McCain/Palin up 10 on Obama/bin Biden

[Big Balls]

According to latest USA Today/Gallup poll.

[Steven S. Dallas]

Four points. (http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-09-07-poll_N.htm)

Nice math skills though.

[Big Balls]

Ten points. (http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-09-07-poll_N.htm)

Nice READING skills though.

[timvwcom]

Only "morans" would think ONE poll means very much... the only REAL way to see what is happening is to view the variety of info/data here; http://www.pollster.com/

The current "poll" info looks like this; (Edit: this is an active link... the graph will be current each time this thread is viewed)

http://www.pollster.com/08USPresGEMvO600.png

just so you don't think there is too little "data" behind this graph, please click here (http://www.pollster.com/polls/us/08-us-pres-ge-mvo.php) to load the HUNDREDS of polls amalgamated to create this work.


The current "electoral votes" info looks like this;

http://www.timvw.com/whooohooo/pollster_ec_9-7-08.jpg

and click here (http://www.pollster.com/) for the specifics... remember it takes 270 to win.

[Big Balls]

Ok first of all FL, NC, VA, ND, and MT are NOT tossups, those are all either McCain likely or solidly McCain (or in the case of MT solidly Palin :) ). Second of all all polls are not created equal. The only polls worth paying attention to are Zogby, Rasmuesen, and Gallup (in this case it was a USA Today/Gallup poll). All the others are a joke. Those 3 will rountinely be within 1 point of each where as all the others have 16 point disparities between them. They are just all over the place. I've been following polls closely for 8 years now and those are the only 3 worth paying attention to. So the fact that Pollster.com uses hundreds of polls for data is not testament to how accurate it is but testament to how inaccurate it is. Right now McCain/Palin is up either 4 point, 6 points or 10 points depending on who you go by......... Oh, I also find it funny how that site has PA SOLIDLY Democrat when virtually every other place (including both campaigns) consider it a big tossup.

[timvwcom]

Soooo... all the polling companies haven't called you yet? I'd have thought they would recognize yer genius from posts just like this long ago.

[Big Balls]

Soooo... all the polling companies haven't called you yet? I'd have thought they would recognize yer genius from posts just like this long ago.

As a single white college educated male I don't think I'd give the pollsters much of a surprise.

[doughboyshredder]

Ten points. (http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-09-07-poll_N.htm)

Nice READING skills though.



McCain leads Democrat Barack Obama by 50%-46% among registered voters, the Republican's biggest advantage since January and a turnaround from the USA TODAY poll taken just before the convention opened in St. Paul. Then, he lagged by 7 percentage points.

Copied from your link, Genius

[timvwcom]

...Second of all all polls are not created equal. The only polls worth paying attention to are Zogby, Rasmuesen, and Gallup (in this case it was a USA Today/Gallup poll). All the others are a joke. Those 3 will rountinely be within 1 point of each where as all the others have 16 point disparities between them. They are just all over the place. I've been following polls closely for 8 years now and those are the only 3 worth paying attention to...


As a single white college educated male I don't think I'd give the pollsters much of a surprise.

Sooooo... would a college edumucated male believe in scientific methods? If he would, we are in luck!!! Turns out that someone has gone back over 129 different electoral contests since 2000, for contests that include President, Senate, Governor and the Presidential primaries... and actually found out who has been the most accurate. I'll include all the "scientific crap" after the results, but here they are;

http://www.timvw.com/whooohooo/polling_accuracy.jpg

You can peruse it yerself here; http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/05/pollster-ratings-v311.html, but since I'm such a nice guy, I've posted it here too.


Full Methodological Description

I presently have a database of 171 different electoral contests since 2000 that have been surveyed by at least three of the 32 pollsters that I include in my study. These include contests for President, Senate and Governor, as well as polls from the presidential primaries. A poll is included if (i) it is the last poll that an agency put out before the election; (ii) it was released no later than two weeks from the election date.

My goal is to isolate the instance of methodological error, or what I call Pollster-Introduced Error (PIE). If you look at a poll at any given time before an election, there are essentially three different sources of error:

Total Error = Sampling Error + Temporal Error + PIE

Sampling Error is the error that pollsters typically report in their margin of error calculations -- the error intrinsic to sampling only a subset of the entire voting population. All polls have sampling error, though of course a pollster can reduce it by including more interviews in its sample.

