GUNS!!!!!!!!

**waxman** · 10-25-2010, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by zion zig zag

http://primaryweapons.com/store/pc/home.asp

Looks like all of their rifles come with the beefed up/extended latch charging handle, which is a must upgrade on any AR without it. Other than that I don't know anything about them.

edit: as far as the gas operated platform, lots of companies offer it now and it seems to be nice.

all ARs in rifle calbers run on a "gas operated platform".....are you refering to piston type systems vs the original design?

**Fat City** · 10-25-2010, 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by waxman

all ARs in rifle calbers run on a "gas operated platform".....are you refering to piston type systems vs the original design?

^^^^Yes, sorry for the confusion. I am referring to the "AK" style, gas/piston AR platform, ala Robinson XCR.

**TNKen** · 10-25-2010, 02:19 PM

Tons of Gas Piston AR-15's now.

POF
Bushmaster
DPMS
Rock River
Heckler & Koch

Lots of piston conversion kits too.
Ares Defense
CCMG
Bushmaster
Osprey Defense
Adams Arms
LWRC

**zion zig zag** · 10-25-2010, 02:30 PM

Yep, meant piston.

Does that Robinson xcr only come with a folding stock? I think not being able to adjust LOP would be a deal breaker for me. I also wonder about part interchangeability over long term with the charging handle and forward assist being different than standard.

**Loon** · 10-25-2010, 04:47 PM

The HK417: If I wanted to spend the $3-4K for the rifle, lived in a machine gun friendly state, was willing to spend the extra $200 fill out form 4 and wait for the BTAF to process the paperwork. Are there really dealers that can get thier hands on these?

**zion zig zag** · 10-25-2010, 05:35 PM

You can't get a full auto rifle for 3 or 4K, and you don't need a form 4 for a semi auto rifle.

**MakersTeleMark** · 10-25-2010, 06:30 PM

Just got my Dad's 870TB set up for slug with a scope. Also a really cool 1930 Win model 59 22. Bought some ammo for them today as well.

**rugbydave** · 10-25-2010, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by CS

At least you have the hoops to jump through. Those hoops don't exist here.

I just got into the gun thing last spring and one thing I have learned real quick, owning and gun a living in California do not mix well.

Try owning guns and living in Canada... pistols and any AR variant/gun that looks scary or mean are all restricted, menaing we can own em but can only ever fire them at the range. Thank Jeebus for the M14 platform, it's not too scary looking to own

CS · 10-28-2010, 03:28 PM

Ok, so I got some extra cash the other day and have an itch for a new gun. Now, I'm new to the whole thing, having just gotten into it in March, but I'm freaking hooked. I have a 9mm semi, a Mossburg 500, AR 15 and 10/22, so you know where I'm coming from.

Here's the dilemma, I've been drooling over 1911's well, forever, but after the last shooting trip decided I wanted a bolt gun for far-away plinking and maybe possibly hunting (deer) at some point. So, most likely something in a .308. Now, I don't have THAT much cash, so I'm not looking at crazy high-end 1911's or bolt guns.

Basically, a local shop has a Springfield Mil-Spec that I've been eying. They also have a Remington 700 vtr, with a scope (don't know which), for around $600.

So, go with the 1911? The Remington? Is that a good gun for what I'm looking to do, or do I want something with a 24" barrel (I assume a longer barrel is better for shooting farther)? I've been checking out the Tikka T3 varmint, for example. Or is that too much gun for a total newb? Talk to me.

**Jer** · 10-28-2010, 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by CS

or do I want something with a 24" barrel (I assume a longer barrel is better for shooting farther)?

It depends on what your idea of "farther" is. Barrel length doesn't really come into play as far as accuracy is concerned, but longer barrels produce higher velocities (up to a point). If your idea of "farther" is 1000 yards then a longer barrel will keep your bullet from dropping below the dreaded sound barrier. Then of course you could also use a heavier bullet with a better ballistic coefficient. But 1000 yards is a hell of a long way - I wouldn't worry too much about barrel length.

I've been checking out the Tikka T3 varmint, for example. Or is that too much gun for a total newb? Talk to me.

No. Shooting is really not all that hard and it's a lot easier if you have a decent rifle. Tikkas are very very good rifles especially for the price. Very accurate right out of the box (bedding the action never hurts tho) and IMO the best production trigger around.

CS · 10-28-2010, 05:11 PM

So Jer, if barrel length isn't that big of a deal, should I go with the Remington vtr the shop has?

**Jer** · 10-28-2010, 05:26 PM

Well - they are nice rifles. I don't get the triangle-shaped barrel and the trigger is a bit heavy, but that's pretty minor - while I don't see any advantage to the weird barrel shape, I guess I don't see any real disadvantage either. And although the triggers are a little heavy they break clean. Unless you're getting a .308, the integrated muzzle break isn't necessary, but then again it's not gonna have any negative effects with milder-recoiling calibers either.

