BD Quadrant vs. Scarpa Mobe

[DoWork]

Looking for a stiff 4-buckle touring boot that's LT compatible for this year and would love some comparable info on these two sexy slippers if anyone has any. Obviously the fit is different and wholly dependant on the individual skier but besides that, has anyone skied both (not likely but hey, you never know) that can comment on comparative downhill flex and range of motion uphill? As far as I can tell, the BD toe pieces are slightly more forward mounted and the liner includes the BOA reel (I love BOA) so you can adjust your liner without unbuckling the whole boot, but besides that they seem to be pretty similar in stiffnes and downhill performance on paper.

For me, I want a downhill boot that happens to tour effectively and can do so in Low Tech bindings. AFD plate for DIN bindings would be nice too, but not absolutely necessary, so what say you, oh wise sages of TGR? :yourock:

Thanks in advance for anyone with info on either. The more I look at them, the more confused I get :biggrin: and could use someone who knows what they're talking about to help me weigh their particular attributes accordingly.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

I recommend adding Titans to that list. BD's first attempt at AT boots (Factors) was very popular but I thought they were weaker than the competition (heavy, poor range of motion in walk mode, some fragile parts). The new line is lighter, but I wouldn't jump on a pair until there were some positive impartial reviews (Lee Lau?). Scarpa, Garmont and Dynafit have been doing this well for a while. Why look elsewhere? Scarpas come with Intuition liners which is a big bonus (especially over the Garmont liners), but some (including me) prefer the feel of the overlap style of Radiums and Titans.

[wilcox510]

I have not skied either, but I have tried them both on. I've been in Factors for two years and like the way they ski, but I dont like how heavy they are or the lack of rearward range of motion for touring. The fit on the Quadrant was really disappointing to me. Much higher volume than Factors in the forefoot and the ankle area. They don't seem super stiff too me, maybe like Spirit 4 or something. Rearward motion is better than Factors but not great. The Mobe seems about the same as Factors are far as stiffness, and rearward range of motion (not much rearward motion at all). I was a bit confused on the sizing, I tried on a 25.5 which should be the same as the 26 (assuming Scarpa didn't change that) and it fit a fair bit smaller in length and volume than other Scarpas I have tried on. It was also quite a bit lighter than the Factors. So my on the carpet comparison is... Mobe will likely ski better, Quadrant may tour a bit better.

[lynchdogger]

Thanks in advance for anyone with info on either. The more I look at them, the more confused I get :biggrin: and could use someone who knows what they're talking about to help me weigh their particular attributes accordingly.

You are asking an awful lot from this collection of misfits! :D

Seriously. I'm interested because I'm in same boat as you - looking for new touring boots that are dynafit compatible! I'll be lurking.

[laseranimal]

Do Work you're looking for the Salomon Quest, Salomon's PR monkeys say its the best AT boot ever designed!!!:rolleyes:


Getting back on topic, I think you're looking Titan, Mobe, Quadrant, Radium, Skookum, Axon, ZZeus as your beef boots.

You also mentioned that you don't want or need a DIN plate so I'm assuming that you're going to keep your alpine boots. If thats the case I don't understand the need for alpine boot stiff that uses Low Tech. The whole point of going to Low Tech is that you don't have to pay a huge weight penalty on the way up, running a heavy, alpine boot stiff boot is somewhat counter-intuitive to the point of lightweight AT gear.

If you're looking for a real "touring" friendly boot to pair up with Low Tech bindings I'd look at something similar to the Zzero or Spirit 4. I was rocking my Zzero's the day I skinned up and snagged 1st tracks on Redline and used jedi powers to grab 4th chair I was shocked that I was able to keep up with UNM and TC on their heavier gear. Yes my speed limit was a lot lower then when I'm in Alpine gear and I'm not sure I would have been able to go Redline/Blackline lap for lap with them all day but I certainly wasn't in danger of getting dropped because I couldn't keep up for 2-3 runs

As always your results may vary...............

[DoWork]

You also mentioned that you don't want or need a DIN plate so I'm assuming that you're going to keep your alpine boots. If thats the case I don't understand the need for alpine boot stiff that uses Low Tech. The whole point of going to Low Tech is that you don't have to pay a huge weight penalty on the way up, running a heavy, alpine boot stiff boot is somewhat counter-intuitive to the point of lightweight AT gear.