Temporal Error is the error introduced by taking a poll weeks or months before an election. Temporal Error is a major consideration now, in April, when we are looking at polls of the November general election; many things can happen between now and then, and (contrary to the common perception) it is not up to the pollster to predict the future. Temporal Error is incorporated into our model in terms of the uncertainty we build into our estimates. For purposes of the pollster ratings, however, we can ignore Temporal Error (that is, assume it to be zero), because we are limiting our evaluation to polls taken very near to the election date.

That leaves us with our final source of error, Pollster-Introduced Error. PIE is what a tennis aficionado might call "Unforced Error"; it is error that results from poor methodology. As a matter of practice, all pollsters have some PIE, which is why the actual margins of error are always larger than those espoused by the pollster. However, this amount varies fairly significantly from agency to agency -- which is the impetus for producing these ratings.

To find the PIE, we will first calculate the Total Error for each pollster, and then deduct its Sampling Error. We begin with a calculation called the Raw Total Error (RTE), which is simply the average number of 'points' by which a pollster missed the final margin in a given contest, weighted by the number of pollsters that surveyed that contest. We then compare this against what we call the Iterated Average Error (IAE), which is average error for other pollsters that surveyed the same contest, as determined by a multiple iteration method. This step is functionally equivalent to that which we employed in Version 2.0 of our pollster analysis and is described at greater length there. We then subtract the IAE from the RTE to produce a +/- rating. A negative rating means that the pollster outperformed its peers, while a positive rating means that it underperformed. The +/- score for each pollster in our database is indicated


Turns out these same people ALSO are keeping track of electoral votes... Here's what they show as of Sunday;

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3082/2837147206_9a773833cf_o.png http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3260/2836313575_447569c72f_o.png


And their version of the poll amalgamation;

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3169/2837147304_aab0cca2ce_o.jpg


And I know YOU are the expert and all... but maybe you could stop by the FAQs and see how THEY "measure" the polls; http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/03/frequently-asked-questions-last-revised.html

[PappaG]

Oh, I also find it funny how that site has PA SOLIDLY Democrat when virtually every other place (including both campaigns) consider it a big tossup.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/pa/pennsylvania_mccain_vs_obama-244.html

VA is a dead heat right now as well, and without that, OH, and CO, McCain doesn't win.

[Dirty Hoar]

Ahh.. polls. You can only poll who you can reach.

Who are they polling? How old are these lists? What's the ratio between dems with only a cell phone and Repubs with only a cell phone?

Pollsters don't call cell phones. I think it's safe to say the majority of the millions of newly registered democratic voters are young and do not have a home phone.

Hmmmmm...

[advres]

I think it's safe to say the majority of the millions of newly registered democratic voters are stupid...

Fixed that for you. :D

In all seriousness though, why did you put democratic in there? Your argument would have been as true if you just said newly registered voters and you wouldn't have sounded like a butthirt liberal looking for hope. :FIREdevil

[Big Balls]

Copied from your link, Genius

Copied from my link genius.

"In the new poll, taken Friday through Sunday, McCain leads Obama by 54%-44% among those seen as most likely to vote. The survey of 1,022 adults, including 959 registered voters, has a margin of error of +/— 3 points for both samples.

[Tippster]

Think, Advres.

McCain isn't exactly bustin' it up on campus. Most students have cellphones, not landlines, so are harder (if not impossible) to poll. Then again most don't bother voting in the end, so it's usually a wash. This election could be different, however.

[Dirty Hoar]

Fixed that for you. :D

In all seriousness though, why did you put democratic in there? Your argument would have been as true if you just said newly registered voters and you wouldn't have sounded like a butthirt liberal looking for hope. :FIREdevil

Ya, I thought of that but the proportion of newly registered democratic voters greatly overwhelms the same for the republicans.

Looking for hope? Not exactly. I'm just pointing out a fact that every republican should really worry about. Time to tighten up those blinders advres. ;)

[Cliff Huckable]

I can't believe any of you still put any faith in polls.

[TruckeeLocal]

Think, Advres.

