Thread: Nighttrains compare to Chetlers

Got a pair of bent chetlers rode them a bit this season and havent been totally sold on em like i thought i would. Great all around ski, but just not enough float and high speed turns. Great on groomers, around bumps and playing but i haven't found the sweet spot for ripping big turns. I have ate some shit hard with these skis, overpressing the front tip to turn and bitting in. Also in deep snow they dont float like i thought, had to sit back a lot.
i'm looking for a ski similary to this ski but with no tail rocker, better float and ability to stand on it and press at high speeds in pow. A ski that can handle speed but also nimble enough for the tight trees, shoots and bumps.

looking at the 186 night trains or 188 meggawatt.

if any of you have insight on these skis and could give me a little info on how they ride compared to chetlers that would be sweet.

ps. i know we have reviews of these skis here but found it difficult to compare. for info, skiing in PNW. so wet snow and nasty crud.
cheers.

Originally Posted by skibum.roberts

with no tail rocker

looking at the 186 night trains or 188 meggawatt.

???

Night trains are rockered higher in the tail than they are in the tip so that seems to have effectively eliminated them from your search before you even started.

There's a comparison here: [ame="http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2747111&postcount=16"]Teton Gravity Research Forums - View Single Post - Dukers' 10-11 one run ski reviews.[/ame]

What about a Czar? Similar flex to the Bent Chetler but much larger radius, very smooth in open space yet playful in tight spots. You will lose on hard snow, though.

DPS 112 RP in 190 is worth looking at.

Or a Lhasa Pow in 186.

I´ve never tried the Chetlers, but I had one season of the first years MW:s. One of the reasons that I decided to sell that ski (even if I really liked it overall) was that I had problems with overloading the tip in soft snow. If you go forward on the Megawatt in snow that is not superlight pow, but still really good "2-3 day after snowfall" snow, I experienced that the tip is too soft. The huge rocker tip allways stay on the surface, but the huge rocker also bends quite a lot more. In some point the rocker+the flex just becomes too high, and makes the ski tip overload and it feels like you almost hit something under the snow. After a while I learned what to avoid to not make it happen, but since I think that one of the major benefits of rockered skis is that you can really go down in a deep carving like stance in the pow, for me it was a huge drawback. I felt that I couldnt ski like I wanted to ski. Even if I could charge pretty much with the MW, I always had to hold back a bit especially in the end of the turn. To annoying in the long run, so I sold the skis. If you ski somewhat like I do, and it sounds like you might do that since you experienced some tip overload problems with the Chetlers, you should atleast try to take a test ride with the MW:s before buying.

Maybe BD went a bit stiffer in this or next years MW? The blue version have a lot more camber than my whites (my pair had a slight negative camber and a touch of tail rocker), but apart from that, are there any differences? A bit stiffer tip would improve the ski in my opinion.

Btw, after the MW I had a short 3 weeks try with the Sidestash 181, but that was just way to small for me. My current ski is the Fatypus I-Rock, but I havent tried it in good pow yet so I cant say anything about the performance in deep snow. I really liked it in spring conditions however. Surprisingly acceptable grip on the frozen groomers in the morning, excellent in the softer afternoon pistes, and playful and fun in the afternoon slush outside of the piste.

I agree about the Czar. In soft snow that is one of the most fun skis I have ever tried, without any of the nervous and 5-year-old-boys-plastic-toy-feeling of some of the JJ-clones. The straight sidecut makes it very reliable in high speed, and it is still super sweet in tight terrain with a poppy playful attitude. That feeling totally disappear as soon as you enter some hard groomers however. Then the ski is really boring and there is just no sidecut to work with. You can get down without having people stare and laugh. But its for sure not fun in the hardpack. But definately recommended to try, if you are mainly a skier that sees the groomers as a way to access real skiing.

I have a pair of the Bent Chetlers. Only a dozen or so days on them and I ski them here on the East Coast mostly in tight trees. I've had a blast on them and feel they excel for this purpose but agree they have a speed limit.
Also where did you mount them? I'm at -2.5cm and feel they are just about right. For me not an everday ski but fun.
A couple skis I was looking at but not sure which way to go are the ON3P Caylors or BG's. Plus there made right in your backyard and I'm sure are set up to handle the PNW snow. From the web site the Caylors might be the ticket for you. Just a thought.

http://on3pskis.com/?page_id=45

thanks all for the insight.

interesting to hear that MNo over flexed the tip of the MW. Would have thought this thing with so much rocker could just be pushed and not worry about tip dive.

my chetlers are mounted on the team line, so maybe moving them back a little could help, but with tail rocker theres not a lot to play with.

I own a pair of faty allota. super fun ski, great float with speed, but not fun when it gets tracked out or sticky groomers. Also skis to fat for steep skiing, just have to slide turn to get edge hold.

Czar looks fun, but i think 110 underfoot might not be fat enough for up here at baker.

yeah on3p looks good, haven't tried the skis but have friends who love em.

megawatts = big floppy donkey dicks

...and an additional hijack(sorry) comparison:
L'hasa(both glass/carbon) to a Bibby Pro....? (Haven't skied either...with good prices flying around).

