners do not. We are not safer now than we were before.

So I shoot down the argument that it's not this huge grievous loss of freedom that everyone is shitting their pants about, or a whopping dose of radiation that will shrink your nutsack...and you retort with the argument that it wont change security.

Well putting scanners in all the major airports will probably cost you, as a taxpayer, about a penny. Maybe two pennies. Beyond the cost, what's it to you?

I do see that you countered the argument that they won't see you cock and balls...maybe thats what you're taking issue with? Dont' want anyone to see what you're packing?

[The AD]

A bomb will not fly a plane into a building. Only a hijacker can. and these bullshit scanners will do nothing to stop knives from getting on planes. Locking cockpit doors, air marshals and a populous who now understands that hijackers want to fly planes into buildings prevent planes from being flown into buildings. Body scanners do not. We are not safer now than we were before.

So you're saying terrorists never try to get bombs on planes?

As you mentioned, we've already put measures in place to thwart wackos with knifes. Measures also need to be taken to prevent bombs from getting on planes. I'm not saying these scanners are going to be 100% effective, but they seem like a good start to me.

[leifar]

Two important facts here:

1) My constitutional rights are NOT suspended when I enter an airport (presumption of innocence, see the 5th, 6th, and 14th amendments to our constitution if you are confused)

and all arguments on that issue suspended...

2)WE'RE STILL DOING IT WRONG!

http://www.huliq.com/10061/john-tyne...rity-better-us

[whiteroom]

If I was a terrorist, I'd be looking at the job Timothy McVeigh pulled off, why try to get on a plane at all? Seems kinda pointless to try to thwart airline security when subways, malls and schools have NO security whatsoever. I mean, why are we so concerned with airline security when any jackass can rent a UHaul with a fucking library card?

[Kevo]

So you're saying terrorists never try to get bombs on planes?

As you mentioned, we've already put measures in place to thwart wackos with knifes. Measures also need to be taken to prevent bombs from getting on planes. I'm not saying these scanners are going to be 100% effective, but they seem like a good start to me.

I was responding to Benny's post where he inferred that airport security is analogous to whitehouse security because planes can be flown into the whitehouse (or any other high profile target).

My (poorly worded) response was that steps have been taken to prevent people from hijacking planes, but that these new scanners won't be any more effective than what was already in place before. They also infringe upon our freedom, and I believe, our Fourth Amendment rights.

We all know it is very doubtful someone will be able to hijack and aircraft now that people know that they intend to fly the aircraft into a ground target. Bombs could still conceivably take down an aircraft, but these scanners now mean would be bombers need to shove some explosive up their ass, instead of strapping it to their leg. We are not safer, and the scanners and advanced pat downs now create more problems than they are worth.

2 million people fly in the US everyday. 9 years ago, some 3000ish people died as a result of terrorist attacks involving aircraft. A few hundred died on the plane. In 9 years, aircraft in the US have counted some 6.5 billion flyer days. The odds are astronomically low that you would be killed by a terrorist on a flight. Why the hell are people willing to give up so much for safety?

My point- full body scans and advanced pat downs are both unreasonable and ineffective. I believe that they violate fourth amendment rights.

Terrorism has a hell of a lot more to do with foreign policy than it does airport security, but most Americans will never understand that.

[T.S.A.]

Come on Kevo just let my guys touch your balls. Whats the big deal? are they small? are you embarrassed of them?

[ill-advised strategy]

right, every thing anybody does to do the right thing makes them less of a man. ...because of course being manly must mean you're a semi-retarded authoritarian douche.

[Kevo]

Come on Kevo just let my guys touch your balls. Whats the big deal? are they small? are you embarrassed of them?

You can touch em, so long as I don't have to pay you (I've never paid someone to play with my balls, and I don't intend to). I'd also prefer if you'd finish me off instead of the never ending foreplay->sendmeonmyway bullshit.

[T.S.A.]

You can touch em, so long as I don't have to pay you (I've never paid someone to play with my balls, and I don't intend to). I'd also prefer if you'd finish me off instead of the never ending foreplay->sendmeonmyway bullshit.

If you would have just walked through my machines (which you already payed for) I wouldn't have had to ask those questions.

pm sent on your offer

[bennymac]

I was not saying airport security was analogous to Whitehouse security. I was trying to show that different degrees of security are deemed appropriate given the situation. You would give up your 4th amendment rights when going to see the president, you wouldn't think that was reasonable when going to see your kids teacher.

Flying on a plane is somewhere in between...in the grey zone.

Have you ever seen a TSA agent open up your luggage and look through your underwear and bathroom stuff? How is this not an infringement on your right to privacy?

The fact is, someone can hide an explosive device on themselves. This is a fact. Our bodies have crevices and nooks and crannies. So in the interest of safety some fat chick in a room needs to see a black and white image of your choda. Get over it.

[T.S.A.]

So when the Doctor puts his cold hands on you directly and asks you to cough is he breaching your 4th amendment rights? No he's doing his job.