detuning of rockered skis

[slashy]

hi,

I normally pay a lot of attention to bevels and detuning of the contact points on regular cambered skis.

I'm soon to be getting a tiprockered MTN freeride. Any hints were I should be detuning ?

what do you guys do on rockered skis ?

slashy

[gaijin]

I never detune anything.

Even my pow skis (mavens & goats) have 3 degrees with a diamond polishing.

"You don't need edges in pow."
"Right... like sharp and smooth edges actually hurt performance."

Tune as you're accustomed... just don't detune like a pansy. Sharpen that shit!!!

[karpiel]

Why detune anything, let alone a rocker?

[kidwoo]

Why detune anything, let alone a rocker?

Because depending on the tip/shovel shape, that rockered section can engage kind of suddenly when you lay the ski over on harder snow.


Most of the 'good' rockered tip skis have a taper in the tip so that the widest point is further back from the end of the ski than a traditional design. That's why.

I skied on some dynafit manaslus last weekend that have a rockered tip but without that exaggerated taper that's really evident on something like the rossi s7. Sure enough it got hooky when you layed it over far enough.

So detuning does make sense, but it just depends on the shape in my opinion.

[karpiel]

Because depending on the tip/shovel shape, that rockered section can engage kind of suddenly when you lay the ski over on harder snow.


Most of the 'good' rockered tip skis have a taper in the tip so that the widest point is further back from the end of the ski than a traditional design. That's why.

I skied on some dynafit manaslus last weekend that have a rockered tip but without that exaggerated taper that's really evident on something like the rossi s7. Sure enough it got hooky when you layed it over far enough.

So detuning does make sense, but it just depends on the shape in my opinion.

Now that you mention it I can see it happening once the ski is flexed, would also imagine if the tip was flapping around and suddenly decided to engage things could get fun.

[kidwoo]

would also imagine if the tip was flapping around and suddenly decided to engage things could get fun.

eggszachary

[Core Shot]

hi,


I'm soon to be getting a tiprockered MTN freeride.

that right there is a HUGE assumption on your part

Define "soon"

[slashy]

[QUOTE=kidwoo;2189695]Because depending on the tip/shovel shape, that rockered section can engage kind of suddenly when you lay the ski over on harder snow.


QUOTE]

that is exactly what I was thinking about.

[karpiel]

The first 6 inches of my obsethed came out the wrapper with completely dull edges. Just checked.

[AlpiNord]

Because depending on the tip/shovel shape, that rockered section can engage kind of suddenly when you lay the ski over on harder snow.


Most of the 'good' rockered tip skis have a taper in the tip so that the widest point is further back from the end of the ski than a traditional design. That's why.

I skied on some dynafit manaslus last weekend that have a rockered tip but without that exaggerated taper that's really evident on something like the rossi s7. Sure enough it got hooky when you layed it over far enough.

So detuning does make sense, but it just depends on the shape in my opinion.

You might consider increasing the base bevel and/or reducing the side bevel instead of de-tuning near the contact points.

[kidwoo]

Yeah but it's way easier to just run a gummi stone over them

[AlpiNord]

But harder to resharpen.

With a less grippy side edge bevel you can feather your edge into turns more smoothly.

(A general reminder: if you do increase base bevel, to reduce again base material needs to be removed.)

[kidwoo]

The thing is I'd never want that front part sharp. We're essentially talking about a ski that suddenly increases its edge contact in the middle of a hard turn. I'd like to reduce that effect as much as possible.

I don't ski rockered skis on non-snow days anyway so I just want something predictable for the hard snow sections that are inevitiable on snowier days.

But like I said before: I'm of the belief that a properly designed rocker ski never has this issue. My rockered skis are proplerly designed....I've just ridden some that weren't

[AlpiNord]

But like I said before: I'm of the belief that a properly designed rocker ski never has this issue. My rockered skis are proplerly designed....I've just ridden some that weren't

Good to know. Thanks.

[njfreeskier]

Bumping this thread rather than starting a new one, because it is pretty much along the lines of my question.

We're at the point now where people are skiing rockered/recurve/reverse camber/long shovel skis in a variety of conditions, and even skiing them on days when the snow conditions are essentially packed powder and pretty firm. I see a lot of people skiing skis like the obsethed, lhasa pows, ehps, czars, mo'ships, shoots, lotus 120s on a fairly regular basis and using them as their daily drivers unless its a really deep day. And now with skis like the gotama and vct getting rocker, and the jimi 110, the shogun, etc. hitting the market, it seems that even more people are going to be skiing rockered skis on a daily basis. This means that on those firmer days, people might/will be using rockered skis. And as previously alluded to, the rocker can cause tips to engage when not expected due to tip/tail shape.

Because depending on the tip/shovel shape, that rockered section can engage kind of suddenly when you lay the ski over on harder snow.

Most of the 'good' rockered tip skis have a taper in the tip so that the widest point is further back from the end of the ski than a traditional design. That's why.

So detuning does make sense, but it just depends on the shape in my opinion.

From what I've seen a lot of the narrower rockered skis (100-110) in the waist don't really have a tapered tip, and have more of a traditional shape, meaning that the ski can become unpredictably hooky.

Just looking for a general consensus on what mags are doing or plan on doing in regards of detuning their edges on their rockered skis this year. Especially those who ski them in most conditions.

[Vitamin I]

...Just looking for a general consensus on what mags are doing or plan on doing in regards of detuning their edges on their rockered skis this year. Especially those who ski them in most conditions.

Simple. Just sharpen up the whole edge with the same bevel as on your favorite skis. Then keep a quarter in your pocket on your first day, and detune as needed using that quarter if any edge parts catch in a way you don't like. Done. Obviously, dial it on 1-2 low-risk runs before you hit huge risky lines.

.

[SeatownSlackey]

Been staring at my new s7's trying to decide on a mounting point and have noticed that they shipped from the factory w/ a minimal amount of detuning on the tips. The new p4s i also picked up, have a factory detune all the way back to the taper point. I cant think of a single reason why i would want a sharp edge fore or aft of the taper point on the tips/tails and plan taking out the file for a few passes.

This was only thread out there on detuning and non trad shapes. I am overlooking anything?

[dannyboy]

i was wondering about this issue with the mansalu, obviously detuning tips is nessecary for most skis fresh from the factory to prevent hookyness, most people just have the guy at the shop do it... anyone detune their own mansalus? or have any issues with the factory tune? -- i've heard a few reviews of these skiis being a bit hooky, and i'm kinda suspecting they neglected the tip'de'tune, tricky i suppose causa the raised tip.

[Horu]

It's gotta be an icy hardpack day for me to leave my 196 lhasas home. I've got the splat recommended 1 and 1 bevel, I detuned a bit from the widest point of the tip forward, and just a touch at the end of the tail edge. No complaints .

[powdork]

skinned up to the top of red cliffs today. mostly corn but very firm up top. had brand new just mounted lhasa 191's and i was lost. the tip would catch and yank the whole ski into a rail and the tail wouldn't let it out so all of a sudden i'd be doing mach looney towards a tree. they sure handled the traverses well during the skin up though.

[Buzzworthy]

The thing is I'd never want that front part sharp.

By not detuning a newly sharpened cambered ski, I lost an ACL due to tip grab and swing ski opposite of the way the body was headed.

My new Maestos are gummied in the front.
My Scratches are filed in the front.

Been around a shop for many years when younger so I do what I need to on the planks.

I also detune my front and back sections of my snowboards, gummie style. They ride so much better this way.