Specific Unanswered Gulmarg Questions

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-08-2009, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by samthaman

So, I basically made a list of every question...
Travel:
- Visa procedure ( and cost etc.)
- Visa length (possible to extend?)
- Airfare, fastest, cheapest, group...layovers...

LINK

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-08-2009, 12:02 PM

POST: SWISS SKIER TO PROMOTE GULMARG (Original article here).

"Skier of the Impossible" Sylvain Saudan consulted by J&K Tourism officials regarding helicopter skiing in Kashmir.

There has been talk of this for years - I'll believe it when I see it as it's a risky venture for little profit. Supposedly permits were issued for last winter, but no operator actually stepped to the plate. At least one established operator from NZ came to Gulmarg for an exploratory visit, and a start-up operator, Gulmarg Powder Guides, claims to be in position to fly this winter. Their pitch and contact info are located in this prospectus.

Some argue that a helicopter is unnecessary, as in this article. (Claim Alert: The lazy high traverse across Shaggy's Face in the second photo is my line. Great snow conditions on 23 March '09, but I was wary of it earlier in the season as this aspect released in Feb '07, killing a young Australian man).

Sylvain Saudan - "The Father of Extreme Skiing" in Ski Peru:

**samthaman** · 08-08-2009, 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by Hugh Conway

sweet jesus you are anal

get visa here:
https://indiavisa.travisaoutsourcing.com/homepage

plane ticket here:
http://www.kayak.com

maps here
http://earth.google.com/

quite clearly the concept of India, and Kashmir, haven't quite penetrated yet.

I'm really hoping to get out of the resort for much of this trip and it seems that there is very little information on backcountry skiing available. I'm happy to wing it once I'm there, but I'd like to go into the trip with as much info as possible, so I don't leave having missed something due to lack of planning.

Plane tickets are worth looking into past kayak as well. If a bunch of us are going over a group rate could be cheaper, same with a hotel in Delhi if we have to layover there.

If you think google earth cuts it for BC skiing beta, I don't really want to go BC skiing with you...

PS: just found airfare for $1435 from BTV to Srinigar (sp) jan 5- apr 5

Bolton - Are you around VT this summer?

Hugh Conway · 08-08-2009, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by samthaman

If you think google earth cuts it for BC skiing beta, I don't really want to go BC skiing with you...

I pointed you to an accurate, updated, accessible map of Kashmir and the Indian mountains because it's the best source I've found, not because I think it's sufficient for BC skiing. Here's another wankers thoughts on that since you seem to refuse to believe what anyone here has to say:
http://www.alpinetouring.com/Archive.htm

Gulmarg isn't a resort. It's about as far from a resort as you can get.

You are going to India. In person every price is negotiable. For everything. Everywhere. Even justice.

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-08-2009, 06:07 PM

POST: AVALANCHE AT GULMARG

14 February 2009 - Avalanche Trajectory A:

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-09-2009, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by samthaman

PS: just found airfare for $1435 from BTV to Srinigar (sp) jan 5- apr 5

LINK. Duration = 36 hours, 40 minutes

flying through Mumbai.

Prefer to fly JFK-DEL and layover 2-3 days before flying to SXR. Made the mistake of booking JFK-DEL-SXR all in one go before

!

DEL-SXR is the most unpredictable leg of the journey in January as both landing fields will be fucked up, DEL by fog, and SXR by snow, so flying through Mumbai or Chennai can be a good choice. DEL-SXR is about USD$60 O/W.

**allenataylor** · 08-10-2009, 07:02 AM

VISAS:

Requirements for a travel visa: https://indiavisa.travisaoutsourcing...uidelines?id=1

Cost: https://indiavisa.travisaoutsourcing...ular-fees?id=1
Looks to be $73

I'm also looking into travel and rescue insurance. Anyone have any experience with insurance? The main thing I am wary of is that some of the insurers don't cover rescue related to "extreme or high risk activities."

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-10-2009, 08:05 AM

Originally Posted by allenataylor

I'm also looking into travel and rescue insurance. Anyone have any experience with insurance? The main thing I am weary of is that some of the insurers don't cover rescue related to "extreme or high risk activities."

Keep looking in the US - I don't think you will find it (most insurers will not cover you in Kashmir, nor many other places where the US Dept of State has issued a travel advisory or ban). I noticed that many of the Swiss at Gulmarg had insurance that was valid, issued by a European firm, with decent travel insurance coverage, not sure about rescue service.

Travelex Insurance Services

**mc_roon** · 08-10-2009, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by boltonoutlaw

DEL-SXR is about USD$60 O/W.

Ding Ding Ding. just book USA-DEL RT here in the states, and then book DEL-SXR when you get there, does cost 60-100. Unless your going on miles, then some airlines have codeshares that can get you all the way there.

ive found flights for ~1000 RT from SLC-DEL (SLC/CHI/DEL) but im poor and dont know if i will be going again this year...

if i end up going, i will be going direct from DEL to SXR with no layover on the way into Srinagar. Most international flights from the US land in Delhi between 12AM and 4AM, its easy to just switch terminals and keep on going with a 9am flight out if the weather cooperates.