Don't have chetlers, night trains or megawatts, but I do have S7's (similar design to chetlers) and solly rockers (similar design to megawatts). I also have a pair of czars, so I can also comment on them. One thing I've noticed about the S7's, and I think it will also turn up in other skis with a similar 'recurve' shape is a tendency to 'plow' in some (particularly variable) snow conditions. It isn't exactly the same thing as tip dive, since the tips never actually sink, but it has a similar effect (ski seems to tug at your foot when the snow density varies and doesn't like to 'plane up' smoothly). The czars, although a smaller ski with much less rocker seems much more predictable in variable snow, particularly at speed. The czars do lack in float until one gets up to speed though, particularly in deep heavy snow, and, although managable, aren't much fun on hardpack.

The solly rockers never lack for float and don't have any of the hookiness the other poster described about the megawatts. They are the best crud and variable snow ski I've ever skied extensively. (This list includes S7's, czars, XXL's, Lotus 120's and Lhasa Pow's). They are too wide and have too much tip rocker to be much fun on hard pack though.

Originally Posted by wcf3

Don't have chetlers, night trains or megawatts, but I do have S7's (similar design to chetlers) and solly rockers (similar design to megawatts). I also have a pair of czars, so I can also comment on them. One thing I've noticed about the S7's, and I think it will also turn up in other skis with a similar 'recurve' shape is a tendency to 'plow' in some (particularly variable) snow conditions. It isn't exactly the same thing as tip dive, since the tips never actually sink, but it has a similar effect (ski seems to tug at your foot when the snow density varies and doesn't like to 'plane up' smoothly). The czars, although a smaller ski with much less rocker seems much more predictable in variable snow, particularly at speed. The czars do lack in float until one gets up to speed though, particularly in deep heavy snow, and, although managable, aren't much fun on hardpack.

The solly rockers never lack for float and don't have any of the hookiness the other poster described about the megawatts. They are the best crud and variable snow ski I've ever skied extensively. (This list includes S7's, czars, XXL's, Lotus 120's and Lhasa Pow's). They are too wide and have too much tip rocker to be much fun on hard pack though.

That's some great info. I've tried Czars, S7s, Bentchetlers and Rockers and I can say you're dead on.

I just got some Night Trains and I think the rocker profile will combine performance of the S7/Bentchetler and the Salomons. They have an abrupt tail rocker but a long, low tip rocker that starts almost at the toe piece, and the shorter turn radius to help on hard snow. I have yet to try them but I think they'll be sweet.

"The solly rockers never lack for float and don't have any of the hookiness the other poster described about the megawatts. They are the best crud and variable snow ski I've ever skied extensively. "

what are the solly rockers, i've never heard of this term or ski?

Originally Posted by skibum.roberts

"The solly rockers never lack for float and don't have any of the hookiness the other poster described about the megawatts. They are the best crud and variable snow ski I've ever skied extensively. "

what are the solly rockers, i've never heard of this term or ski?

Really? Salomon Rocker: http://www.salomonfreeski.com/caus/s...ki/rocker.html

Originally Posted by D(C)

Really? Salomon Rocker: http://www.salomonfreeski.com/caus/s...ki/rocker.html

They also weigh about 30 lbs and have a turn radius of about 50m. I don't think it's the ski I'd want at Baker, with so many tight steep shots. It's a ski for whistler, big mtn. Night trains are pretty sick for baker, fairly light, fast, fat, and great float and loose feel in the deep.

Originally Posted by brown9

They also weigh about 30 lbs and have a turn radius of about 50m. I don't think it's the ski I'd want at Baker, with so many tight steep shots. It's a ski for whistler, big mtn. Night trains are pretty sick for baker, fairly light, fast, fat, and great float and loose feel in the deep.

The rockers certainly are heavy, although the most recent generation of them is supposedly not as bad as the older ones (which I own). The long turning radius is somewhat misleading though. Due to the large amount of front rocker, they can be turned very quickly by applying some tip pressure. With more forward weighting they will ski 'short'. With more neutral or back weighting they ski 'long'.

They are too wide to be a good everyday ski-area ski anywhere, but I've used them happily and often on powder days at Taos, which has about as much steep, tight terrain as you are going to find.

Here is some video shot on a powder day at Taos which should illustrate this:

Originally Posted by skibum.roberts

thanks all for the insight.

interesting to hear that MNo over flexed the tip of the MW. Would have thought this thing with so much rocker could just be pushed and not worry about tip dive.

my chetlers are mounted on the team line, so maybe moving them back a little could help, but with tail rocker theres not a lot to play with.

I own a pair of faty allota. super fun ski, great float with speed, but not fun when it gets tracked out or sticky groomers. Also skis to fat for steep skiing, just have to slide turn to get edge hold.

Czar looks fun, but i think 110 underfoot might not be fat enough for up here at baker.

yeah on3p looks good, haven't tried the skis but have friends who love em.

If you like the Fat-ypus Allota, but want something smaller, check out the Fat-ypus I-Rock or D-Sender.