**TNKen** · 10-29-2010, 08:50 AM

You can always get a competition heavy barrelled upper for the AR-15 and achieve good distance results with good ammo, Federal Gold Medal Match. Some uppers are capable of 1/2 MOA shooting with the right barrel, bolt, upper combo. Unfortunately, the upper is probably $600 plus optics.

1911's are a great gun. Everyone needs at least one. I vote 1911.

Real question is what will you have the opportunity to shoot more? Which will you enjoy more? If you don't have access to a 300 yard range without an hour drive, realistically how many times will you get to distance shoot. On the other hand, if you can pistol plink 15 minutes away, seems like this would be a better option for the fun factor.

Ken

**Phall** · 10-29-2010, 09:35 AM

Is it a bad thing to be falling in love with Kimber firearms? I think they are beautiful. Now, if i had 1500 bucks lying around, Id have an Ultra Crimson Carry II.

CS · 10-29-2010, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by TNKen

1911's are a great gun. Everyone needs at least one. I vote 1911.

Can you talk to my wife?

As for range time, well, I'm not a huge fan of just going inside and shooting paper, so usually any time I go shoot it's about an hour drive to blm land to shoot fun targets that explode, shatter, disintegrate etc. (and yes, we clean up all our crap when done), so yeah, the bolt gun would be shot just as often as a 1911.

And really, I'll probably get a 1911 down the line anyways, so I guess this comes down to whether I should jump on that Remington the shop has.

Plus, I'm worried I'd become like Viva, get one 1911 and start ditching other guns to get more. I like the variety.

**bio-smear** · 10-29-2010, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Jer

It depends on what your idea of "farther" is. Barrel length doesn't really come into play as far as accuracy is concerned, but longer barrels produce higher velocities (up to a point). If your idea of "farther" is 1000 yards then a longer barrel will keep your bullet from dropping below the dreaded sound barrier. Then of course you could also use a heavier bullet with a better ballistic coefficient. But 1000 yards is a hell of a long way - I wouldn't worry too much about barrel length.

No. Shooting is really not all that hard and it's a lot easier if you have a decent rifle. Tikkas are very very good rifles especially for the price. Very accurate right out of the box (bedding the action never hurts tho) and IMO the best production trigger around.

This is all good info. I'd add that going shorter to 20" even reduces "barrel whip" while making a more compact rifle..if you're a carbine fan. I've got a Savage Model 10 Precision Carbine which came with a pretty nice, pre-bedded stock, but I really don't have any illusions about shooting 1000 yards with it.

**khakis** · 11-01-2010, 08:57 PM

So it looks like a couple police depts are getting rid of their Rem 700 PSSs over the whole safety issue...any idea where these decommissioned pieces might pop up for sale cheap? Same places you find cop turn-in glocks?

**DeepHelmet** · 11-01-2010, 10:19 PM

That's a pretty good guess. Find out who the Glock (or whatever handgun your local PD uses) distributor is in the area, that would be a good place to start.

**Jethro** · 11-02-2010, 05:21 PM

Is the Remington 700 problem in the bolt or is it something an aftermarket trigger or safety could correct. I first heard of this problem watching some investigative news show last week.

**Skipig25** · 11-02-2010, 05:29 PM

I guess it's with the saftey.

"According to an internal Remington memo, the actual sequence required to make a gun malfunction, or "trick," is to place the safety between the "safe" and "fire" positions, pull the trigger, and then place the safety in the "fire" position - which causes affected guns to fire."

**Jer** · 11-02-2010, 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by Jethro

I first heard of this problem watching some investigative news show last week.

Me too. It blew my mind - especially since I've never heard of this problem before the show.

I can't remember the last time I used a safety on a bolt rifle.

**khakis** · 11-02-2010, 06:59 PM

From what I've been reading it is common in ones that are super old/worn and ones that have had the factory trigger lightened a lot, something about sear contact. I can't get either of mine to do it, and one's had the trigger lightened (only to 3lb though) and the other has an aftermarket trigger.

**Jumper Bones** · 11-03-2010, 02:00 AM

Originally Posted by Skipig25

I guess it's with the saftey.

"According to an internal Remington memo, the actual sequence required to make a gun malfunction, or "trick," is to place the safety between the "safe" and "fire" positions, pull the trigger, and then place the safety in the "fire" position - which causes affected guns to fire."

Said report was from Bozeman too. Even went to Yellowstone Gateway Sports for interviews.

**TNKen** · 11-03-2010, 08:26 AM

I've got a couple with light triggers and no problem.

If they didn't want you adjusting the triggers, then they shouldn't have put trigger adjustment screws on the trigger housing!!

.

**zion zig zag** · 11-03-2010, 08:34 AM

TNKen, where do you shop for uppers/barrels? I'm looking for a 10.5" upper for an m4 and I've looked at Larue, Daniel, Noveske etc and I was just wondering if there was a good online one-stop store that I'm missing.