Well yeah, that's kind of what I'm going for... I like having my stiff boots, but skinning in my Lange 130s absolutely manhandles my feet. If I could slap a pair of low techs and a walk mode in my boots I have now, that would be about perfect. ;) Thanks for the list tho!

I guess I just don't want to compromise the downhill for any reason, and it seems the best way to get the touring capabilities I want while having that stiffness is to go LT. I'm not stressing the extra few OZs the stiff boots will bring, I just want to tour better and still smash kittens on the downhill.

[Christopher3000]

Titans and Factors are the stiffest touring boots available, with perhaps the ridiculously named Scarpa Mobes competing in this category. If you're simply looking for a boot that allows the use of a dynafit/onyx, shop for one of these.

On the other hand, boots with walk modes, less forward lean, softer plastic and shorter cuffs will never ski like alpine boots, and even the biggest touring boots have these characteristics. Relative to Langes or whatever you're used to, touring boots ALL feel upright, mushy and above all, unnatural. Lots of people get the biggest touring boots they can find because they think they're fucking rad, and to be fucking rad its important to have really stiff boots. If you really are going to go out in the backcountry and make 100m radius turns, take big air, wave your huge dick at all the chump-ass wiggle turners as they fly past you on the uphill, lap after lap, and then blog about it, getting a boot that fits your feet well will aid you in this quest to a greater extent than getting a "stiffer than my cock gets when I'm scoping my GoPro footy" boot. To this end, try on not only Titans and Factors, but also Radiums, Quadrants, Zzeros, Mastraels, Skookums, those Dalbello thingies, and anything else besides a randonee race boot. A slight sacrifice in "stiffness" made in the name of fit will give you a boot that skis more naturally, and this will make a bigger difference when it comes to adapting from your big cock resort boots to your touring boots than simply trying to get something stiff.

I, for one, really enjoy my Dobermanns, and spent a lot of the last winter trying to get used to Titans in the backcountry. I got Titans because they fit really well, and out of the box they seemed like they'd let me rip so hard my dick would swell up and chicks heads would pop off and stuff. Prior to Titans, I'd skied in a variety of Scarpa T1/race tele boots, which have a really excellent natural flex pattern, and for a long time the Titans--which are sort of artifically stiff through the first portion of the flex pattern only to turn to butter after a certain amount of pushing--just didn't feel right. By the end of May, after a 150+ season with about 40 touring days, I was really liking the Titans, but I'm pretty sure its because I put my Nordica's away in early april and ski the touring boots exclusively.

Which brings me to my second point about touring boots. If you don't ski them often, they will always suck. By this I mean, if you ski seven days a week, one day a week in some floppy Factors will frustrate you. If you ski on the weekends, taking out your touring gear twice a month will suck big time. These boots all ski much, much better after they've been flexed for about 30 days of skiing, and they are much more predictable feeling if you make yourself ski them a lot.

This winter, I'm considering ditching the alpine boots altogether for the Titans, and getting something actually lightweight for touring, because I'm pretty sure I can get used to having a little(or a lot) less boot, especially when it comes to skiing in the BC and wanting to feel accustomed to my gear. A few of the guys i most admire as skiers get a pair of touring boots and ski the piss out of them every day, all winter, and get so accustomed to those boots it doesn't matter to them that they arent' in race boots anymore. For what its worth, one of them skied Quadrants for much of last winter and loved them...

[LeeLau]

^^^^^ Christopher - classic! can i use some of those quotes in reviews? I'm going to try some Mobes. Not too interested in trying the BD line of boots unless I have some compelling reason

[Christopher3000]

Lee--go right ahead, although I think bros-with-dick-size-complexes jokes are best made with spontaneity and should be a staple for people doing reviews of touring gear. I have palpated the BD efficiency line somewhat extensively and I think they seem like awesome boots. Unfortunately they're high volume and I'm pretty sure I could pull my skinny feet directly out of a fully-buckled pair.

[DoWork]

Titans and Factors are the stiffest touring boots available, with perhaps the ridiculously named Scarpa Mobes competing in this category. If you're simply looking for a boot that allows the use of a dynafit/onyx, shop for one of these.