**mc_roon** · 08-10-2009, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by boltonoutlaw

Keep looking in the US - I don't think you will find it (most insurers will not cover you in Kashmir, nor many other places where the US Dept of State has issued a travel advisory or ban). I noticed that many of the Swiss at Gulmarg had insurance that was valid, issued by a European firm, with decent travel insurance coverage, not sure about rescue service.

Travelex Insurance Services

I figured it out for when i was there. It was a policy from AIG that covered Kashmir and extreme sports. Ill try to dig up details, but between my medical insurance and this supplemental plan i was fairly well covered, including 1million in evac insurance to a hospital of my choosing, anywhere in the world(you do NOT want to go to an indian hospital for a knee injury...)

**samthaman** · 08-10-2009, 11:20 AM

thanks for the input matt. So you might not make it this year?

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-10-2009, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by mc_roon

...if the weather cooperates...

Been stuck in Delhi twice for two days, so I'm over the straight shot - good luck!

Insurance: IHI Bupa, Danmark

ihi Bupa is a world leader in the field of international health and travel insurance. We offer individual and corporate customers a variety of health and travel insurance plans.

**mc_roon** · 08-10-2009, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by samthaman

thanks for the input matt. So you might not make it this year?

I have to 1)be able to fund it and 2)be healthy enough

Im biking a lot getting my strength back( im probably 15lbs heavier then when you last saw me) but healing slow. My knee should be in 'good' shape and my back is fine. Even if i book all the flights and everything, the final go/no go decision wont be made until mid-december when i get my 1 year surgical anniversary CAT scan that will tell me if my back is fully fused. Everything looks good as of now, just have to hope it stays that way.

If i can be there, i will be there.

**thin cover** · 08-10-2009, 06:34 PM

HC is right, everything there is negotiable "sab kuch milega bhaiya" is a phrase that is your friend. Gulmarg is nothing like a resort in fact you would be hard pressed to find a resort in Himachal Pradesh or Kashmir. Although you can get a nice house boat on the lake, nice being relative. Common rule there is take the first price given to a white man and multiply it by .10 and that is the local price. I would not venture into any serious BC there unless things have significantly changed since 2002 or you are with a guide and there are guides, plenty of lift accessed side country.

You have the completely wrong idea of this part of India if you think you can just go galabanting around the joint. This is not Utah or CO. I went sans vaccinations and was fine or lucky. Additionally, if you really want to see the Himalayas and a much more bad ass part and that which is set up for the intrepid tourist, I would suggest going to Pohkara, Nepal and doing the Annapurna circuit. Guest houses and camping available along the whole circuit. You have the whole Annapurna range, Dhaulagiri, Manapati, Nilgiri Annapurna, Annapurna II, etc. Plenty of mountaineering to do and trekking. Getting lost in that kind of terrain is no fun. I can tell you from experience, I was lost for 8 days in Tibet after getting hijacked by some rogue tibetans, who promised a ride but ultimately wanted money and dropped us off in the middle of no where with a British Mountaineer who claimed he knew his shit.

Apparently Soudain is really doing the heli op there, I ski with a 70year old instructor from time to time and he is good friends with Soudain and was invited out there this summer to survey the terrain.

Can't help on flights since I came in from China>Tibet>Nepal all overland. Which of course is the cheapest. Delhi is a bad ass city and I would suggest spending time there. I would like to go again this winter but never been to Japan and that is the plan. Good Luck!

Edit: forgot to add that you can get a 15 day transit visa for free once you get to India. Just go to the embassy in Delhi. I think it is a class E visa if I remember correctly. I had to extend my stay. So if you are only going for 2 weeks this is the cheapest and easiest option.

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-13-2009, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by boltonoutlaw

Probably a chance this will happen, but I remain a skeptic:
POST: GULMARG TO GET NEW CHAIRLIFT

Construction to start in July on a lift from Kongdoori to Mary's Shoulder of Affarwat...

UPDATE: Work on chairlift at Gulmarg to begin soon: Jora

Srinagar, Aug 13 (PTI) Jammu and Kashmir tourism minister Nawang Rigzin Jora today said the work on installation of chairlift at the 20,000 feet Kongdori in Gulmarg health resort in north Kashmir would start soon.

Jora asked the state cable corporation to take up the installation of chairlift at the earliest, incorporating suggestions made by several experts from time to time in this regard.

**boltonoutlaw** · 08-13-2009, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by thin cover

...I would not venture into any serious BC there unless things have significantly changed since 2002 or you are with a guide and there are guides, plenty of lift accessed side country...
Getting lost in that kind of terrain is no fun. I can tell you from experience, I was lost for 8 days...

In one hand, a cautionary tale:
The 2007 Kashmir Winter Report, by Ptor Spricenieks.