McCain isn't exactly bustin' it up on campus. Most students have cellphones, not landlines, so are harder (if not impossible) to poll. Then again most don't bother voting in the end, so it's usually a wash. This election could be different, however.
Reality check. Students are NOT likely voters. They're still recovering on a Tuesday from the ravages of the weekend. Hence them getting undersampled is hardly an issue.

[advres]

The real thing funny about this is you people believe anything is going to change if Obama wins. No matter who wins, I will live pretty much the same life.

[Big Balls]

I find it funny how I say "hey look at this widely respected poll done yesterday showing McCain up 10 points", and you guys say "oh yeah, look at this electoral map based upon state to state polling done WEEKS ago". Or you say, "oh yeah, well history has proven that this poll is off by a whopping 1.8 points on average". So lets say you give Obama the margin of error AND an additional 2 points McCain is still whooping him. And I don't see how I should have to argue electoral maps based on state to state polling when most state specific polling is only done every couple weeks. Some of the latest polling on some toss up states are over a month old!

[TeleHoar]

I recieved a poll call on my cell phone last thurs.
Their first question after I agreed to take the poll was "Are you, or any member of your family, employed by a newspaper or TV/Radio station?"

Me; "Why yes...I work for a radio station."
Them: "Oh...Thank you for your time"...click

WTF? are media types just presumed liberal, or were they afraid I would talk about this on the air? (I did anyway) or try to slant the poll #'s.

Anyway, a PSA if you don't want to be bothered by pollsters. Tell em you're with the media.

[Adolf Allerbush]

I find it funny how I say "hey look at this widely respected poll done yesterday showing McCain up 10 points", and you guys say "oh yeah, look at this electoral map based upon state to state polling done WEEKS ago". Or you say, "oh yeah, well history has proven that this poll is off by a whopping 1.8 points on average". So lets say you give Obama the margin of error AND an additional 2 points McCain is still whooping him. And I don't see how I should have to argue electoral maps based on state to state polling when most state specific polling is only done every couple weeks. Some of the latest polling on some toss up states are over a month old!

I think it's funny that you can't read well or that you refuse to read what the poll actually says that you referenced:


McCain leads Democrat Barack Obama by 50%-46% among registered voters, the Republican's biggest advantage since January and a turnaround from the USA TODAY poll taken just before the convention opened in St. Paul. Then, he lagged by 7 percentage points.

Are you intentionally being dense or are you simple very dumb?

[GrizzlyFD]

^^^OMG how many times does this have to go back and forth...the NEW POLL is down the page and is done via most likely voters... READ more than just a few lines:



In the new poll, taken Friday through Sunday, McCain leads Obama by 54%-44% among those seen as most likely to vote. The survey of 1,022 adults, including 959 registered voters, has a margin of error of +/— 3 points for both samples.

[timvwcom]

I find it funny how I say "hey look at this widely respected poll done yesterday showing McCain up 10 points", and you guys say "oh yeah, look at this electoral map based upon state to state polling done WEEKS ago". Or you say, "oh yeah, well history has proven that this poll is off by a whopping 1.8 points on average". So lets say you give Obama the margin of error AND an additional 2 points McCain is still whooping him. And I don't see how I should have to argue electoral maps based on state to state polling when most state specific polling is only done every couple weeks. Some of the latest polling on some toss up states are over a month old!

ACTUALLY... you said exactly "McCain/Palin up 10 on Obama/bin Biden" and "According to latest USA Today/Gallup poll."

Soooo... when you say McCain is "up" on Obama by "10"... we just pointed out that one poll does not the truth make... what's so unusual about that?

Of course, THEN you go and make a idiotic claim that only 3 polling companies are "worth paying attention to" and that "All the others are a joke"... and I hand you your ass. That was simple too...

Now get back to other productive thrunting here abouts and stop whining like a baby. :rolleyes2

[Big Balls]

I think it's funny that you can't read well or that you refuse to read what the poll actually says that you referenced:



Are you intentionally being dense or are you simple very dumb?

Haha! OMG you are so dumb. You obviously are reading neither the article nor this thread. I suggest you fully read one of the two (or god forbid both) before you make incredibly stupid insights on both. I'd point out your oversight but I have already done this twice already!

[timvwcom]

All of you are idiots...

SAME POLL, DIFFERENT GROUPS...