On the other hand, boots with walk modes, less forward lean, softer plastic and shorter cuffs will never ski like alpine boots, and even the biggest touring boots have these characteristics. Relative to Langes or whatever you're used to, touring boots ALL feel upright, mushy and above all, unnatural. Lots of people get the biggest touring boots they can find because they think they're fucking rad, and to be fucking rad its important to have really stiff boots. If you really are going to go out in the backcountry and make 100m radius turns, take big air, wave your huge dick at all the chump-ass wiggle turners as they fly past you on the uphill, lap after lap, and then blog about it, getting a boot that fits your feet well will aid you in this quest to a greater extent than getting a "stiffer than my cock gets when I'm scoping my GoPro footy" boot. To this end, try on not only Titans and Factors, but also Radiums, Quadrants, Zzeros, Mastraels, Skookums, those Dalbello thingies, and anything else besides a randonee race boot. A slight sacrifice in "stiffness" made in the name of fit will give you a boot that skis more naturally, and this will make a bigger difference when it comes to adapting from your big cock resort boots to your touring boots than simply trying to get something stiff.

I, for one, really enjoy my Dobermanns, and spent a lot of the last winter trying to get used to Titans in the backcountry. I got Titans because they fit really well, and out of the box they seemed like they'd let me rip so hard my dick would swell up and chicks heads would pop off and stuff. Prior to Titans, I'd skied in a variety of Scarpa T1/race tele boots, which have a really excellent natural flex pattern, and for a long time the Titans--which are sort of artifically stiff through the first portion of the flex pattern only to turn to butter after a certain amount of pushing--just didn't feel right. By the end of May, after a 150+ season with about 40 touring days, I was really liking the Titans, but I'm pretty sure its because I put my Nordica's away in early april and ski the touring boots exclusively.

Which brings me to my second point about touring boots. If you don't ski them often, they will always suck. By this I mean, if you ski seven days a week, one day a week in some floppy Factors will frustrate you. If you ski on the weekends, taking out your touring gear twice a month will suck big time. These boots all ski much, much better after they've been flexed for about 30 days of skiing, and they are much more predictable feeling if you make yourself ski them a lot.

This winter, I'm considering ditching the alpine boots altogether for the Titans, and getting something actually lightweight for touring, because I'm pretty sure I can get used to having a little(or a lot) less boot, especially when it comes to skiing in the BC and wanting to feel accustomed to my gear. A few of the guys i most admire as skiers get a pair of touring boots and ski the piss out of them every day, all winter, and get so accustomed to those boots it doesn't matter to them that they arent' in race boots anymore. For what its worth, one of them skied Quadrants for much of last winter and loved them...


Hahahaha um... I guess I needed that? Thanks for the info. I already knew I couldn't count on a touring boot to ski like a race boot, but I'm trying to get as close as possible so thanks. Usually for my feet I have to just find a last *almost* wide enough for my 6th toe bones then stretch a pocket for them, then stretch the insteps and to box so fit is pretty subjective, nothing fits my bony-ass feet EVER- so it's always been a "close enough" battle. I also watched last year as several friends skied AT boots comfortably all year and loved them once they got used to the flex so yeah, same boat. I'm willing to give up some stiffness and forward lean, but not all of it. Maybe I asked the wrong question and it should have been...

"If I like stiff boots w a lot of forward lean and I want to DYNA tour, what should I be shopping for?" As If I'm going to be using them as much as I think I will, I want to give up as little as possible for the new comfort and mobility, y'know?

[DoWork]

^^^^^ Christopher - classic! can i use some of those quotes in reviews? I'm going to try some Mobes. Not too interested in trying the BD line of boots unless I have some compelling reason

Just wondering why, if you wouldn't mind elaborating...

[Christopher3000]

^^The lack of substantial forward lean is tougher to get used to than the flex pattern of most AT boots. To me, the Titans were so upright at first that I had a tough time being in the front seat when it came time to start a turn, and when the plastic was still super fresh/stiff, I'd get caught off balance in difficult snow and just sort of ride the back of the cuffs through my turns, rather than properly flexing the boot and weighting the front of the skis. It felt like the "flexed forward" position of the Titans was similar to the "standing in the liftline looking strong" position in my dobermans, and to start the action of flexing the boots from, basically, the edge of the backseat, was tough. By may I think I'd learned a lot about balanced skiing and getting my upper body forward but...