In the other hand, the payoff. POV by Anthony Bonello:

**andrewmc** · 08-13-2009, 05:38 PM

I've now booked flights, accomadation and a bunch of other shit!

Flights: London to Delhi return was £380 with BA

Delhi to Srinagar return was £90 a piece, could have got it a little cheaper but the credit card would not work with kingfisher.

Accomadation: in fairness to Bolton and others here who have connections with different companies that go there I'm not going to say what I paid. I paid more than the cheapest but far less than the most expensive. My decision was based on my need for assurance and may or may not prove to be a good one.

Costs: I'm budgeting a further £300 or so for vaccinations though that becomes cheaper if I get the twinrix Hep combination or whatever its called.

Vaccinations (ignore the costs they are out of my multi-page document of shit to take and organise):

Malaria £44 / Private / Malerone £7 per day
Hep A £48.50 / No Charge / Travel outside Northern Europe Twinrix is free and includes Hep B - £55
Typhoid £27.5 / No Charge
Polio £25 / No Charge
Yellow Fever £55 / £50 / £47
Hep B £42 / 3 doses at 40 per dose (free outside Northern Europe Twinrix)
Japanese Encp £47 / 3 doses at 43 per dose / £54 per dose
Rabies £47 / 3 doses at 43 per dose / £43 per dose
Tetnus £ / No Charge
MMR £47 / No Charge

Insurance is with the Austrian Alpine Club at £38 per year and covers Gulmarg

budget for trip will be £20 per day which by all accounts should be sufficient to cover lunch and beverages or miscellaneous expenses, trips to srinagar or overnight in delhi before or after............

I am willing to be corrected on that last figure and have seen numbers far lower than that but for my budget thats what I am working to.

Additional costs that are not figured in to this:

new powder skis £500
excess luggage £50
trips to / from airport £100
New kit ~£500+

Theres a shit load of miscellaneous expenses that are being eaten up by this trip, not least a week in Chamonix for Xmas.

Second time round I think it can be done for less.

**xyz** · 08-13-2009, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by samthaman

I'm really hoping to get out of the resort for much of this trip and it seems that there is very little information on backcountry skiing available. I'm happy to wing it once I'm there, but I'd like to go into the trip with as much info as possible, so I don't leave having missed something due to lack of planning.

Plane tickets are worth looking into past kayak as well. If a bunch of us are going over a group rate could be cheaper, same with a hotel in Delhi if we have to layover there.

If you think google earth cuts it for BC skiing beta, I don't really want to go BC skiing with you...

PS: just found airfare for $1435 from BTV to Srinigar (sp) jan 5- apr 5

samthaman, stop being such a pussy and just book a ticket, get your shots and insurance and leave the rest up to adventure. that is why your going isn't it? besides, its india, the minute you step off the plane all your anal planning will be fucked.

**allenataylor** · 08-14-2009, 05:24 AM

Originally Posted by xyz

samthaman, stop being such a pussy and just book a ticket, get your shots and insurance and leave the rest up to adventure. that is why your going isn't it? besides, its india, the minute you step off the plane all your anal planning will be fucked.

**AKPogue** · 08-14-2009, 11:12 AM

I recall that you can get rescue insurance from the American Alpine Club if you are a member?

Hugh Conway · 08-14-2009, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by AKPogue

I recall that you can get rescue insurance from the American Alpine Club if you are a member?

The Austrian Alpine Club insurance is better, cheaper and you don't need to live in Austria.

Yellow Fever vaccine? There's no Yellow Fever risk in India - Yellow Fever is in S. America and Africa.

**AKPogue** · 08-14-2009, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by Hugh Conway

The Austrian Alpine Club insurance is better, cheaper and you don't need to live in Austria.

Really, so some yank can join and get the insurance?

**thin cover** · 08-14-2009, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Hugh Conway

The Austrian Alpine Club insurance is better, cheaper and you don't need to live in Austria.

Yellow Fever vaccine? There's no Yellow Fever risk in India - Yellow Fever is in S. America and Africa.

not only that you going to region where it is winter, it is not like being in Goa or Kerala during monsoon season. At lot less risk of disease.

**gpcharles** · 08-14-2009, 12:34 PM

wow this thread is a mix of quality kashmir beta, confusing as hell multiple currency price estimates, pissing matches about who is the coolest "winging-est" manliest badass-est traveler (pst: planning for a trip is not only for pussies), and legitimate regret that it sounds like matt won't make it back there....

i guess it's just another usual TGR shitshow... lol (PS: naturally HC is involved)

Hugh Conway · 08-14-2009, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by gpetrics

wow this thread is a mix of quality kashmir beta, confusing as hell multiple currency price estimates, pissing matches about who is the coolest "winging-est" manliest badass-est traveler (pst: planning for a trip is not only for pussies), and legitimate regret that it sounds like matt won't make it back there....

i guess it's just another usual TGR shitshow... lol (PS: naturally HC is involved)

good thing we have you to sum everything up gpetrics