"by 50%-46% among registered voters" & "by 54%-44% among those seen as most likely to vote"

[Adolf Allerbush]

Haha! OMG you are so dumb. You obviously are reading neither the article nor this thread. I suggest you fully read one of the two (or god forbid both) before you make incredibly stupid insights on both. I'd point out your oversight but I have already done this twice already!

HEHE! I know dood! The first sentance of the article says McCain leads by 50% to 46%!


Sept. 8 (Bloomberg) -- Republican presidential candidate John McCain leads Democratic contender Barack Obama by 50 percent to 46 percent among registered voters, according to a weekend USA Today/Gallup Poll, USA Today reported.

The surge in enthusiasm following the selection of McCain's running mate Sarah Palin marks a turnaround from the poll taken just before the Republican convention opened in St. Paul when he lagged by 7 percentage points, the newspaper reported.

The new poll, taken Friday though Sunday, shows McCain leading Obama by 54 percent to 44 percent among people most likely to vote and was conducted among 1,022 adults, including 959 registered voters, with a margin of error of plus or minus 3 points for both samples, the newspaper said.

Teehee! I can see what you're saying but the bottom line is that the poll that you have quoted says 50-46...Golly jee you're unsmart.

[ArmadaBC]

Oh, I also find it funny how that site has PA SOLIDLY Democrat when virtually every other place (including both campaigns) consider it a big tossup.

I know your a dick face troll but I don't care, PA will go to Obama. Philly and Pittsburgh almost always cancel out the rest of the state and Obama will really kill it in Philadelphia.

[Crud's Uncle]

Talk with a friend from southern Ohio. He is a friend of our liberal Governor Strickland. He said that he thinks Palin has made a big impact on democrats and that they are displeased that Obama shafted Hillary. Strickland was a big Hillary supporter and a rumored VP pick if she won the nomination.

If it holds true, Obama will not win Ohio nor the election.

[PappaG]

Reality check. Students are NOT likely voters. They're still recovering on a Tuesday from the ravages of the weekend. Hence them getting undersampled is hardly an issue.
From the last presidential election (http://www.census.gov/prod/2006pubs/p20-556.pdf), 44% of non-voting college kids didn't care and 24% missed the registration deadline. Of those that did register, 23% were too busy to even cast their vote, 13% were out of town and didn't vote, and another 10% registered but didn't feel like doing anything else besides that.

[Hutch]

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/09/07/opinion/07rich_large.jpg

[TruckeeLocal]

From the last presidential election (http://www.census.gov/prod/2006pubs/p20-556.pdf), 44% of non-voting college kids didn't care and 24% missed the registration deadline. Of those that did register, 23% were too busy to even cast their vote, 13% were out of town and didn't vote, and another 10% registered but didn't feel like doing anything else besides that.
Yeh, I did some analysis for the election. Strangely when you match the registration against the demographic data you find a higher proportion of under-35s are registered than old(er) folks. But they DON'T VOTE. Why ? Because at least here in California voter registration is linked up with getting a driver's license. So kids get their license, say "what the hell", and register while they're at it, and then leave the nest, never to re-register. Why should they ? From their perspective it's just Hobson's choice between old folks who don't care about their interests. So their voter stuff is with mommy and daddy who are only good for laundry and top-up funding and the first Tuesday in November isn't a good time for them to require either.

[Jer]

It's funny how if Obama were ahead in the polls all the Obamazombies would be starting a dozen posts about it, but when McCain is ahead it doesn't mean anything and is no big deal. I suppose when McCain/Palin wins in Nov it will be no big deal as well.

[loJack]

He said that he thinks Palin has made a big impact on democrats and that they are displeased that Obama shafted Hillary. that is funny.

[Powow]

It's funny how if Obama were ahead in the polls all the Obamazombies would be starting a dozen posts about it, but when McCain is ahead it doesn't mean anything and is no big deal. I suppose when McCain/Palin wins in Nov it will be no big deal as well.
You are delusional. Obama was ahead for months, and I didn't see a single post about it. This is the first poll related post I've ever seen on these forums.