If you have wider/shapely feet try the Radiums and Factor/Quadrant. The Titans are, somehow, narrower than my Nordicas and significantly narrower than my Lange WC130s from 08-09. My friend The Grom has extremely nasty feet with some serious bloody stumps on the typical sixth toe/heel spur areas and was able to fit his Quadrants--and his Radiums before that--quite comfortably with serious boot work.

Another Nice feature with the Radium is that you can modify the walk mode to give you more forward lean...look for advice RE: that on Wildsnow.com, a place with as much information about AT boots as TGR has info on skidding turns in the backseat for your photogg, ensuring celibacy in ski towns, ski fashion for beer gutted, middle aged office monkeys, etc.

[mc_roon]

Which brings me to my second point about touring boots. If you don't ski them often, they will always suck. By this I mean, if you ski seven days a week, one day a week in some floppy Factors will frustrate you. If you ski on the weekends, taking out your touring gear twice a month will suck big time. These boots all ski much, much better after they've been flexed for about 30 days of skiing, and they are much more predictable feeling if you make yourself ski them a lot.

This winter, I'm considering ditching the alpine boots altogether for the Titans, and getting something actually lightweight for touring, because I'm pretty sure I can get used to having a little(or a lot) less boot, especially when it comes to skiing in the BC and wanting to feel accustomed to my gear. A few of the guys i most admire as skiers get a pair of touring boots and ski the piss out of them every day, all winter, and get so accustomed to those boots it doesn't matter to them that they arent' in race boots anymore. For what its worth, one of them skied Quadrants for much of last winter and loved them...


some serious truth here. An excellent fitting AT boot is far superior to a shitty fitting 150 flex racing boot. There are now AT boots on the market that are sturdy enough, at least in my experience, to be true daily drivers.

Yes, there is an adjustment period, and yes, they will never be as responsive as your plug boots were. But i skied my factors 100+ days last season and loved every minute of it. And always having a walk mode available doesnt hurt either.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

DoWork, touring boots are all pretty high volume. Older Scarpas are cavernous and also have a 4mm boot board that can be removed for even more space. The Mobe may be a bit more reasonable in its dimmensions.

Radiums are pretty wide, especially in the heels, but lower over the instep than others. The liners are tight and Garmont liners have always had a reputation for sucking.

Titans have very thick liners, which seem to work for skinny feet. They are a great shell fit on me, but I couldn't get my foot in the liner with the liner in the boot. I use mine with Intuitions and they accommodate my fairly wide feet just fine. People have had the same issue with Radiums- baking the liner isn't always enough to make enough space around the toes, even though the shell seems big enough.

I think Radiums/Titans/Skookums/ and most likely Mobes are all damn good boots, but the first two may benefit from an additional purchase of liners if you're going for a performance fit.

Radiums have the most forward lean, but I bet all boots could be modified for more.

What shell size are you? I can bring my 27.5's to Ullrfest if you want to check shell fit. You might be able to try on a few different models if you put out a request.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

This winter, I'm considering ditching the alpine boots altogether for the Titans, and getting something actually lightweight for touring.

I did this last year. I picked up some Dynafit Zzero 2's for $100 on ebay last spring and used them for skiing alone and with my dog. I'm sure their performance is not close to the TLT5 or Maestrale, but they work fine with smaller skis, and skin and hike like a dream. They weigh a bit less than F3's, and have a low cuff and a soft forward flex, but man are they are joy going up.

[DoWork]

Wow, some great info from Chris3k... Thanks dude!

[laseranimal]

DW

Chris3k summed up beautifully what I'd been trying to say. If you're looking for plug boot stiff low tech compatible touring boots they don't exist and your going to waste a ton of time and money trying to find that holy grail.

I think you're going to be much happier compromising a touch on ski stiffness, dialing back the speedometer a click or two and picking a solid AT boot for touring and keep your Langes for dick waving

[JayPowHound]

I skied Scarpa Typhoon's everyday last season including all of the eastern Freeride Comp's and honestly I didn't have any complaints. While they definitely took a few days to break in / get used to, I ended up really enjoying them. They're not 'fiddle compatible so not really a relevant option here but I just thought I would share my story of success moving from a traditional alpine boot (Techinca Magnesium) to a three-piece tourer for every day lift-serviced skiing.







They're also good for this :wink:
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs082.snc3/15027_1440716898169_1240443517_31253093_7262477_n. jpg