Thread: Berthoud Photo/Conditions Thread (2009-2010)

plans for quandary fell through, might stop up there this morning on my way to wp. blue pathfinder, orange pants, snowboard.

Originally Posted by Enoch

^^^^^

Yep, I just got home but was up there doing a few laps around that time. Definetly fun conditions to play around on.

I think we saw you up there this morning- I was skiing with Donkey Punch (all green) and PowTron (yellow jacket)... I thought I recognized the dog from your posts. Next time we'll have to make some turns.

Originally Posted by smmokan

I think we saw you up there this morning- I was skiing with Donkey Punch (all green) and PowTron (yellow jacket)... I thought I recognized the dog from your posts. Next time we'll have to make some turns.

^^^ Pics, or it didn't happen

They're coming...

Originally Posted by smmokan

I think we saw you up there this morning- I was skiing with Donkey Punch (all green) and PowTron (yellow jacket)... I thought I recognized the dog from your posts. Next time we'll have to make some turns.

Next time for sure fellas! I was taking my girlfriend around up there for her first time so it was kind of a mellow day. However next time I head up with just me and the dog I'll give ya a shout!

I'm heading up there in the AM. Give me a shout if you see me...I'm recognizable.

So, before any sort of flaming starts, let me address this...

Yes, a well trusted ski buddy and I started a slide today. We were very aware that the slide may occur and we took the proper precautions and both of us were safe and sound.

MM (my ski buddy) and I were on a cliff band that comes off of a narrow spine. The snow around us was certainly suspect both for its depth (in the landing) and its stability. We discussed that it would be a good idea if only one of us hit the cliff while the other made a ski cut before posting up in a safe zone and provide beta on the landing. Since I had won the row-sham-bo earlier in the day, MM was the lucky one who got to hit the cliff. I made a ski cut on my way to the bottom of the cliff, and got no action out of it. Still not feeling super confident in the snow pack, I made sure my safe zone for probing the landing and taking pictures of MM hit the cliff was solid. I ducked directly underneath the skier's right side end of the cliff band that MM was hitting. I thought to myself, if anything above me slides, it will be funneled out to skier's right of this area by the spine MM was standing on. As it turns out, I was correct. Also, this provided a spot from which, if MM got slid upon his landing, I would be above him and ready to react quickly. The location in which I was standing had rock from the cliff band covered only by a few inches of snow. A few feet down the hill from where my feet were the snow pack was more than a pole's length deep.

I don't recommend this type of skiing or risk taking for those that aren't: 1) very well aware of what they're getting themselves into 2.) understand and have had experience in how to manage it well and 3) willing to accept the consequences in the case that your management isn't correct. MM and I have discussed this topic at length and we were both on the same page about it today.

Now, for what you've all been waiting for...pics and video from the day (video will be added later with slight view of the slide from MM's helmet cam, but it isn't that great). We didn't get the snow that was forecast, unfortunately, but we still had a good time up there.

The row-sham that I won only got me this


MM falling asleep in the pillows


MM take-off


MM landing, and remotely triggering the slide


slide pics:






Video...(I'm an idiot and misspelled "interesting")



Armchair quarterbacking on 2...hut, hut, hike.

no armchairing here, but can you give me an aspect and a location? for reference. also, did you call the caic or the grand county sheriff's office and let them know that there was a slide and that everyone was alright? if it is where i am thinking, it might be visible from the road.

^^^ agreed. that looks like the farthest out point on the 80's to me.

<Cracks can of Dales Pale>

I coulda set off a better avalanche than that.

Looks like good sized slide, how big was that crown? Also, did it slide out from under MM? You said he remotely triggered it so I was trying to spot the bomb hole from his landing, but I couldn't see it. It sounds like you guys had a plan and were well aware of the risks, so no quarterbacking from me.

More details for learning purposes would be much appreciated though.

Glad everyone is safe.

Sorry I didn't put more info in about the slide earlier...I was in a rush for an appointment. Yes, I am going to be sending in a report to the CAIC, just need some time to get it written up with more details and pics for them. Here are some more details for y'all:

Location: Skiers right in the 80's (yes, it is visible from the road)

Aspect: Almost exactly due north

Elevation: ~11,000'

Crown: Over 6' tall in some locations and in all locations over 3'.