[Rubicon]

You are delusional. Obama was ahead for months,


You are right, he was. How many times have you seen the early front runner in a presidential race end up winning in Nov? :tdo13:

[timvwcom]

You are right, he was. How many times have you seen the early front runner in a presidential race end up winning in Nov? :tdo13:

Do you really think Hillary still has a chance? :eek:

[David Witherspoon]

Talk with a friend from southern Ohio.
Your friends are almost as stupid as you are.

[advres]

Do you really think Hillary still has a chance? :eek:

http://www.lolwut.com/layout/lolwut.jpg

[Rubicon]

Do you really think Hillary still has a chance? :eek:

Obama drops Biden after realizing the crusty old white dude wasn't going to give him the bounce in the polls he was expecting and takes Hillary as his new running mate to counter Palin then gets knocked off by some methed out white supremacist posing as a campaign staffer a week before the general...

It could happen.

[timvwcom]

Don't see a better spot to add this... so will do so here;


Polls Show Close Presidential Race In The Swing States (http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/09/polls_show_close_presidential.php)

By Eric Kleefeld - September 8, 2008, 10:17PM

A new set of Rasmussen polls, all conducted yesterday in the middle of John McCain's post-convention bounce, suggests that this race remains close on the state-by-state level.

• In Colorado (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/colorado/election_2008_colorado_presidential_election), Obama leads by a 49%-46% margin, actually an improvement for him since McCain's 49%-48% edge three weeks ago. Both results are within the margin of error.

• In Florida (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/florida/election_2008_florida_presidential_election), the race is tied 48%-48%, compared to a 48%-46% McCain edge from about three weeks ago.

• In Ohio (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/ohio/election_2008_ohio_presidential_election), McCain leads 51%-44%, compared to a 48%-43% lead for McCain from almost three weeks ago. Rasmussen has been the most favorable pollster for McCain in Ohio.

• In Pennsylvania (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/pennsylvania/election_2008_pennsylvania_presidential_election2) , Obama has a slim 47%-45% edge, not significantly different from his 48%-45% lead two and a half weeks ago.

• In Virginia (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/virginia/election_2008_virginia_presidential_election), McCain has a 49%-47% lead, not significantly changed from a 48%-47% McCain lead from over three weeks ago.

All five polls were conducted yesterday, and have a ±4.5 margin of error except for the Ohio survey, which has a ±4% margin error.

Separately, a new SurveyUSA poll (http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=30939022-fb4c-4e07-bd5b-aa6f9d18d6df) of Virginia conducted this past Friday gives McCain an identical 49%-47% lead, with a ±3.7% margin of error. This is also not significantly changed from a 48%-47% McCain edge from over three weeks ago.

[Crud's Uncle]

Hey moron, he is a democrat like you. Can't wait to see you trying to figure out what happened on election day. Your arrogance is only exceeded by your lack of wisdom.
Your friends are almost as stupid as you are.

[David Witherspoon]

You didn't read the "almost," did you?

Oh, I forgot. So sad. Illiteracy is such a tragedy. Even for those who can fake it in most situations - you know, you see them in their Hummers, pretending to read the Wall Street Journal ... while holding it upside down.

There is help (http://www.ldanatl.org/aboutld/adults/index.asp)!

[GordonShumway]

Talk with a friend from southern Ohio. He is a friend of our liberal Governor Strickland. He said that he thinks Palin has made a big impact on democrats and that they are displeased that Obama shafted Hillary. Strickland was a big Hillary supporter and a rumored VP pick if she won the nomination.

If it holds true, Obama will not win Ohio nor the election.

I talked to a guy who knows a dude in Japan who's friends with Godzilla who said there's a big movement to write in Mothra as the next POTUS. When Mothra wins he's going to rage on all you libro-douches and take your HOPE and DREAMS and roll them into a tube and shove them in your ass. That's what I heard

[Cono Este]

It's funny how if Obama were ahead in the polls all the Obamazombies would be starting a dozen posts about it, but when McCain is ahead it doesn't mean anything and is no big deal. I suppose when McCain/Palin wins in Nov it will be no big deal as well.

Actually no. We blame the party that wins around here not the one that loses time and time again.

[Big Balls]

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/politics&id=6380065

Yep, North Carolina is really a "toss up" :rolleyes:

But the way Obama is getting clubbered he probably should consider 20 points as a tossup as I think thats now "close" for him.

[timvwcom]

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/politics&id=6380065

Yep, North Carolina is really a "toss up" :rolleyes:

But the way Obama is getting clubbered he probably should consider 20 points as a tossup as I think thats now "close" for him.


...The only polls worth paying attention to are Zogby, Rasmuesen, and Gallup (in this case it was a USA Today/Gallup poll). All the others are a joke...

But this was a Survey USA poll, I thought it was a "joke" polling co, no?

[Big Balls]

But this was a Survey USA poll, I thought it was a "joke" polling co, no?

No no no, according to you it is a highly accurate and historical correct poll :)

[philippeR]

Yeh, I did some analysis for the election. Strangely when you match the registration against the demographic data you find a higher proportion of under-35s are registered than old(er) folks. But they DON'T VOTE. Why ? Because at least here in California voter registration is linked up with getting a driver's license. So kids get their license, say "what the hell", and register while they're at it, and then leave the nest, never to re-register. Why should they ? From their perspective it's just Hobson's choice between old folks who don't care about their interests. So their voter stuff is with mommy and daddy who are only good for laundry and top-up funding and the first Tuesday in November isn't a good time for them to require either.

You mean, like Advres ?

[philippeR]

The world has voted (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7606100.stm):

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45000000/gif/_45000630_ame_elec_226.gif


Democrat Mr Obama was favoured by a four-to-one margin across the 22,500 people polled in 22 countries.
In 17 countries, the most common view was that US relations with the rest of the world would improve under Mr Obama.

If Republican Mr McCain were elected, the most common view was that relations would remain about the same.
The poll was conducted before the Democratic and Republican parties held their conventions and before the headline-grabbing nomination of Sarah Palin as Mr McCain's running mate.

[Crud's Uncle]

Before the world can vote, they need to take over the USA. Bring it on Frenchies.

Remember France would be a satellite of Germany, if it was not for the USA. Not too afraid of a country that is cowardly to defend itself.

[philippeR]

eh, I didn't see this one coming !

Are you one of those Middle America Dumbfucks I keep hearing about, Dumbfuck ?

[Crud's Uncle]

Better than being a cowardly french fag that bend over for nazis.

[TruckeeLocal]

Better than being a cowardly french fag that bend over for nazis.
I think you'll find that if you review your history America also bent over for the nazis for quite a while too.

[Crud's Uncle]

Sure, Germany occupied the south or was it the north.

[timvwcom]

Before the world can vote, they need to take over the USA. Bring it on Frenchies.

Remember France would be a satellite of Germany, if it was not for the USA. Not too afraid of a country that is cowardly to defend itself.

Actually... without France's help, there is a chance the US could still be a satellite of Great Britain. :rolleyes2

[Big Balls]

eh, I didn't see this one coming !

Are you one of those Middle America Dumbfucks I keep hearing about, Dumbfuck ?

:) I'm starting to like philipper :) ............. still a French asshole though

[Trackhead]

Polls mean nothing.

Wait for the election.

[Jer]

You didn't read the "almost," did you?

Oh, I forgot. So sad. Illiteracy is such a tragedy. Even for those who can fake it in most situations - you know, you see them in their Hummers, pretending to read the Wall Street Journal ... while holding it upside down.

There is help (http://www.ldanatl.org/aboutld/adults/index.asp)!

Guess I'll say it again: Arrogance and stupidity are a dangerous combination.

[Adolf Allerbush]

Guess I'll say it again: Arrogance and stupidity are a dangerous combination.

I don't know if it's dangerous....it's like how your stupidity gets the best of you and you arrogantly say that McCain has this election in the bag.

[Jer]

I don't know if it's dangerous....it's like how your stupidity gets the best of you and you arrogantly say that McCain has this election in the bag.

Well, at least I have balls enough to bet on it. Unlike some ball-less wonders around here.

[TruckeeLocal]

Well, at least I have balls enough to bet on it. Unlike some ball-less wonders around here.

You have balls ? Who knew ?

Remembers ... I tried to ease you in to ski offs on the world famous groomers of Deer Valley.

[Adolf Allerbush]

Well, at least I have balls enough to bet on it. Unlike some ball-less wonders around here.

I don't know what "balls enough" are but I'm pretty sure they can't bet.