Failure: The slide failed on old, rotten, faceted snow at the base of the snow pack. It was remotely triggered. The area on which MM actually landed cracked at the top (see right side below cliffs in last picture). Also, if you look closely at the largest part of the crown you can see my ski cut directly above it (see last picture). As I said before, after putting that cut in, and feeling the snow, it made me uneasy that it didn't move and I was still holding the snow suspect. This was not a new wind slab or new consolidated snow. It looked like nobody had skied this area or this cliff at all this season (if you have let me know). The surface snow was very soft and I didn't feel any crusts in it. It started to consolidate significantly more about 1.5-2' from the surface. At the very base of the snowpack it was rotten and faceted. Sorry the picture quality is not very good, but if you look closely enough you can see MM's landing and where I was standing in my safe zone.

Debrief: MM and I talked in depth afterwards about the slide. We discussed how well our plan was pre-slide and how well we reacted once it did slide. We determined that we did the have a good plan pre-slide. Post-slide the biggest thing that we determined that we needed to improve was MM's reaction time to get set up in the safe zone and have eyes on me so I could get out of the hang fire as quickly as possible. All-in-all, I think we handled it quite well. To be honest, I find the best way to gain respect for the mountains and avalanches is to experience things like this. Maybe it is not for everyone, but I certainly have a rejuvenated respect for what can happen in the mountains after today.

A few observations, not QB'ing: nice photos. I love the 80s, but I haven't seen tracks on that band this season. good to hear the LZ was deep enough because I rock checked there once in a similarly deep snowpack.

Did you know what the slope angle was in the LZ prior to dropping it? It's always scary to see propagation above you.

edit: forgot to say, the photo and details make me concerned about the melt/freeze season. Watch out for deep wet slides on the basal facets this spring!

Burly. ...

That huck looks big

Dug a pit yesterday on a NE aspect in current creek. About 20cm of facets lurking a meter down. Cut the slope expecting to see some action but no dice.

folks be stepping up for sure. saw a line down the middle of the knuckle Sat am and down the gut of Mines 2 today. nice looking turns. musta been thrilling to say the least.

Bump to say:
Video is up in my original post about the avy. First two clips are my helmet cam, third clip is MM's helmet cam. You get a glimpse of the avy in MM's clip, and you can also hear me say "That's why I was in that safe zone right underneath that rock."


garuda - Yes I was familiar with the slope angle in the LZ since I've done those cliffs before. I'm also concerned for the melt/freeze season in that particular zone. I think if it warms up quite a bit before the next big storm we can get some good moisture percolating into the deep layers hopefully it will help to heal some of that faceted stuff.

Good to see you guys had a fun, productive day. Great info and stoke as well. Jbski does it right. Education + experience= great skiing and coming home safe.

Originally Posted by quienes?

folks be stepping up for sure. saw a line down the middle of the knuckle Sat am and down the gut of Mines 2 today. nice looking turns. musta been thrilling to say the least.

We skied a couple laps on mines 2 on saturday, but not from the top. Snowpack was relatively stable below treeline, but there's definitely still some risk.

That is a great example of finding just the right trigger point for that deep instability that is still hanging out. There is a lot of new weight on the snow in the last few weeks and although it is getting better, there is still a very weak layer down at the facets. That area, more to lookers left, has probably had 20+ shots with the avalauncher from CDOT in the last few weeks too, and nothing remotely triggered or propagated over to that landing, just a few hundred pound skier huck in the right place got it to pop though. Well played, good to see people managing the deep and scary with their head on a swivel. You can claim that for sure, no one else will be hitting that this season without a LOT more snow.

Originally Posted by Tube Sag

That area, more to lookers left, has probably had 20+ shots with the avalauncher from CDOT in the last few weeks too, and nothing remotely triggered or propagated over to that landing,

^ That amazed me!!! The hole they put in the snow after last week's storm was like a hot tub!

I triggered a slide in that same spot about 3 or 4 years ago. I didn't get hurt but it sure scared the crap out of me. I don't recommend doing it either.

PS: I saw that crown going over the pass today, big and gnarly. Also saw the tracks down the fingers. Just all sorts of garbage pocket pulling out everywhere down to the rocks. Looked like a big nasty scary mess

MAJOR wind on the pass today. Around noon accumulation was maybe 6" but wind slabs everywhere in HHA even in the trees. Lots of cracking. Skied like either dust on crust or tough, barely breakable wind slab.

http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick...2=-105.775&e=0

Forecast just updated again...if this comes through, Wednesday and Thursday could be deep...but possibly pretty sketch.